Geni and cord question.

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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby BBadger » Sat Mar 09, 2013 6:09 pm

If the transformer/rectifier on your small-device charger can't deal with crappy AC input power (and your house mains aren't the cleanest of power), you should probably buy a better charger anyway.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby EspressoDude » Sun Mar 10, 2013 10:39 am

?? original poster has what appears to be about 90 - 100 watts load. Seems like 1000 watt inverter is way overkill. Harbor Fright has 400 watt inverters for $30 less weekly 20% off coupons. buy two so you have a spare. my first one has been to two burns, and still works, the spare is still unwrapped.

Also seems like a lot of stuff to go from the honda generator internal DC generator and inverter to 120 ac, then a battery charger, battery, inverter, to power dc lights and stereo.

imho
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby junglesmacks » Sun Mar 10, 2013 10:45 am

Overkill FTW.. especially with electrical components. Especially in trying environments. If its built for one rating, a much lower wont make it even break a sweat.

Overbuild EVERYTHING. Especially if you're only talking a few $$.

I'd rather spend $40 extra than be pissed that I didn't when shit doesn't work and I'm stuck in the middle of nowhere with a screaming inverter.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby TomServo » Sun Mar 10, 2013 11:02 am

EspressoDude wrote:?? original poster has what appears to be about 90 - 100 watts load. Seems like 1000 watt inverter is way overkill. Harbor Fright has 400 watt inverters for $30 less weekly 20% off coupons. buy two so you have a spare. my first one has been to two burns, and still works, the spare is still unwrapped.

Also seems like a lot of stuff to go from the honda generator internal DC generator and inverter to 120 ac, then a battery charger, battery, inverter, to power dc lights and stereo.

imho

We opted for a 2000 watt Honda EU instead. Read my signature! No..at $600 we couldn't pass it up. Especially, since you can splice two EU generators together...for the hot tub...next year.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby BBadger » Mon Mar 11, 2013 7:09 am

EspressoDude wrote:Also seems like a lot of stuff to go from the honda generator internal DC generator and inverter to 120 ac, then a battery charger, battery, inverter, to power dc lights and stereo.


There definitely is a lot in that chain of power, but it's kind of like pumping water up into a water tower so that you don't have to turn on a pump every time you want to open the faucet.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby tattoogoddess » Thu Mar 14, 2013 2:45 pm

junglesmacks wrote:One last thing.. the 120v inverter that you connect to the battery in order to plug everything in!

You can do your own searching, but get at least a 1000W (continuous) inverter if you can but make sure to look at the continuous and peak ratings together. The one below is 1000W continuous/2000W peak.

You're getting the gist of this, right? Run your things off of the battery/inverter. When the battery gets low, charge it with the generator.

Cobra CPI1000 - $80 - Amazon
Image



Would this one be ok? Want to get 2, 400 is a lot more then we need .
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby Captain Goddammit » Thu Mar 14, 2013 2:53 pm

At that price, why not... it should handle what you've described. Hell I have an 800-watt and a 1200-watt inverter on my MV already but I might grab a couple of those little things myself and split the load between them just so I have disposable units that I can subject to the corrosive playa and not cry when they die.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby tattoogoddess » Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:00 pm

Yeah 2 as one back up. Now what do I use to attach the battery to the inverter? It's just those bar wire plugs. I'm making an amazon buy list so links to stuff there would be very helpful
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby Captain Goddammit » Thu Mar 14, 2013 4:34 pm

You just need wire, big fat wire. The smaller the gauge number, the bigger the wire is. 10 gauge will probably be fine for what you're doing. If you figure on using it at full capacity ever, go with 8 gauge wire.
The inverter has terminals on it that you can put the wire ends (with just enough insulation stripped off to allow contact but not so much that you have excess bare wire hanging out) into and screw them down tight.
At the battery, if you get a deep-cycle style battery or so-called "marine" battery it will have threaded posts on it. The threaded posts will have wing nuts on them. the best thing is to put some ring terminals on the wire ends. You can get them at an auto parts store or maybe even Home Depot.
If you just get a regular car battery, you can put regular battery-post clamps on it, and use the bolts on them to attach your inverter wires.

These ring terminals ought to be fine: http://www.amazon.com/Stinger-Gauge-Cri ... +terminals

You could also just get one of these kits sold as car stereo amplifier wiring kits, it'll have everything you need to hook up power to your inverter, like this one or any similar kit: http://www.amazon.com/American-Accessor ... gauge+wire
Last edited by Captain Goddammit on Thu Mar 14, 2013 4:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby junglesmacks » Thu Mar 14, 2013 4:47 pm

tattoogoddess wrote:Yeah 2 as one back up. Now what do I use to attach the battery to the inverter? It's just those bar wire plugs. I'm making an amazon buy list so links to stuff there would be very helpful



It should come with attachment wires. The picture most likely doesn't show them just to keep it clean looking. Get the unit first and see what it comes with.

Zhust wrote:Good luck with a "modified sine" inverter.


Yeah.. because uh.. all the hundreds of thousands of people that are/have been using them for years now must be doing it wrong.. :roll:
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby tattoogoddess » Thu Mar 14, 2013 5:59 pm

Hey also how do you plug the geni into that volt thing? Can see where or what is used. 110 plug?
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby junglesmacks » Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:17 pm

tattoogoddess wrote:Hey also how do you plug the geni into that volt thing? Can see where or what is used. 110 plug?


Huh? Clarify.


Are you asking how the inverter connects to the battery charger? If so, the genny has a 110v plug on it. You plug in the charger just like you're plugging it into a wall socket.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby tattoogoddess » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:10 pm

No the geni to the volt monitor thing (that damn contraption used when charging the battery. ) lol
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby junglesmacks » Fri Mar 15, 2013 7:59 am

tattoogoddess wrote:No the geni to the volt monitor thing (that damn contraption used when charging the battery. ) lol


There's no "volt monitor" that I'm aware of. You would be talking about the battery charger.. which has a built in volt monitor and will shut off when the battery is fully charged.

Side note: Don't skimp on the rating of the battery charger since you'll want to get it done as quickly as possible and shut the genny off to save fuel. That digital 100A unit that I linked is your best bet for the $$ from what I've seen..
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby Zhust » Fri Mar 15, 2013 11:11 am

BBadger wrote:If the transformer/rectifier on your small-device charger can't deal with crappy AC input power (and your house mains aren't the cleanest of power), you should probably buy a better charger anyway.


Exactly. If you're out there and you here a pop in the night and find you iPod permanently off, you can always just take a quick trip to Radio Shack.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby BeachBum » Fri Mar 15, 2013 12:59 pm

tattoogoddess,

Thanks for bringing up your original question, and thanks for asking your followup questions. You're probably like the vast majority of people, very few anymore have the knowledge about electrical stuff like this, so you have absolutely nothing to be hesitant about, you're similar to the majority nowadays. Most people follow the maxim, "Better to keep quiet and leave people unsure about whether you know anything about a subject, rather than speak and remove all doubt." But, you have questions, and ask them. Thank you for doing this!

It's good feedback to ones that are familiar with electrical stuff to know how much of what is communicated is actually understood by the recipient. And, it's good feedback for understanding why most BRC theme camps are so dark and so quiet unless a generator is actually running. Only a small percentage of people understand how simple it is to hook up a battery to an inverter to a stereo and LED lights, yet most of the respondents on threads such as this one just erroneously assume that it's basic knowledge.

Another good feedback from your thread is why people go out and get a generator for the playa, when what they want to do could easily be done with a battery/inverter, and just figuring out how to recharge the battery once or twice during the week. It's that people just automatically think "generator" for power, and are focused on getting a generator, without realizing that there are cheaper ways of doing so and that the other methods may provide a better solution (longer hours of use, and quieter).

Thanks again, and best wishes.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby Rice » Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:14 pm

tattoogoddess wrote:Yeah 2 as one back up. Now what do I use to attach the battery to the inverter? It's just those bar wire plugs. I'm making an amazon buy list so links to stuff there would be very helpful

The simplest way of hooking an inverter to a car-style battery is alligator clips.
Image

Just make sure you have really heavy gauge wire (as others have said, the lower the gauge # the thicker the wire). Something in 10 or 8 gauge is good. (check the inverter and see how many amps it draws from the 12V feed and ensure that everything going to the battery is at least that amp rating! If it has a higher amp rating, that is fine [better to have more current capability than less]).


If you can, have the power cables from the inverter directly connected to the battery. A lighter plug will possibly reduce the available current and could give you grief (not always, but if it is rated for less amperage it might cause "inverter squeeling", aka not enough power for what you are using).

YMMV

like such:

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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby tattoogoddess » Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:29 pm

Yep that's what I was needing but this remains a question


How do you hook the geni to this? I know from this to the battery is the clamps but geni to this....
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby Rice » Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:33 pm

tattoogoddess wrote:Yep that's what I was needing but this remains a question


How do you hook the geni to this? I know from this to the battery is the clamps but geni to this....
Image

Oh, that probably has a power charging cord that can be plugged directly into the 110V power plug (Like plugging it into your wall socket at home) It will probably have a 3 prong power plug...
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby tattoogoddess » Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:51 pm

Never mind. Was able to find a video about it :) http://youtu.be/cg1ExP6IMrk
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby ygmir » Fri Mar 15, 2013 2:51 pm

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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby EspressoDude » Sun Mar 17, 2013 5:14 pm

tattoogoddess wrote:Yep that's what I was needing but this remains a question


How do you hook the geni to this? I know from this to the battery is the clamps but geni to this....
Image



I thought the clamps were for personal gratification..
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby Jackass » Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:41 pm

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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby AntiM » Mon Mar 25, 2013 5:31 am

"Remove cats" :lol:
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby tattoogoddess » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:05 pm

ok so i need help again.
the two red balls are the disco balls i was talking about.
the yellow are extension cords( roughly 15 foot one) x 2
the purple thing is a power strip
the red lines are Christmas lights. (led) 30-40 feet
the blue thing is the battery and the 400 watt inverter

one- what gauge? is 14 ok?
two- does it matter what power strip I use?
three with all of this plugged in will I be ok?

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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby Zhust » Thu Apr 25, 2013 9:55 am

tattoogoddess wrote:one- what gauge? is 14 ok?
two- does it matter what power strip I use?
three with all of this plugged in will I be ok?


Everything you described is somewhere around 200 watts of power all told. At 120V, that's around 2 amps. If you put both extension cords in line, 30' and calculated the total resistance up-and-back (60 feet), 14 gauge cable would be about 0.18 ohms. At 2 amps, that's 0.36 volts lost in the wire, so if you put exactly 120 volts in, you'd get 119.64 volts out. If you went with even cheaper 16-gauge, the resistance would be about 0.28 volts, and you'd lose 0.56 volts in the wire.

So yeah, 14 gauge is plenty.

And likewise, the amount of power would be no trouble for even the cheapest power strips.

Of course, I still stand by my complaint of modified-sine inverters, I'm sure the disco ball motors will run hot, and I bet at least one of them will fail if you try and run it all night. ... we shall see.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby tattoogoddess » Fri Dec 13, 2013 12:07 am

Ok so realize I never reported back. That Schumacher thing. Fucking sucked!!! It dies the first day. We took it apart and everything. Never wanted to turn back on. Had it set right and everything. It charges it a bit then just stopped at the last 20%. Something we did wrong?
Next year looks like it will be strictly genis
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby GreyCoyote » Fri Dec 13, 2013 6:21 am

I have that same charger. Never had a problem, even charging four 110 AH deep cycle batts in parallel. But they are picky when you try to charge small batteries or batteries with a weak or low cell.

Something else: that charger will continue to charge even after it says "done" if the battery needs it. So keeping it connected isnt a bad idea. As long as it isnt flashing all 888, its still working and doing its job.

Regardless, the geni is the way to go. The honda also has an 8-amp 12v unregulated charger built in. :mrgreen:
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby EspressoDude » Sun Dec 15, 2013 9:20 pm

tattoogoddess wrote:ok so i need help again.
the two red balls are the disco balls i was talking about.
the yellow are extension cords( roughly 15 foot one) x 2
the purple thing is a power strip
the red lines are Christmas lights. (led) 30-40 feet
the blue thing is the battery and the 400 watt inverter

one- what gauge? is 14 ok?
two- does it matter what power strip I use?
three with all of this plugged in will I be ok?

Image



as mentioned earlier, 14 or 16 ga is ok for 120v wiring. 400watt inverter will only put out at most 6 -8 amps before shut down. Battery to inverter needs to be BIG WIRE 8 or 6 ga.
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Re: Geni and cord question.

Postby tattoogoddess » Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:54 am

GreyCoyote wrote:I have that same charger. Never had a problem, even charging four 110 AH deep cycle batts in parallel. But they are picky when you try to charge small batteries or batteries with a weak or low cell.

Something else: that charger will continue to charge even after it says "done" if the battery needs it. So keeping it connected isnt a bad idea. As long as it isnt flashing all 888, its still working and doing its job.

Regardless, the geni is the way to go. The honda also has an 8-amp 12v unregulated charger built in. :mrgreen:


These were brand new batteries. Only used once for 6-8 hours with the inverter I was told to get here. The battery dropped below 12v so we charged. Said 20% left to charge then stayed there. The thing got hot and we un plugged it. Never turned back on.
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