YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other thoughts.

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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby tamarakay » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:10 pm

jkisha wrote:You know, this thread gets me more angry every time I just read the title. Fuck you OP! My theme camp IS IMPORTANT! It's important to me and to all of the members of our camp that bust their asses to pull it off every year. And I'm pretty sure there are a lot of other people that enjoyed being able to have an ice cold root beer float during the heat of the day too! And just the fact that it is important to me and my enjoyment of Burning Man, that's all that counts in my world. So there. I feel a whole lot better now.

Oh, and I would imagine that there are a lot of other people that bust their buts to bring their camps to the desert too and feel the same way about their camps.


Woot! Now get over there and fill out that questionnaire! Your theme camp is important to me too!
Sorry, i just get kinda happy when jkisha gets worked up :D
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby lemur » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:41 pm

it is hard to know if any post mentioning root beer in 2012 is actually a troll/snark/joke or serious..
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby pink » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:28 pm

But he's got root beer floats. Which means ice cream. Which means their camp is MUCH more important than some huge sound camp IMHO.

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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby lemur » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:34 pm

last year we had two people drop off coolers full of ice cream sandwiches ..

it was hard to get rid of them all! we probably had at least 100 of em..

anyways.. i was running the kitchen and i quite enjoyed randomly just remembering 'OH YEAH!!' and then taking a group of villagers to the kitchen to let em grab some..

soo happy they were!!



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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby theCryptofishist » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:46 pm

Colonel Monk wrote:There are certainly alot of elated theme camps out there today...

Which is kinda silly. I bet there aren't going to be lots of tickets for them and they will still have to make difficult choices. It could end up ripping some theme camps apart...
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby motskyroonmatick » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:02 pm

theCryptofishist wrote:
Colonel Monk wrote:There are certainly alot of elated theme camps out there today...

Which is kinda silly. I bet there aren't going to be lots of tickets for them and they will still have to make difficult choices. It could end up ripping some theme camps apart...


Unplaced theme camps are like...... Gr8.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby moonrise » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:03 pm

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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby jkisha » Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:29 am

tamarakay wrote:
jkisha wrote:You know, this thread gets me more angry every time I just read the title. Fuck you OP! My theme camp IS IMPORTANT! It's important to me and to all of the members of our camp that bust their asses to pull it off every year. And I'm pretty sure there are a lot of other people that enjoyed being able to have an ice cold root beer float during the heat of the day too! And just the fact that it is important to me and my enjoyment of Burning Man, that's all that counts in my world. So there. I feel a whole lot better now.

Oh, and I would imagine that there are a lot of other people that bust their buts to bring their camps to the desert too and feel the same way about their camps.


Woot! Now get over there and fill out that questionnaire! Your theme camp is important to me too!
Sorry, i just get kinda happy when jkisha gets worked up :D

Thanks. :D
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby CapnJoe » Fri Feb 17, 2012 4:25 pm

I'll bet you would think a camp was important if you needed a ticket and got one through that camp! What a bunch of whiners. No one can please everyone!
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby clerkkent » Fri Feb 17, 2012 7:28 pm

jkisha wrote:You know, this thread gets me more angry every time I just read the title. Fuck you OP! My theme camp IS IMPORTANT! It's important to me and to all of the members of our camp that bust their asses to pull it off every year. And I'm pretty sure there are a lot of other people that enjoyed being able to have an ice cold root beer float during the heat of the day too! And just the fact that it is important to me and my enjoyment of Burning Man, that's all that counts in my world. So there. I feel a whole lot better now.



Get ready to get angrier. I’ll say it again:
YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT. MY THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT either.


Note the ‘ THAT’ .. a subtle way of pointing out the entitlement that some camps feel they deserve. The ‘BM-BRC is nothing without us’ believers. The ‘We deserve a ticket more than others’ philosophers. If you continue reading the entire post, you would note the “It is nice to have, but not a must have. Yes, you put a lot effort into it.. so did the 200 other theme camps, as well as the other 40,000 burners who dragged their arse to the Playa.” bit. I’m aware how much energy, money and time goes into coordinating a camp, from personal experience. When I go through all the hassle of organizing my theme camp, and get it set up on the playa, I’m hoping to have a good time, but equally important to me is the hope that others will get value and a memorable experience. I want people to come in, hang out, craft something special to them out of the materials provided, and take their dusty creation home and reminisce about their playa experience 365 days a year (that’s my hope at least). All seven days I’m out there I’m thinking to myself “I hope I’m justifying the faith the placement team has in our idea by reserving this spot for our camp.”

The “… the fact that it is important to me and my enjoyment of Burning Man, that's all that counts in my world” philosophy is why so many theme camps absolutely suck. Those campers aren’t there for the ‘experiment in temporary community’.. they are there for the party. I see too many camps that just give out some liquid and treat it as a ‘tax’ for having a conveniently guaranteed campsite.


Before this week’s news was announced, I was looking forward to seeing some of the theme camp mash-ups that would be happening from so many radically self reliant souls. In your case, if your root beer camp didn’t have enough people, you could track down the previously mentioned ice cream sandwich brigade, and merge with them for a year. Be ‘Float Sandwich’ camp or something. Make new friends, mix it up a bit. Some camps could take a year off and bring it back even harder next year. Instead, a bunch whiners basically said “Even though there are 40,000 – 50,000 burners going this year, not one of them will be useful enough to help me on my project, so I need some tickets earmarked especially for people of my choosing to work on my project.” Now, scores of people who followed the rules and patiently waited for the open sale get left out. Before, it could be explained that random dumb luck was responsible for some people going, and some people not going. Now, in an attempt to ‘rectify’ the situation, BM has over corrected by directly intervening. Now there is going to be cloud over the art and camps. You know people will be thinking “Why did that ____________ get eligible for tickets?” or “That’s a nice _____ but I wouldn’t have given up a ticket for it.” Or “My friends and their ______ couldn’t go, but that POS could?”


to reiterate: Your theme camp isn't that important. Neither is my theme camp. Neither is Root Society. Neither is 'Ive got a bullhorn' camp. and on and on.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby trilobyte » Fri Feb 17, 2012 7:36 pm

You can expect to see a number of camp mashups and mutations. There aren't enough tickets to magically solve everyone's problems. The tickets won't only go to big camps or only go to the smallest camps or only go to the oldest camps or only go to the newest camps. See the notes posted from the recent Theme Camp Forum for more info on the criteria.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby lucky420 » Fri Feb 17, 2012 7:37 pm

still lovin your posts clerkkent...
Oh my god, it's HUGE!
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby essjay » Fri Feb 17, 2012 8:02 pm

clerkkent wrote:


Get ready to get angrier. I’ll say it again:
YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT. MY THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT either.


Note the ‘ THAT’ .. a subtle way of pointing out the entitlement that some camps feel they deserve.


Before this week’s news was announced, I was looking forward to seeing some of the theme camp mash-ups that would be happening from so many radically self reliant souls. In your case, if your root beer camp didn’t have enough people, you could track down the previously mentioned ice cream sandwich brigade, and merge with them for a year. Be ‘Float Sandwich’ camp or something. Make new friends, mix it up a bit. Some camps could take a year off and bring it back even harder next year. Instead, a bunch whiners basically said “Even though there are 40,000 – 50,000 burners going this year, not one of them will be useful enough to help me on my project, so I need some tickets earmarked especially for people of my choosing to work on my project.” Now, scores of people who followed the rules and patiently waited for the open sale get left out. Before, it could be explained that random dumb luck was responsible for some people going, and some people not going. Now, in an attempt to ‘rectify’ the situation, BM has over corrected by directly intervening. Now there is going to be cloud over the art and camps. You know people will be thinking “Why did that ____________ get eligible for tickets?” or “That’s a nice _____ but I wouldn’t have given up a ticket for it.” Or “My friends and their ______ couldn’t go, but that POS could?”


to reiterate: Your theme camp isn't that important. Neither is my theme camp. Neither is Root Society. Neither is 'Ive got a bullhorn' camp. and on and on.


I have a camp I'm proud of, but it is not a registered camp. Nonetheless, I understand the importance of the larger camps.

Frankly, some theme camps are THAT important. They make BM what it is. Without the bigger installations, BM is just 50,000 people camping next to each other. Large camps need 6-10 months to prepare and we need them out there. No offense to the virgins or smaller camps like mine, who come out in their RV or tents, 5-50 people strong, but, the truth is, I have been coming to the playa year after year to see things like what the Flaming Lotus Girls do, or Dan Das Mann, or Peter Hudson, or Opulent, or Alex Grey, etc (the list is long). No offense, but I'm not so excited when somebody wears their special blinky lights on Friday or is showing off their new poi moves.

There really is a difference. We need those big camps out there, and to say that they are not deserving of being assured tickets is a failure to understand the strategic effort that it takes to get those larger camps out there and what they mean to the event itself. I'm not happy with the lottery, but I'm glad BMORG is doing what they can at this point to assure that there aren't just 50,000 people wandering around wondering what all the fuss is about if the event ends up looking like nothing more than a local rave.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby vargaso » Fri Feb 17, 2012 8:12 pm

clerkkent wrote:
jkisha wrote:You know, this thread gets me more angry every time I just read the title. Fuck you OP! My theme camp IS IMPORTANT! It's important to me and to all of the members of our camp that bust their asses to pull it off every year. And I'm pretty sure there are a lot of other people that enjoyed being able to have an ice cold root beer float during the heat of the day too! And just the fact that it is important to me and my enjoyment of Burning Man, that's all that counts in my world. So there. I feel a whole lot better now.



Get ready to get angrier. I’ll say it again:
YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT. MY THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT either.


Note the ‘ THAT’ .. a subtle way of pointing out the entitlement that some camps feel they deserve. The ‘BM-BRC is nothing without us’ believers. The ‘We deserve a ticket more than others’ philosophers. If you continue reading the entire post, you would note the “It is nice to have, but not a must have. Yes, you put a lot effort into it.. so did the 200 other theme camps, as well as the other 40,000 burners who dragged their arse to the Playa.” bit. I’m aware how much energy, money and time goes into coordinating a camp, from personal experience. When I go through all the hassle of organizing my theme camp, and get it set up on the playa, I’m hoping to have a good time, but equally important to me is the hope that others will get value and a memorable experience. I want people to come in, hang out, craft something special to them out of the materials provided, and take their dusty creation home and reminisce about their playa experience 365 days a year (that’s my hope at least). All seven days I’m out there I’m thinking to myself “I hope I’m justifying the faith the placement team has in our idea by reserving this spot for our camp.”

The “… the fact that it is important to me and my enjoyment of Burning Man, that's all that counts in my world” philosophy is why so many theme camps absolutely suck. Those campers aren’t there for the ‘experiment in temporary community’.. they are there for the party. I see too many camps that just give out some liquid and treat it as a ‘tax’ for having a conveniently guaranteed campsite.


Before this week’s news was announced, I was looking forward to seeing some of the theme camp mash-ups that would be happening from so many radically self reliant souls. In your case, if your root beer camp didn’t have enough people, you could track down the previously mentioned ice cream sandwich brigade, and merge with them for a year. Be ‘Float Sandwich’ camp or something. Make new friends, mix it up a bit. Some camps could take a year off and bring it back even harder next year. Instead, a bunch whiners basically said “Even though there are 40,000 – 50,000 burners going this year, not one of them will be useful enough to help me on my project, so I need some tickets earmarked especially for people of my choosing to work on my project.” Now, scores of people who followed the rules and patiently waited for the open sale get left out. Before, it could be explained that random dumb luck was responsible for some people going, and some people not going. Now, in an attempt to ‘rectify’ the situation, BM has over corrected by directly intervening. Now there is going to be cloud over the art and camps. You know people will be thinking “Why did that ____________ get eligible for tickets?” or “That’s a nice _____ but I wouldn’t have given up a ticket for it.” Or “My friends and their ______ couldn’t go, but that POS could?”


to reiterate: Your theme camp isn't that important. Neither is my theme camp. Neither is Root Society. Neither is 'Ive got a bullhorn' camp. and on and on.


I love the "I got a bullhorn" camps. Sometimes the guy/gal (but really, guy) yelling into it is hilarious and clever, sometimes he's a drunk yutz. Either way, just the idea of a bullhorn is hilarious.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby lemur » Fri Feb 17, 2012 8:49 pm

its hard to restrain yourself when you get a megaphone in yer hands.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby clerkkent » Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:01 pm

I'm going to get a bullhorn and parade around BRC shouting

"YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT, BUT I WISH I HAD SOME ROOT BEER"

and see what pops up.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby robrob » Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:22 pm

probably some root beer.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby MyPlayaUserName » Sun Feb 19, 2012 12:03 pm

I'm burned for 6 years and I don't particularly care for theme camps. Gang mentality scares me, and I always end up getting yelled at for smelling their food or something. I'm way more fond of the interesting individuals, not so much of these megalithic camps with a handful of badass burners and a couple hundred party kids signing up for an easy stay on the playa provided by someone else.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby EspressoDude » Sun Feb 19, 2012 3:04 pm

getting into other folks food is not good anywhere, even at restaurants and your uncles house. Not all camps are mega with party kids. you just spent 6 years going to the wrong places.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby Sail Man » Sun Feb 19, 2012 3:54 pm

Well, for those that don't get tickets, may I suggest an alternative.


Disneyworld.



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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby EB » Sun Feb 19, 2012 4:04 pm

MyPlayaUserName wrote:I'm burned for 6 years and I don't particularly care for theme camps. Gang mentality scares me, and I always end up getting yelled at for smelling their food or something.


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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby Galaxo Magic » Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:06 pm

vargaso wrote:I love the "I got a bullhorn" camps. Sometimes the guy/gal (but really, guy) yelling into it is hilarious and clever, sometimes he's a drunk yutz. Either way, just the idea of a bullhorn is hilarious.

Just a wild guess vargaso, have you been to the Burn less than 3 times? LOL
I think we've all thought that was funny. We did the bullhorn thing a couple of years as well. My old camp from 10 years ago still has one they use. I am over the bullhorns now, though they can still be hilarious if the person is witty.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby Galaxo Magic » Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:07 pm

clerkkent wrote:I'm going to get a bullhorn and parade around BRC shouting

"YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT, BUT I WISH I HAD SOME ROOT BEER"

and see what pops up.

I LIKE IT! I'm stealing it.....
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby Galaxo Magic » Mon Feb 20, 2012 1:08 pm

Sail Man wrote:Well, for those that don't get tickets, may I suggest an alternative.
Disneyworld.
8)

Disneyworld on x is awesome....
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby Burnerbot » Tue Feb 21, 2012 3:08 pm

While one camp really isn't that important in the scheme of things, collectively they all are important. If 75% of the people required to make the projects happening are missing though, there is a good chance little to none of them are happening. The project I work on is a skeleton crew. We work into the Burn to finish our project and we get there the Wednesday before. If one of us were missing we wouldn't be able to do it...let alone 75% of us.

That said, I disagree with the 10,000 tickets being distributed among theme camps and art projects. The people working on them are no more important then the people who enjoy them, b/c without the consumers there would be no point. We build our project solely because we LOVE tripping people out when they come and visit.

I feel like the preferential treatment is pitting those affiliated with projects against those who are not. It's divisive and bad for the community at large. It treats art projects and them camps as a commodity that they're selling to their event attendees.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby ZaphodBurner » Tue Feb 21, 2012 3:43 pm

Burnerbot wrote: The people working on them are no more important then the people who enjoy them, b/c without the consumers there would be no point. We build our project solely because we LOVE tripping people out when they come and visit.



I was always under the impression that the people who worked on them were the ones who enjoyed them. ie, everyone in BRC is a participant. You enjoy our collaborative effort, we enjoy yours. The official term for everybody else was "Spectator" and it seems that since the first moment I bought into all this hippie-dippie "principles of Burning Man" bullshit, "participation" was critical to the "experiment."
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby Roberto Dobbisano » Tue Feb 21, 2012 4:01 pm

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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby Savannah » Tue Feb 21, 2012 5:15 pm

:lol:
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby jcliff » Tue Feb 21, 2012 7:47 pm

Clerkkent....a very nice read. I'm getting in the game late on this, but I have to tell you that you that you put to word many of the things I've been feeling lately. My sense of entitlement with going to the Burn is gone. This is the new reality. If you had asked me 5 months ago what would keep me away from BM, I would have said illness or injury. I would have never said lack of a ticket....wasn't even on my radar. I'm one of those Burners that plans ahead and gets my ticket at the first available moment, so nothing to worry about. That's all changed. I've accepted the fact that regardless of my committment to going, it's no longer a done deal. I did get a ticket, and it comes with a feeling that I better kill it this year because I may not be out there the next.

If the BMorg had let those 10,000 tickets go in the Open Sale, I don't think the playa would be that much different for it. Theme camps would have found a way to organize, recruit, join forces. Art would still get to the playa. I am really reluctant to go in any direction that attaches a ticket to involvement in some established enterprise. Who's to say that a camp that has enough disposable income and man hours to build a huge extravaganza is more worthy than the rag-tag camp on the outskirts of the city? What about all those people who have no affilation? At the risk of sounding totally sappy, it's the people that make Burning Man what it is, not the infrastructure. I read a post (elsewhere) by a near-hysterical woman yelling that "THERE WILL BE NO THUNDERDOME IF WE DON'T ACT NOW!" Really? You want me to jump into action to save Thunderdome? She should be thankful that there's one less chance of her getting her ass kicked.

I am truly sorry for people who are obviously grieving, and I in no way want to minimize their sense of loss. But we need to collectively move the fuck on and start generating more positive energy in this community. Burning Man may be a slightly scaled down version of itself this year, but it's still going to be amazing.
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Re: YOUR THEME CAMP ISN'T THAT IMPORTANT .. and other though

Postby lucky420 » Tue Feb 21, 2012 8:14 pm

well said jcliff 8)
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