2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

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2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby Kimo » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:15 pm

Have you seen the price of tickets this year?
 - $240:  10,000 tickets = $2,400,000.00
    - $320:  15,000 tickets = $4,800,000.00
    - $390:  15,000 tickets = $5,858,000.00
- $390: 10,000 tickets = $3,900,000.00 (secondary sale)
- $420: 3,000 tickets = $1,260,000.00 (per Xmas sale)
TOTAL: 53,000 tickets = $14,318,000.00

Yes, that's right boys and girls... over $14 MILLION DOLLARS!!! Throw in another 4,000 low income tickets at say, $200 each for a total of $800,000.00 and the new NOT FOR PROFIT BMORG brings in over $15 MILLION DOLLARS!

Okay, so last I looked the economy was in a major recession, housing prices are dropping like a brick, unemployment is raging out of control and jobs are being cut everyday. So let's raise ticket prices by 25% since now we know that burners will pay whatever it costs to come to our event, based upon the sellout last year and the subsequent Craigslist and eBay ads!

This BMORG reorganization is smelling a lot more like a profit making machine than a group of well wishers who really want to keep a long standing tradition of the burner spirit. These prices are paying for a lot more than BLM fees, porta pottys, law enforcement, infrastructure and art grants. It's now paying for pensions for the board members of the BMORG and fat salaries.

I smell an alternative event brewing... Is it time to OCCUPY THE PLAYA???

Thanks for the fat price hike BMORG

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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby danibel » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:21 pm

I am pretty disappointed with the pricing tiers too. I think I might be forced to try for a low income ticket this year. I really cant afford $390 for a ticket.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby actiongrl » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:26 pm

And here's a rundown on 2010 expenditures: http://financials.burningman.com/chart_2010.html

2011 should be posted with the Afterburn report in late winter.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby actiongrl » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:27 pm

And Burning Man is still operated by BRC LLC. The new nonprofit does not operate the event.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby theCryptofishist » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:27 pm

Oh no, yet more outrage, yet more vague "occupy" ideas.

Yes, it's a recession. That doesn't mean leisure activities should be free. Well, except your public library. Libraries will get you through times without money better than money will get you through times without libraries.

I suppose there's broadcast tv, too.

But I digress.

Yes, 14 million dollars. All of which goes to support one hell of a party, directly or indirectly. Good stuff doesn't always come cheap. (Even libraries. You have to support those with taxes, but in a properly progressive tax system, the poorest don't have to pay very much.) I think it was 12 million a few years ago.

And look, last year it was 17 million. So either it's going down (doubtful) or it's staying flat. or rising a little with inflation.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby Eric » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:28 pm

This comes up every year- you can check the Afterburn reports for where the money is being spent. If you don't like the prices they're charging (or how it's being spent) you always have the options of not giving them your money.

Personally, it's not the largest thing in my budget, I've planned, I can deal (and I'm unemployed). YMMV
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby Kimo » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:38 pm

@ cryptofishist and Eric....

So you think a 25% hike in ticket prices is fair and just? What if your utility company hiked their rates by 25%? Would you like it and say, ahhh no worries. Of course not. Or, if your "other" favorite vacation destination jacked their rates by 25% in one year, would you maybe look for other options?

What I'm saying is there's no justification for this kind of unprecented price hike! Is it just a coincidence that it comes on the heels of the not for profit reorganization? Let me know what you see when the fog clears. Or, clean your glasses.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby EspressoDude » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:41 pm

Eric, you beat me to it.

Folks, you don't HAVE to spend $390.00 for tickets. Or participate, or attend, or buy tickets.

That option is totally up to you.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby theCryptofishist » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:44 pm

I have no objection to your looking for other options. That 420 price is only for people who choose to pay a premium. 360 to 390 is about 9%.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby Vorpal Blade » Sat Nov 19, 2011 12:55 pm

i think maybe what people would like to see is the breakdown of the $7 Million spent on BMORG salaries.

How many folks have they got over there, exactly, and what are they doing for that $7Million?

Note: I am not saying it's an unjustified or excessive expense. I'm only saying we don't know the details of the expense.
They could be employing 100 people at ~ $70k a year, and maybe that would be fair and necessary.
But they could be paying a small number of people a very large sum of money and then relying on community volunteers to stuff envelopes and what not.

Good news is, once it's gone non-profit, all of that info becomes publicly available.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby trilobyte » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:00 pm

We all have to make our own value judgment on the things we buy and do with our time. If you feel the price has increased unfairly and you are unwilling to pay the stated prices, you are welcome to exercise your rights as a consumer and not purchase tickets. Top tier is $390, up from $320 for the 2011 event (about a 22% increase), but bottom tier is $240, up from $210 in 2011 (14% increase). And they've increased the number of bottom tier from 8K to 10K, and will be offering more low income opportunities. The increase seems reasonable to me.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby lemur » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:05 pm

Vorpal Blade wrote:They could be employing 100 people at ~ $70k a year, and maybe that would be fair and necessary.
But they could be paying a small number of people a very large sum of money and then relying on community volunteers to stuff envelopes and what not.


im no official or anything but as far as i am aware the burning man LLC employs lotsa different people over the course of the year in a buncha different roles..

lotsa 'contract' type work for people who help build the city infrastructure.. people getting paid for a month or two..
part time people who organize/work for various projects..
and then the full time year round people..




i dont know but i would imagine that there cant be much more than 50 people getting paid full time for working for burning man.. if that..
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby dougtinva » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:07 pm

I want to hear an answer from BM on why they are raising the prices. What are they planning to do with the extra money?
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby lemur » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:09 pm

dougtinva wrote:I want to hear an answer from BM on why they are raising the prices. What are they planning to do with the extra money?


there is no 'extra' money.. its all burning man money... it goes to making this year happen or next year happen.. or to keep all of their various shit spread across nevada/california running..

*im not an official*
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby Eric » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:15 pm

Kimo wrote:@ cryptofishist and Eric....

So you think a 25% hike in ticket prices is fair and just? What if your utility company hiked their rates by 25%? Would you like it and say, ahhh no worries. Of course not. Or, if your "other" favorite vacation destination jacked their rates by 25% in one year, would you maybe look for other options?


Top tier last year was $360 (which would have been "Gate price" if they hadn't pulled them to sell before the Sell-out). Top "normal" tier this year is $390- like Fishy said, about 9% up from last year. I notice you didn't complain about the fact they've gotten rid of a tier, you might want to add that to your next rant.

As for those $420 presales, I'm sure you read the FAQ but here's the reasoning on those prices:
BURNING MAN 2012 TICKETS FAQ wrote:Q: Why are the Pre-Sales tickets more costly than the Main Sale tickets?
A: Two reasons: to help prohibit exploitation of the system by those wishing to up their odds of getting tickets in the Main Sale, and also to help offset the reduced price of the lower tier and Low Income/Scholarship tickets.


You can always just try your luck at the two lower tiers...
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby Kimo » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:21 pm

360 vs 390 is 9% Just look at the highest tiered ticket for one example: $390 this year vs $350 last year. And 25,000 of them this year. $40 increase over previous year's $350 price is 12%. Last year I bought tickets at the pre-Xmas price, which was $295. This year that ticket will cost $420 (nice number btw). That's an increase of $125, or 43%.

Based upon the different tiers and different prices and different quantities, let's just agree on an average increase of 25%.

So what the hell did we do, except come year after year, to deserve a 25% hike in the gate fee? And where is that money going? They got volunteers, recycled fencing, infrastructure, etc.

This increase is unprecedented and only happening because THEY CAN. So if you're too blind to realize that you're being fucked, then a least have them kiss you while they're doing it.

.... Somewhere, back at the BMORG offices: "Can you believe we actually sold out last year?" "Yeah, fucking unbelievable what a Facebook page will do for advertising. That was a brilliant idea Larry!" "and how about those eBay auctions and Craigslist ads? I can't believe people were paying a premium price for tickets!" "Well, let's make damn sure we raise ticket prices this year since we know there's a strong demand and they're willing to pay for it". Now we can all give ourselves a better pension plan. They want to come to our event, at any cost".
Last edited by Kimo on Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby Kimo » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:26 pm

If you want to go with the top tier being 360 last year, fine, a 9% increase. But the meat is in the volume. This year close to half of all ticket sales (25,000) are being sold at top tier (not including the 3,000 $420 tix). Last year maybe the last 5,000 -10,000 (or 20%) were sold at top tier.

A little different! Wouldn't you agree?
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby lucky420 » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:30 pm

So Kimo, are you going or what?
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby theCryptofishist » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:32 pm

Let's get solid numbers for the lower tiers last year, rather than going on weird impressions and faulty memories. There may well be numbers elsewhere on eplaya. Bob is the expert on how to use google to search here. The native search engine is kind of crappy, although I think it's been improved in the upgrade.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby lemur » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:34 pm

Kimo wrote:So what the hell did we do, except come year after year, to deserve a 25% hike in the gate fee? And where is that money going? They got volunteers, recycled fencing, infrastructure, etc.



those volunteers dont all manage themselves, and they surely dont provide their own materials or infrastructure.... someone has to pay for the stuff they use.. and even the recycled previously used stuff has to live somewhere.. the upkeep and cost of running the ranch has to be considered as part of the cost for even already paid for stuff..

its not cheap to create a system where over 1000 volunteers can come and basically just step into a role..whatever that may be.. and start work.. but burning man does it....

having had some experience as a volunteer theres a lot more going on than just buying a white board with an empty spot for you to sign up for a volunteer shift..
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby Kimo » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:41 pm

LOL @ lucky420......

Yes! I am going. But I don't like being fucked as I sit in line for 6 hours before I pass through the gate and hand over my $400.00. Whenever there is a price increase there is at least an explanation to try to justify the increase (with the exception of oil). So I sure would like to know why all of a sudden, after the first ever sold out year in the history of the event, and after a reorganization of BMORG, there's a substantial increase in ticket prices?

An official explanation from the BMORG would be nice. Or should I just lay there and take it like a man?
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby theCryptofishist » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:43 pm

I think it a little odd that you are demanding an explanation for numbers that are more or less imaginary...
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby lucky420 » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:45 pm

mmm I say lay there and take it like a man. The pain will be brief but oh so worth it...

come on you know you want to... :wink:
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby ygmir » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:47 pm

Kimo wrote:LOL @ lucky420......

Yes! I am going. But I don't like being fucked as I sit in line for 6 hours before I pass through the gate and hand over my $400.00. Whenever there is a price increase there is at least an explanation to try to justify the increase (with the exception of oil). So I sure would like to know why all of a sudden, after the first ever sold out year in the history of the event, and after a reorganization of BMORG, there's a substantial increase in ticket prices?

An official explanation from the BMORG would be nice. Or should I just lay there and take it like a man?


I'd say quit whining, and take it.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby Kimo » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:50 pm

To all those who are trying to explain that there are costs for putting on this event this year, save your keystrokes. Uhhhh, yeah, we know this. But this isn't the first year. And they either own the land or lease the land where they store their shit. And last time I looked property values were going down and so should be the taxes associated with those taxes if they own the land. Interest rates are at an all time low. So this would equate to lower costs. If they're leasing the land they probably signed a multi year lease with a constant cost associated with it. If I were leasing I would be renegotiating a lower rate right about now, or looking for another location, of which there are many.

The costs to run this event have not increased in line with the cost of tickets. They've been doing this long enough and are smart enough to be more and more efficient each year. So let's let the BMORG explain to us why they hiked the prices so much instead of all this silly speculating and reasoning. I think we at least deserve that.
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby Kimo » Sat Nov 19, 2011 1:58 pm

My dear unabashed pagan bitchslapped Nordic - its not whining. It's freedom of speech. And I will exercise that right, as I choose. You obviously don't feel that I should be using this forum as an avenue of doing so. So I will kindly ask you to spend your time on another topic, where your input might be more useful... like "the spank me when you take my money, I don't care" forum.

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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby FIGJAM » Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:02 pm

How much money is in my wallet you ask?

Let me check.

FUCK YOU... thats how much!
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby actiongrl » Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:32 pm

The costs to run this event have not increased in line with the cost of tickets.


Where's your information from?
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby sandgoddess » Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:39 pm

dougtinva wrote:I want to hear an answer from BM on why they are raising the prices. What are they planning to do with the extra money?


All of this "I demand Burning Man tell me!!!!" "something ad nauseum" is sure entertaining, and gives me so much to write about in my secret diary that I will burn in The Temple, if I go in 2012, after purchasing my FOUR Holiday drawing tickets...which I have no doubt I will "win".

Of course, I could get sidetracked, or find something else fascinating that catches my eye during my vacation week. It has happened before. Over the 25 year period that I have been going to Burning Man, 2012 will be my 13th burn, should I choose to go. Choose being the key word here. Yes, I'm going to purchase tickets, either way. Again, I am going to reiterate, I am going to purchase four...say it again...purchase four tickets. That's all it is. Purchasing. Just like before.

If for some reason, which I can't imagine, I get bumped to the next drawing and have to purchase only two tickets at a lower price...oh well. I'm not going to die. My life will not be ruined. I will just have two less tickets to gift than I usually do.

For those of you who want the tickets engraved with the purchasers name, and show ID at the gate...that would sure screw up my gifted ticket giving fun, now wouldn't it? Would it suck for me? Nah...I would just stop buying extra tickets for YOU.

I'm not rich. In fact, I make $12 bucks an hour. I don't have insurance or any other benefits. I do however, put $25 a check away to purchase tickets, all year round. I could be putting that money in savings, or giving it to a charity of my choice. But for many years, I have done this so people could go to the Burn, who may not have been able to.

I don't spend thousands every year on camping supplies. I'm an experienced primitive/backpacking camper. It doesn't have to cost a bunch. I make very cool things for gifts, all year round, out of scraps of clothing and jewelry I find at yard sales, thrift shops, Craigslist etc. I live Southern Idaho, so fuel doesn't cost me as much as it costs many, but it's still a lot. I have a bus, which I chose not to take last year because of the cost of fuel. I took my car, and tent camped instead. The entire trip cost me $478.67 to be exact. Yes, that included my ticket. Fuel and water were my biggest expense. I don't eat much (tho I prepared several lovely meals and fed my neighbors), and I don't drink alcohol.

I hope I find people to gift this year...I'm starting to wonder if that will happen, after seeing all the whining, bitching, self important, "officially deemed entitled" posts by "Burners". I guarantee that no one like that will get a ticket for me. I may even have my own burn, and video tape my fire, as I burn the extra tickets. I chuckle at that thought.

This is the last sane post you'll ever see from me (maybe). My two cents worth of suggestion to Burning Man? Raise the ticket price to $400. Or $50 a day. No tiers. The Burn is worth it. 8)

In the meantime....I'll just keep s-trolling around FB and Eplaya for my own personal viewing entertainment. :lol: :wink: :mrgreen:
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Re: 2012 TICKET PRICES INCREASED TO $390! WTF???

Postby littlemonkey » Sat Nov 19, 2011 2:45 pm

theCryptofishist wrote:Oh no, yet more outrage, yet more vague "occupy" ideas.

What does this mean?
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