For all those towing trailers...

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Postby unjonharley » Tue Mar 29, 2011 6:48 pm

.

Just checked boat trailers on Craig's list.. One free w/drift boat. Another 25 w/boat.. Looked Ok in the pictures.. The tires were up.. There were some 12 footers for $150.. My hoped project this year will be pretty light.. Would be lighter than the utility trailer I take to BM yearly.. could get some of the cost back in milage..
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Postby FIGJAM » Tue Mar 29, 2011 7:16 pm

Don't have a cutting torch.

I use my skill saw with a metel blade.

If I can find a 6x10, the idea is to weld some 1" channel around the outside to nest the 3/4 plywood into, then frame the inside with 2x2s, and coat it inside and out with roof coating.

A door at the back and a hatch for the swamp cooler, some 12 volt lighting and outlets, then when I get home from the playa, just take everything out and hose it out for cleanup.

6'wx6.4'hx8'L. That's the plan so far.

I'm chomping at the bit to get started but I need the base first.

Regional coming up in may and want to take it there for testing.

Figured about $1000 if I don,t have to build the base from scratch.

Thanks guys. :)
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Postby gyre » Tue Mar 29, 2011 7:56 pm

I probably posted this, but re plywood, I was advised to use marine plywood= best, or exterior grade fir or better and paint it.
Low end treated is considered a bad approach, surprisingly.

I used cheap plywood the first time and it lasted an amazingly long time because it would drain most water off.

Sealing the edges is the most critical part of painting it.

I just lined a borrowed trailer with cheap plywood and zipties.
Works fine.
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Postby Elliot » Tue Mar 29, 2011 8:06 pm

:D
Hmmmmm.... I have this 20 foot long pedal car that needs its own trailer, both for transport and for storage the rest of the year. It is tapered at the ends, so I'm thinking of building up a boat trailer by bolting sides directly to the boat-shaped trailer frame, the two sides meeting in a point near the coupling. Plywood would probably be cheapest. But I am also considering salvaging aluminum walls from an 18-wheeler trailer.

The difficult part will be the roof. It will need to rise a foot or two in the middle. (The vehicle is football shaped.) So I'm thinking bows and canvas like a Conestoga wagon.

I already have the right size boat trailer.

Thoughts?
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Postby FIGJAM » Tue Mar 29, 2011 8:23 pm

Elliot wrote::D
Hmmmmm.... I have this 20 foot long pedal car that needs its own trailer, both for transport and for storage the rest of the year. It is tapered at the ends, so I'm thinking of building up a boat trailer by bolting sides directly to the boat-shaped trailer frame, the two sides meeting in a point near the coupling. Plywood would probably be cheapest. But I am also considering salvaging aluminum walls from an 18-wheeler trailer.

The difficult part will be the roof. It will need to rise a foot or two in the middle. (The vehicle is football shaped.) So I'm thinking bows and canvas like a Conestoga wagon.

I already have the right size boat trailer.

Thoughts?


That's why I thought the 1" channel would work well.

I'm afraid bolting the wood directly to the frame could be a problem if the wood rips out, whereas the channel will give suport and run the bolts through the channel and the bottom of the panels.

As far as painting goes, I've primed and painted ply with top quality products and still had it peel and flake.

I've taken ply straight from the store (still damp) and with 2 coats of elastimer roof coating it does'nt even warp cause no moistier can get in or out.

At $80 bucks for five gallons, it's cheaper and quicker to apply and more durable. It's almost like the ply was dipped in vinyl! Now I wont use anything else and it sticks to anything. YMMV :)
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Postby gyre » Tue Mar 29, 2011 8:34 pm

FIGJAM wrote:
I've taken ply straight from the store (still damp) and with 2 coats of elastimer roof coating it does'nt even warp cause no moistier can get in or out.

At $80 bucks for five gallons, it's cheaper and quicker to apply and more durable. It's almost like the ply was dipped in vinyl! Now I wont use anything else and it sticks to anything. YMMV :)

That stuff is not effective here, especially on roofs.
Heat, humidity, I don't know.

The marine doesn't need painting.

I used a one part acrylic this time.
New paint for me.
Looks good.
Hard to apply.
Supposed to be UV proof.

I like the HD Aluminum from rustoleum, but it leafs.
True vapor barrier, so you can't coat both sides.


I have steel framing, even if I'm going over it with the wood.
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Postby ygmir » Tue Mar 29, 2011 8:39 pm

Elliot wrote::D
Hmmmmm.... I have this 20 foot long pedal car that needs its own trailer, both for transport and for storage the rest of the year. It is tapered at the ends, so I'm thinking of building up a boat trailer by bolting sides directly to the boat-shaped trailer frame, the two sides meeting in a point near the coupling. Plywood would probably be cheapest. But I am also considering salvaging aluminum walls from an 18-wheeler trailer.

The difficult part will be the roof. It will need to rise a foot or two in the middle. (The vehicle is football shaped.) So I'm thinking bows and canvas like a Conestoga wagon.

I already have the right size boat trailer.

Thoughts?


my militart cargo truck, and trailer, use the bows and cavas approach. They work good.

What about salvaged metal roofing?
a little heavier, I think, than truck sides, and, will redily bend one direction.
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Postby ygmir » Tue Mar 29, 2011 9:24 pm

gyre wrote:I probably posted this, but re plywood, I was advised to use marine plywood= best, or exterior grade fir or better and paint it.
Low end treated is considered a bad approach, surprisingly.

I used cheap plywood the first time and it lasted an amazingly long time because it would drain most water off.

Sealing the edges is the most critical part of painting it.

I just lined a borrowed trailer with cheap plywood and zipties.
Works fine.


yeah, if you can afford marine plywood.....and, it does need painting. the glues are water resistant, but, the wood it'self still suffers from weather.
I used it for my flatbed, bed.
and, yes, it is the best thing going, but, jeeze, it's spendy............
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Postby gyre » Tue Mar 29, 2011 9:43 pm

They told me it didn't need it.
Marine, not just treated, right?

About $70 a sheet best price here.

Humidity here.
Would that make a difference on painting?
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Postby FIGJAM » Tue Mar 29, 2011 10:05 pm

I would think that humidity is a big factor.

There again is the expence issue.

I've actualy tested 3/4 ABS partical shit and had it last as long as good ply as long as I got it sealed up with the roof coating.

Yes, the instuctions are spacific about what temp and humidity when applying.
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Postby gyre » Tue Mar 29, 2011 10:16 pm

More specifically, it's humid here.
About 1000% all the time.

If you can get 60-70% in the air conditioning here, you're probably maxed out.
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Postby gyre » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:01 am

I've been towing nonstop lately with a Ford Ranger.
It turns out that I'm constantly needing to couple and uncouple with the tailgate down and the bumper hitch doesn't leave enough room for that.

It also seems that there are very few used receivers for Rangers because the bumper is so good on the Ranger that few people ever buy them.
I think they are now putting them on standard.

I was planning on having another receiver adapted, but the fit is crucial to avoid having it too low, and that can be tough.
I happened on some old stock receivers at a hitch shop here the other day.
They are new old stock from a ford dealership.
They appear to be new takeoffs, still with a part number painted on them.
They are the older Ranger model receiver.
I think they fit all up to current or very recent, like 2010.
The difference is the newer holes don't line up with the old ones, so the receiver or frame has to have two holes added on each side.

They have more than one, so if anyone else needs a good Ranger receiver, let me know.
These have no manufacturer listed on them.
They have the tag for tow rating.
They are crude, but extremely heavy duty, thick square tubing with two bends to push the receiver out to line up with the bumper.
The square tube is continous welded to the frame plates on each end.
The frame attaches at three points, one that lines up with the bumper attachment points on all the trucks, including mine.
But unlike all other Ranger receivers I've seen, like the drawtite, this one attaches on the sides of the frame rails too.
The two holes on each side appear to be for the 1989 and earlier??
But the frame and hitch design doesn't seem to have been changed with the newer model otherwise.

I can weigh mine if anyone else wants an idea of the durability.
They are stronger than any receiver I have seen for the Ranger.
Real overkill for my four cylinder.

My friend has towed 10,000 pounds with his bumper hitch.
Who would think the four cylinder would ever pull that?

Thought someone else might need one, especially for less than building a receiver yourself.
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Postby gyre » Thu Apr 07, 2011 7:40 pm

I looked at the receiver I bought again.
As well as I can measure it, it is entirely quarter inch steel.
The tube is gusseted at the receiver tube with plates on both sides, all continuous welded.
Serious strength.
I don't think any aftermarket receiver even comes close.
I've never seen a light receiver built like this.
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Postby ygmir » Thu Apr 28, 2011 2:51 pm

I built this little light trailer the other day, for a friend, who now does not want it.
But, I was thinking it'd be a good design for those with lighter vehicles and, not having to tow a lot of weight:
2" angle iron frame, tongue 2x3" tubing, std. 2" ball hitch,1/2" OSB sheeting for( 2 layers/1" for floor) sides. 2x4 I.d. pockets for stake sides, lights.
15" rims/tires. Leaf springs, no brakes. and, I made the tongue fold, and hold with a 1/2" pin, for easier storage.
4'x4' box. all removable stake pocket sides.
I'd not recommend it much over 700 lbs payload, but, it'd probably hold 1500.....just not with me towing it.

It probably weighs 300 or so lbs. lite duty, trailer for sure, but with large tires for better road service, IMHO.

I post pics, so, if someone wants to copy it, here it is:

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Postby gyre » Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:12 pm

Nice trailer.
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Postby roanokejim » Fri May 06, 2011 12:23 am

Hi gyre. I agree with you. I really like its trailer either. :D
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Postby Elliot » Fri May 06, 2011 9:01 am

Be advised, folks; I now have a cheap Harbor Freight trailer in my fleet, the kind that folds up and stores on its end, and it's a bit scary: The previous owner carried a golf cart on it, and the tongue collapsed. Very flimsy steel channel. So use these trailers only for light freight.
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Postby ygmir » Fri May 06, 2011 9:04 am

Elliot wrote:Be advised, folks; I now have a cheap Harbor Freight trailer in my fleet, the kind that folds up and stores on its end, and it's a bit scary: The previous owner carried a golf cart on it, and the tongue collapsed. Very flimsy steel channel. So use these trailers only for light freight.


good advise, Elliot!!
it can't be over stressed, that, over loading a trailer is asking for tons of trouble.
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Postby gyre » Tue May 17, 2011 10:20 am

I looked at the conspicuity striping at hf the other day.
It is fake.
Don't waste your money.

Buy a name brand or at least something DOT rated.

The reflector striping on my 2005 playa bike still looks new after years of uv.
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Postby gyre » Sat Jun 25, 2011 8:18 pm

I have been using a cousin's larger open trailer for moving.

Big thanks to Motsky for all kinds of advice on my truck, and getting set up.
Some of what I'm doing may not be relevant for other people.
It sure wasn't for me in the past.

His trailer is that crappy four wire setup I detest, and would never use on my trailers.
I finally gave in and used a plug in set up from hopkins for this, with the plan to use it for a breakout for a proper setup in the future.
They have actually labeled them for this.

There really was no ideal solution.
The wiring on my ranger was surprisingly hard to reach.
I now see why they so often wire through the tail light area, even though not best practice.
I still need to drill a hole through plate steel upside down for a ground.

The plug in adapter is as easy to install as it could be, except for the ground.
It is very, very limited in capacity though.

I think it is far safer to have modern lighting with amber side turn signals.
Lane changing is a big issue for trailers.

There are heavy converter boxes, but they all are hard wired, as far as I know.
It is easy to do your own too.

I decided I need to keep 4 prong connectability, in case I tow anyone else's trailer.
I will probably use the semi-trailer plugs in 7 or 9-pin,
7 pin RV is useful too.


As this was an open framed trailer, I carried a lot on it, but decided I needed a liner.
I ziptied plywood to the frame and to itself.
Only the gate was hard, after I had the wood cut precisely.
I may even double the height, as I am now doing longer distances.


My cousin's trailer is badly underlit.
I have already towed more than all years previous put together.
I don't want to risk an accident.
A massive shunt so near me that I felt it decided me the other day.
I had to get out to see if I was hit.

Besides sorting out the lighting hookup, I decided to add a number of reflectors.
I haven't found my 3M tape yet and didn't want to use it on a temporary setup anyway, so I used those oval/rectangular reflectors that give the option of screws, whcih I am using into half inch plywood.

I started high and will run the same pattern down low, so as to catch the lower oriented low beam pattern cutoff.
I mounted red on the outside rear and amber in the middle of the tailgate.
Properly they should be all red, but no one will complain.
I wanted the visibility.
I would use white if I had it too, like the striping.

Thicker reflectors should be much more effective than the conspicuity tape, but other than a possible wide angle, it is not.
These are cheap, but DOT spec, about a $1 each, if you shop.
They are not reflectorized at all on the back, while the 3M tape is.
That and the focus of the 3M product (and competition striping in DOT spec) makes all the difference.

A really big issue is durability.
The best location for reflectors on this trailer is the bottom rear edge.
All the original reflectors are heavily damaged.
The tape will sustain damage, but it is much tougher in this application.
Much tougher.

From a cost standpoint, it isn't even close, for what you get.
Spend the money on the good stuff.
Avoid just one collision and you are so far ahead.

I bought harbor f pickup netting to go over the top, when called for.

Again, thanks Motsky, for all the help.
Thanks to Yggie and many others too.
There is always another good idea out there.
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Postby Foxfur » Sun Jun 26, 2011 12:06 am

Conspicuity tape
Gyre, I have never met anyone else who knew the proper name.
Dad taught it to me when he was taping my bike when I was 6.
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Postby gyre » Sun Jun 26, 2011 1:56 am

I wanted solid colors.
Took forever to find anywhere I could order it, without getting a train car full at a time.

3M is so disorganized for a big company.
Every division packages and prices the stuff differently.
Wildly differently.

You can use the solid colors like pinstriping, edge sealed down to 1" wide.

Oddly, I solved the edge sealing issue for at least part of 3M, due to use of a totally different optical "paint".
The trick is using an eyedropper.
Edge sealing is primarily a cosmetic issue though.

The stuff really does work on bikes doesn't it, in spite of violating all their design parameters?

If you don't know the name, you definitely can't find the stuff.

Your dad was preety slick to think of using it on a bike.
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Postby EspressoDude » Mon Jun 27, 2011 8:46 am

holy conspicuity batman that is expensive

@ potter-webster in portland $160 -190 for 1-1/2" x 150 ft!
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Re: For all those towing trailers...

Postby gyre » Tue Jun 28, 2011 3:25 pm

Zebra stripe
http://store.gregory1.com/productdetail.aspx?STRSL983

Best price from my supplier was one dollar per yard per inch, but that was with unlimited choices, and by the roll - fifty yards + shipping.
And that was years ago.
By the case, that price would drop.

Zebra stripe can be cheaper and is sold as little as ten dollars for a package.
You must buy fifty yards to get a good price.

These are all edge sealed up to six inches wide.
Available much wider.

Check truck suppliers and truck stops for zebra stripe.
They can beat everyone, but never have any choices.

There are many colors including fluorescent orange.

It is available even cheaper from other divisions of 3M, but will not be edge sealed.
You may be able to buy scrap or cut pieces from someone with this stuff.
Sign companies, advertising, etc.
Part numbers may vary, and may not be labeled DOT.
You can not afford to buy these rolls direct.

The adhesive has a half life and is permanent when cured.
Any expired might be very cheap, and the reflector should be unaffected.

It is stiff on a bike on round tubing.
I strap it down until set.

Here's a competitor with some comparative brightnesses.
There is at least one other company
http://www.reflective-striping.com/
http://www.reflectivelyyours.com/generic67.html

983 is the common designation for 3M horizonta striping.
http://over-wraps.com/TEST/Template/Ref ... Vinyl.html

Reflexite
http://www.emedco.com/best/reflexite_vs ... mond_grade

3M Diamond grade is oriented horizontally or vertically for reflectivity.
Be aware of that.
It still works on bikes in spite of that design factor.

One application on bikes is to run a strip from one spoke to another.

The clear/ silver can be used in one inch on most cars without appearing odd.
Enough silver on the rear of a vehicle can be bright enough to discourage tailgating.

Consider applying one inch stripes of red and silver on a trailer, one above the other.
That appears to be the approach used on the side of Gulfstreams.
Looks good.
They could be added over time, as well.

This isn't a thorough search, but gives you a starting point.
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Re: For all those towing trailers...

Postby magdelyn » Tue Jun 28, 2011 8:51 pm

I carry a jack, jackstands, full tool box, spare for both vw van and trailer, tire repair kit, bicycle pump, extra parts for my vehicle; like fan belt, fuses, windshield wiper blades, dwell/tach meter, multi-meter, and timing light.

I drive slow...

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Re: For all those towing trailers...

Postby EB » Tue Aug 23, 2011 11:29 am

bump
Irony. You're soaking in it.
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Re: For all those towing trailers...

Postby gyre » Wed Nov 02, 2011 10:12 pm

A husband and wife were hooking up their trailer here.

It started rolling.
The door hit the wife, knocked her down and the trailer ran over her.
She was killed.

She was young, healthy and agile.

Respect your rig.
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Re: For all those towing trailers...

Postby Foxfur » Sun Nov 06, 2011 8:46 pm

The best leveling indicator I've used is a necklace hung on a hook in my travel trailer. Bullseye levels, external 'smile' bubble levels, orthogonal geospatial rectification transmographiers, and similar devices never seem to work as well. It's a simple plumb bob.
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Re: For all those towing trailers...

Postby gyre » Mon Oct 22, 2012 7:20 pm

I was talking to Eddie Hill today (yes, that Eddie Hill) and among other things, we started talking about towing vehicles.
It came up in reference to people using line locks to lock all four wheels while on trailers.
He sells Ariel Atoms and has come to the conclusion that the safest method is to tightly strap the vehicle down in relationship to the trailer.
You might expect that strapping wheels down, a common method, is easier on the car, but suspensions have been known to magnify movement and even overheat shocks while on a trailer.

Of course, this depends very much on the trailer suspension and vehicle being towed on the trailer too.
My subaru suspension trailer is markedly gentle compared to the one I have been using recently of a more common buggy spring design.
And dramatically gentle on the tow vehicle too.

The caution about shock applies to other things in trailers too.
I've had things bounce out of the poor riding trailer that really shouldn't have.
The ride can be far worse than you imagine.
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Re: For all those towing trailers...

Postby Ugly Dougly » Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:48 pm

One thing that has annoyed my about Burning Man logistics is renting.
I only have my little Prius, and that's not going to help.
But I can buy a used pickup or SUV. I now have some space to park such a vehicle.
(So I am thinking this through; bear with me.)
An extra heavy-duty vehicle would come in handy from time to time.
And if it's got a tow package on it, I could rent a trailer from U-Haul of various sizes. Large enough to stash a monkey hut and a foam dome in. Other camp gear would go in the main vehicle.
So I will look at getting a 2nd vehicle this year.
Please to visit PAGE TWO.
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