This Is Burning Man

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.

Postby Bob » Fri Mar 04, 2011 2:17 pm

Brian did his bit volunteering on stuff back in the late 90s, if that helps. Nice guy.

Suppose I'll get around to reading his book someday, though I declined his request for comments when he was writing it, with concerns perhaps similar to Spec's. Mostly I didn't want to be tempted to vouch for facts I couldn't confirm first-hand. I don't think it's meant to be a primer, more a pop/social history, though I'm sure he'd be happy for you to spend money on it for whatever reason. Some people like books, and I figure the Wired front page article back in 1996, and subsequent coffee table book, had already blown the doors open wrt media blather.
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Postby Bob » Fri Mar 04, 2011 2:21 pm

Oh, and Ken Burns is a giant [sic] Dodger lover.
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Postby spectabillis » Fri Mar 04, 2011 3:42 pm

caution spectabillis, sloppy thinking...


better than having pretense, and thinking i have a better understanding than others after reading a book.

so careful yourself genius - because without even reading it i know a fuckload of history that could never be published. and thanks to you now, i have a better appreciation for that value, that i can hold such knowledge over your head.
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Postby spectabillis » Fri Mar 04, 2011 3:47 pm

Bob wrote:Mostly I didn't want to be tempted to vouch for facts I couldn't confirm first-hand. I don't think it's meant to be a primer, more a pop/social history..


i got nothing against the guy for doing it, but i know that its not going to be very good because we just dont out people like that. pop history is a really good way to put it, pop is burningman now.
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Postby theCryptofishist » Fri Mar 04, 2011 5:00 pm

Bob wrote:...though I'm sure he'd be happy for you to spend money on it for whatever reason.

It's been on the remainder tables; I thing i got mine for $8, and it's ten or eleven at SF MOMA bookstore.
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Postby Teo del Fuego » Fri Mar 04, 2011 7:13 pm

spectabillis wrote:
caution spectabillis, sloppy thinking...

better than having pretense, and thinking i have a better understanding than others after reading a book.so careful yourself genius - because without even reading it i know a fuckload of history that could never be published. and thanks to you now, i have a better appreciation for that value, that i can hold such knowledge over your head.


Specta: Your ability to make wild-ass and unfounded assumptions [in this thread, at least] is amazing. Can a person not read a book, enjoy it, and necessarily NOT have a "pretension" of thinking one has a better understanding than others? And, good golly, who really gives a flip IF someone walks the Earth thinking they have a better understanding of a subject because they have read a book?

Your last sentence, really, is either deliberately cryptic or just drunk typing. So you know more about BM than me. Who cares? I just enjoyed reading Brian's book. It's well written and happens to be on a subject I enjoy. I'm not as good a Burner as you because of it. I will live.
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Postby moonrise » Fri Mar 04, 2011 8:16 pm

Hm, I just found some of my 1993 to current, burner friends, they brought their pets (3 dogs) to BM in 1993 and for several years after that.
TV sets were (destroyed) there too, lmfao. Man do they have baggage. LOL

They're returning again 2011, 2012....
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Re: Just finished reading...

Postby TomServo » Fri Mar 04, 2011 8:49 pm

Fancy wrote:I've never been (but im going this year damnit!). Enjoyed the book, though i'm wondering if any significant changes have occurred since 2003, the most recent burn he discusses.


The significant changes that I saw, occured between 1999 and 2001. But they really werent that significant....just more people and more cops. I must say, 2010 was an amazing year!...almost as good as 2001! Alot of newbs and very friendly.
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Postby spectabillis » Sat Mar 05, 2011 2:59 am

Teo del Fuego wrote:..and necessarily NOT have a "pretension" of thinking one has a better understanding than others? .. So you know more about BM than me. Who cares...


heh... always been the same failed rationales and reactions from cameras to commercialization. its like personal empowerment of the lowest common denominators.

people are entitled to continue to fuck it up, and bound and determined to do so like spoiled little children away from their parents if you tell them not to.
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Postby spectabillis » Sat Mar 05, 2011 3:15 am

moonrise wrote:... they brought their pets (3 dogs) to BM in 1993 and for several years after that. TV sets were (destroyed) there too, lmfao. Man do they have baggage. LOL


lol indeed: with a topic about a book, people think everything's supposed to be taken literally
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Just ask his Mom.

Postby Simon of the Playa » Sat Mar 05, 2011 9:28 am

PLEASE, TEO...

you have to remember that Spec is SMARTER THAN ALL OF US...
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Postby spectabillis » Sat Mar 05, 2011 10:28 am

nope


dont have much of a problem with people who have such personal needs in the larger scheme of things. its the bigger problem of automatically defending entitlements that i always have an issue with.

people just cant think about some things, and that has nothing to do with intelligence.
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Postby Leo » Sat Mar 05, 2011 11:06 am

Spectabillis,
Stop listening to the voices and read the f@*%$*g book.
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Postby Gizmo » Sat Mar 05, 2011 11:15 am

If you are interested in the history of Burning Man, check out the people who took Larry Harvey's Beach Party to the desert.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4MC2Ng1BDE&feature=player_embedded[/youtube]
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Postby Simon of the Playa » Sat Mar 05, 2011 11:24 am

in all seriousness, i can see both sides and it is a conundrum until you realize that EVERYTHING MUST EVOLVE, OR DIE.


i'll take the evolution over the latter any day, and by now have realized that the only way to survive and thrive is to go to the dark side.


they have cookies.
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Postby theCryptofishist » Sat Mar 05, 2011 12:06 pm

Simon of the Playa wrote:in all seriousness, i can see both sides and it is a conundrum until you realize that EVERYTHING MUST EVOLVE, OR DIE.

I guess what gets me is that various old burners have "outgrown" the event, but are still emotionally involved with it. It's sad really. On the other hand, it's scary. You begin to see how the surrealists got into trials of members, then throwing them out as not being ideologically pure as they should be.

And that gets to Moscow, but I'm not going there.

And so people who accuse us of wasting our time and not seeking out new ways of doing are, spend their energy telling us this instead of seeking out these new ways.

And they use the word "sheeple" far too often. It's like they expect us to follow them as their sheeple.

Sad, sad, sad.
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Postby Simon of the Playa » Sat Mar 05, 2011 12:18 pm

i kinda like the new cookies.

i had a great, mind-fuck helluva epic tiger blood drenched time in 1996.

2010 rocked my world.


everything in between was " HOT DAMN " and beyond.


and as the festival's current Director likes to say, "It's all good, my niggahs"

now, just exactly HOW MANY DAYS do we have until we can burn stuff and blow shit up?**

**not counting JuPlaya
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Postby spectabillis » Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:29 pm

theCryptofishist wrote:I guess what gets me is that various old burners have "outgrown" the event, but are still emotionally involved with it. It's sad really.


nah, your new environment is easy to cope with, just like we deal with the real world where our subcultures take root and thrive. there's quite a few groups now who are not as open, because it successfully limits your influences.

but dont fret little fishy. your radically open environments will still attract plenty of fuckups who cant relate to the world. they always find that your open environment is just the place to put up with them - so we'd rather they hang in your places instead.
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Postby Simon of the Playa » Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:40 pm

nah, your new environment is easy to cope with, just like we deal with the real world where our subcultures take root and thrive. there's quite a few groups now who are not as open, because it successfully limits your influences.

but dont fret little fishy. your radically open environments will still attract plenty of fuckups who cant relate to the world. they always find that your open environment is just the place to put up with them - so we'd rather they hang in your places instead.





no....wrong answer.....it was the burnal equinox and you were supposed to reference that as a long time insider.

wtf?


you aint all that burny, poseur...


irony, you're soaking in it.
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Postby spectabillis » Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:44 pm

spectabillis wrote: there's quite a few groups now who are not as open, because it successfully limits your influences.


hey welcome to your evolution :)

once an open place that now continues private cliques! you can re-live your childhood, just like high school!
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this is where the sig line is important.

Postby Roberto Dobbisano » Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:54 pm

The Future Is Great !!!
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Postby spectabillis » Sun Mar 06, 2011 4:18 pm

and full of drainbows!

Image
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Postby moonrise » Sun Mar 06, 2011 5:05 pm

spectabillis wrote:
moonrise wrote:... they brought their pets (3 dogs) to BM in 1993 and for several years after that. TV sets were (destroyed) there too, lmfao. Man do they have baggage. LOL


lol indeed: with a topic about a book, people think everything's supposed to be taken literally


I won't tangle with you spec, but truly, the first thing my "93 BURNER friends told me when I asked what'd ya do back then? was about their "DOGS, TV sets and the baggage/gear" haha.
At least you laughed, lol (I've never seen the book, lol)
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Postby spectabillis » Sun Mar 06, 2011 7:17 pm

oh im just flippin some back, nothing personal is intended here moonrise


sorry, thats kinda the lingua franca on the eplaya for a while now but... well, cant really change it so.. takes adjustments to take the ball and run with it
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Postby theCryptofishist » Sun Mar 06, 2011 7:19 pm

Oh crud, Simon. What's the point of my plonking spect's condescending crapola, if you don't leave his name in when you quote him? I saw more than I wanted to of his utterly useless acidic nostalgia because he wasn't blocked in your post.
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Postby Isotopia » Sun Mar 06, 2011 7:29 pm

92' for me (my first year) was all about dogs, guns and enough venison sausage (and eggs) to feed thirty people for breakfast.

Someone else brought the coffee.

Some other person(s) brought the shredded hash browns.

And then there was the person who brought quarts and quarts of orange juice.

It was quite the impromptu gathering of strangers that Saturday morning.

Oh, and everyone kicked in to do the dishes.

And didn't have to be reminded to leave no trace.
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Postby Simon of the Playa » Sun Mar 06, 2011 7:37 pm

so that was 3 B.D.*


*Before Dre.
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Postby moonrise » Sun Mar 06, 2011 9:14 pm

Mr spect, sir,

No, I don't take it personally. Tens of thousands eventually might.

This old school vs new comers issue was discussed at length at the camp I was in last year. Eventually, what? Old School Burners will pass on, and then what?
Just thier kids and close friends burn?
Seems lame to me and to the 2nd and 3rd generation burners I camped with.

I must add; there are countless incredible old school/veteran burners on eplaya and on-playa and they don't resent new blood.
(thanks! you know who you are)

Yes, we know, BM isn't a giant rave, that was discussed at camp and has been discussed on eplaya also.
I know it's a concern that BM doesn't become an international rave circuit party or diluted by clueless new blood.
The bigger sound camps sure are impressive though, it was fun to journey out and enjoy those anchors.

We are evolving, not de-volving. Why don't you try to mesh with us? ;)
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Postby spectabillis » Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:03 am

moonrise wrote:Seems lame to me and to the 2nd and 3rd generation burners I camped with.


btw i really respect that. ive started getting back into hanging out with kids and seeing what they are into, but there's that part of... i dunno, subculture elitism? like the cool kids in high school? being older, i sometimes catch it from them and makes me think how i was.

most kids are still great and wont push an attitude, but i still think thats a valid concern and threat to the openess thats a big and important part of bman. so its not like thats something i support, i know better. i think that would be socially caustic if their numbers grew too big.


but maybe that just me... besides, i still get to enjoy all the new skate/street bmx parks because I HELPED PAY FOR THAT NOW GODAMNIT! didnt have that shit when i was young!
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Postby spectabillis » Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:44 am

nevermind for a while. i just got really pissed, and its nothing to do with this.
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