Empire Scammers

Share your pictures and video. Tell us about the sights, sounds, and scents, as well as the rumors and truths found at Burning Man.

Postby Discosybil » Thu Oct 02, 2008 9:29 pm

That's too bad because the only gas station next year will be in Gerlach, which only has 2 pumps for gas.
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Postby Kinetik V » Fri Oct 03, 2008 7:15 am

Well, it's good to see the Karma Gods and Goddesses never forget. I'm very likely the one person who won't miss the rathole Empire store with their ripoff prices, horrible customer service and attitude, and just an overall shitty layout that made getting in and out of there a major pain in the ass.

I'll just make a note to myself to buy extra gas and provisions in Winnemucca before heading in to the event.

Damn, you know that not having that last minute scam store to stop at means people will have to get off their ass and practice radical self reliance a bit more! But that may be wishful thinking....watch in 3 years there will be a new store in Gerlach that's built just to cater to the BM population...

Anyway, other than having some sympathy for the people that are out of work now, the overall feeling is thank Dog it's fucking gone, and good riddance! Plus we've removed a major exodus bottleneck as a bonus!
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Postby goathead » Fri Oct 03, 2008 7:47 am

Kinetic V wrote:Well, it's good to see the Karma Gods and Goddesses never forget. I'm very likely the one person who won't miss the rathole Empire store with their ripoff prices, horrible customer service and attitude, and just an overall shitty layout that made getting in and out of there a major pain in the ass.

I'll just make a note to myself to buy extra gas and provisions in Winnemucca before heading in to the event.

Damn, you know that not having that last minute scam store to stop at means people will have to get off their ass and practice radical self reliance a bit more! But that may be wishful thinking....watch in 3 years there will be a new store in Gerlach that's built just to cater to the BM population...

Anyway, other than having some sympathy for the people that are out of work now, the overall feeling is thank Dog it's fucking gone, and good riddance! Plus we've removed a major exodus bottleneck as a bonus!


LMAO
You sound just about like the locals who hate burning man.
Oh and they would love a new WALLY WORLD, sounds like you would to.
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Postby goathead » Fri Oct 03, 2008 7:58 am

theCryptofishist wrote:Litigants? Who's suing whom and why?


The kids of two business partners, seems some where paid off years ago.
But now they see a great big old burning hog and want a chunk of it.

Then there is USG which owns the land but not the building or improvements.
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Postby goathead » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:14 am

Kinetic V wrote:Well, it's good to see the Karma Gods and Goddesses never forget. I'm very likely the one person who won't miss the rathole Empire store with their ripoff prices, horrible customer service and attitude, and just an overall shitty layout that made getting in and out of there a major pain in the ass.

I'll just make a note to myself to buy extra gas and provisions in Winnemucca before heading in to the event.

Damn, you know that not having that last minute scam store to stop at means people will have to get off their ass and practice radical self reliance a bit more! But that may be wishful thinking....watch in 3 years there will be a new store in Gerlach that's built just to cater to the BM population...

Anyway, other than having some sympathy for the people that are out of work now, the overall feeling is thank Dog it's fucking gone, and good riddance! Plus we've removed a major exodus bottleneck as a bonus!


Thought about your rant for a couple of minutes and well

FUCK YOU.

Get your shit together, and just fucking drive on through.
Burners are a major pain in their ass every fucking year.
Wanting service and prices from small store out in the MIDDLE OF NOWHERE, pissed because there was't a greeter at the door for you?

The store was for the LOCALS convenience. None of the locals did their weekly shopping there, It was for the things you would run out of between trips to town.

FUCK YOU
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Postby ygmir » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:21 am

Kinetic V wrote:Well, it's good to see the Karma Gods and Goddesses never forget. I'm very likely the one person who won't miss the rathole Empire store with their ripoff prices, horrible customer service and attitude, and just an overall shitty layout that made getting in and out of there a major pain in the ass.

I'll just make a note to myself to buy extra gas and provisions in Winnemucca before heading in to the event.

Damn, you know that not having that last minute scam store to stop at means people will have to get off their ass and practice radical self reliance a bit more! But that may be wishful thinking....watch in 3 years there will be a new store in Gerlach that's built just to cater to the BM population...

Anyway, other than having some sympathy for the people that are out of work now, the overall feeling is thank Dog it's fucking gone, and good riddance! Plus we've removed a major exodus bottleneck as a bonus!


I do love humans...........


KV has good and unique points......I wonder about the other side of the argument?
I'd have to bet, that, a lot of folks there resent the hell out of BM......
I'd also bet that, people being people, the shoplifting, damage, "wear and tear", etc, etc, skyrocket during BM...........and that may well drive some of the price raises?.........
Shitty customer service can also come from attitudes........customer and employee........I can imagine the moods of some folks after driving for maybe even days, and, getting there, tired, broke, frustrated, and, seeing a "podunk" little store with high prices, not having the best of attitudes.........

A lot goes into the mix, IMHO.
Karma may have kept them open all these years, as well..........

Pointing out that people will have to rely on more "radical self reliance" seems, interesting........considering most buy their stuff anyway, who cares where they do it?
Maybe some liked the place, and, bought stuff there on purpose, just for a stop, say "hi", get a soda and go "home"......?

I say this, with all disclosure that I've never stopped in there.
I'm loaded when I leave home (only 200 miles) and, have fuel enough etc on board to go out and come back.........So, my POV may, and probably is, not totally informed......

Anyway,
my sympathies to those it hurts.............
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Postby Fire_Moose » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:35 am

We stopped in on the way up, saw the store, thought that might be where Brunos diner was. We went in the store and i was amazed. everything a burner could need! and rediculously priced! i walked around the store and chuckled to myself then headed home.
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Postby Intubater69 » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:39 am

goathead wrote:
Kinetic V wrote:Well, it's good to see the Karma Gods and Goddesses never forget. I'm very likely the one person who won't miss the rathole Empire store with their ripoff prices, horrible customer service and attitude, and just an overall shitty layout that made getting in and out of there a major pain in the ass.

I'll just make a note to myself to buy extra gas and provisions in Winnemucca before heading in to the event.

Damn, you know that not having that last minute scam store to stop at means people will have to get off their ass and practice radical self reliance a bit more! But that may be wishful thinking....watch in 3 years there will be a new store in Gerlach that's built just to cater to the BM population...

Anyway, other than having some sympathy for the people that are out of work now, the overall feeling is thank Dog it's fucking gone, and good riddance! Plus we've removed a major exodus bottleneck as a bonus!


Thought about your rant for a couple of minutes and well

FUCK YOU.

Get your shit together, and just fucking drive on through.
Burners are a major pain in their ass every fucking year.
Wanting service and prices from small store out in the MIDDLE OF NOWHERE, pissed because there was't a greeter at the door for you?

The store was for the LOCALS convenience. None of the locals did their weekly shopping there, It was for the things you would run out of between trips to town.

FUCK YOU


At the risk of incurring wrath, I think your comments Goathead are right on. Considering that there doesnt appear to be too many other ways around, us burners clogging up 447 can indeed be a major pain in the ass for the locals. I had to stop there for gas on the way to the burn. I found the staff to be helpful, cheerful and easy-going. While the gas prices were a little higher then in civilization, for someone who grew up in rural northern michigan and travels alot in BFE, I didnt find them to be anywhere near the "gouging" range. I go to a Nascar race in southern michigan, and I know alot of the locals who have to endure their roads, especially in front of their houses, jam packed, bail out for the duration. It would'ny surprise me if thats the case in the Empire/Gerlach area as well. Not only that, but a local church gifted gallons jugs of water, 1 of which we received. There may be a few bad apples, and what place doesnt have them, but all in all my experience was positive. Thank you native people for putting up with our asses :)
I get to drive the ambulance how fast?!!

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Postby Kinetik V » Fri Oct 03, 2008 8:52 am

goathead wrote:Thought about your rant for a couple of minutes and well

FUCK YOU.

Get your shit together, and just fucking drive on through.
Burners are a major pain in their ass every fucking year.
Wanting service and prices from small store out in the MIDDLE OF NOWHERE, pissed because there was't a greeter at the door for you?

The store was for the LOCALS convenience. None of the locals did their weekly shopping there, It was for the things you would run out of between trips to town.

FUCK YOU


Fuck you! My rants with the Empire store are:
1: Shitty gas.
2: Excessively high prices even for being in a remote area....and I've got experience with living in places even more remote than Empire.
3: A basic level of service. If I walk in the fucking store, don't try and sell me shit that in any other store run by someone with a fucking IQ over 3 would have yanked the shit off the fucking shelf and put it in the fucking trash.

In short, I'll gladly pay double prices at remote outposts, hell even triple. In Canada it was even higher than that! When I walk up to the register at least give me a grunt, look at me, and don't bitch that I'm there spending money with you when I could have spent that money elsewhere. I know it ain't Wal-Mart and I sure as fuck don't expect that level of service. But I do expect a basic level of service and since it wasn't being delivered, while it may be a temporary hardship to the locals, maybe someone will step up now and build the store that the community deserves.

And don't even talk to me about radical self reliance as I will take your ass to school and back. When you've been in Northern Canada above Yellowknife, come talk to me, otherwise with all due respect, shut the fuck up because you really DON'T have a clue.

Again, the closure should be considered a public service. And maybe the LLC could put up a store in Gerlach and build another revenue stream...it's not like the idea hasn't been batted around long before now!
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Postby Kinetik V » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:06 am

Ok, the last post was very harsh...but I've hated that place for years and the news of it's demise doesn't bring any tears over here. I'd like to see someone build a combination general store / storage compound out there that would cater to burners 4 weeks out of the year and the locals the rest of the time. I don't have the means to do it as I have too much going on out here in Colorado now but maybe the LLC can do something. It would be another good source of revenue and do more to build good will with the locals. Not to mention with the LLC's ability to tap good talent it would be well managed.....
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Postby ygmir » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:15 am

Kinetic V wrote:
goathead wrote:Thought about your rant for a couple of minutes and well

FUCK YOU.

Get your shit together, and just fucking drive on through.
Burners are a major pain in their ass every fucking year.
Wanting service and prices from small store out in the MIDDLE OF NOWHERE, pissed because there was't a greeter at the door for you?

The store was for the LOCALS convenience. None of the locals did their weekly shopping there, It was for the things you would run out of between trips to town.

FUCK YOU


Fuck you! My rants with the Empire store are:
1: Shitty gas.
2: Excessively high prices even for being in a remote area....and I've got experience with living in places even more remote than Empire.
3: A basic level of service. If I walk in the fucking store, don't try and sell me shit that in any other store run by someone with a fucking IQ over 3 would have yanked the shit off the fucking shelf and put it in the fucking trash.

In short, I'll gladly pay double prices at remote outposts, hell even triple. In Canada it was even higher than that! When I walk up to the register at least give me a grunt, look at me, and don't bitch that I'm there spending money with you when I could have spent that money elsewhere. I know it ain't Wal-Mart and I sure as fuck don't expect that level of service. But I do expect a basic level of service and since it wasn't being delivered, while it may be a temporary hardship to the locals, maybe someone will step up now and build the store that the community deserves.

And don't even talk to me about radical self reliance as I will take your ass to school and back. When you've been in Northern Canada above Yellowknife, come talk to me, otherwise with all due respect, shut the fuck up because you really DON'T have a clue.

Again, the closure should be considered a public service. And maybe the LLC could put up a store in Gerlach and build another revenue stream...it's not like the idea hasn't been batted around long before now!


I've always wanted to see far northern Canada above Yellowknife. Is it as cool as it seems?
I drove to the Arctic circle just below Inuvik once, but, couldn't spend much time there......
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Postby Kinetik V » Fri Oct 03, 2008 9:24 am

I hated it up there...all except for the money...which is the only reason I'd ever go back up there. It was beautiful for about 2 days and then it was like wtf am I doing here? YMMV.
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Postby goathead » Fri Oct 03, 2008 10:06 am

Kinetic V wrote:Fuck you! My rants with the Empire store are:
1: Shitty gas.
2: Excessively high prices even for being in a remote area....and I've got experience with living in places even more remote than Empire.
3: A basic level of service. If I walk in the fucking store, don't try and sell me shit that in any other store run by someone with a fucking IQ over 3 would have yanked the shit off the fucking shelf and put it in the fucking trash.

In short, I'll gladly pay double prices at remote outposts, hell even triple. In Canada it was even higher than that! When I walk up to the register at least give me a grunt, look at me, and don't bitch that I'm there spending money with you when I could have spent that money elsewhere. I know it ain't Wal-Mart and I sure as fuck don't expect that level of service. But I do expect a basic level of service and since it wasn't being delivered, while it may be a temporary hardship to the locals, maybe someone will step up now and build the store that the community deserves.

And don't even talk to me about radical self reliance as I will take your ass to school and back. When you've been in Northern Canada above Yellowknife, come talk to me, otherwise with all due respect, shut the fuck up because you really DON'T have a clue.

Again, the closure should be considered a public service. And maybe the LLC could put up a store in Gerlach and build another revenue stream...it's not like the idea hasn't been batted around long before now!


Kinetic V wrote:1: Shitty gas?

Hmmm, comes out of the same tank farm in Reno/Sparks that services every fucking station in Northern Nevada. During BM they get fuel once or twice a day sometimes.

Kinetic V wrote:2: Excessively high prices even for being in a remote area....and I've got experience with living in places even more remote than Empire.


They have to stock the store themselves. During BM they have to rent a truck and make a twice daily trip into Reno to try to keep things going.
They are not able to pick shit up at the same fucking prices as Wally World does.

Kinetic V wrote:3: A basic level of service. If I walk in the fucking store, don't try and sell me shit that in any other store run by someone with a fucking IQ over 3 would have yanked the shit off the fucking shelf and put it in the fucking trash.


I have never had anyone in the store try to "sell me anything".

Kinetic V wrote:In short, I'll gladly pay double prices at remote outposts, hell even triple. In Canada it was even higher than that! When I walk up to the register at least give me a grunt, look at me, and don't bitch that I'm there spending money with you when I could have spent that money elsewhere.


Try showing up by yourself, without 40,000 plus. Dealing with part time staff who either fucking hate you, or hate the fact that they are WORKING and not able to go out to the BRC themselves. You would find an entirely different attitude.

Kinetic V wrote:And don't even talk to me about radical self reliance as I will take your ass to school and back. When you've been in Northern Canada above Yellowknife, come talk to me, otherwise with all due respect, shut the fuck up because you really DON'T have a clue.


Good for you. You sure feel free to talk shit about a store you only see once a fucking year, under the worst possible time for them and their employees. You have no fucking clue as to how they are the rest of the year though.

Kinetic V wrote:Again, the closure should be considered a public service. And maybe the LLC could put up a store in Gerlach and build another revenue stream...it's not like the idea hasn't been batted around long before now!


LMAO, visions of DPW, store clerks.

Yeah
FUCK YOUR DAY.
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Postby goathead » Fri Oct 03, 2008 10:40 am

Intubater69 wrote:At the risk of incurring wrath, I think your comments Goathead are right on. Considering that there doesnt appear to be too many other ways around, us burners clogging up 447 can indeed be a major pain in the ass for the locals. I had to stop there for gas on the way to the burn. I found the staff to be helpful, cheerful and easy-going. While the gas prices were a little higher then in civilization, for someone who grew up in rural northern michigan and travels alot in BFE, I didnt find them to be anywhere near the "gouging" range. I go to a Nascar race in southern michigan, and I know alot of the locals who have to endure their roads, especially in front of their houses, jam packed, bail out for the duration. It would'ny surprise me if thats the case in the Empire/Gerlach area as well. Not only that, but a local church gifted gallons jugs of water, 1 of which we received. There may be a few bad apples, and what place doesnt have them, but all in all my experience was positive. Thank you native people for putting up with our asses :)


I avoid the store during the event, the girls are tired and snarky, they are working way to many hours, people not showing up for shifts because they are out in the BRC, so they have even more work. It takes them a few weeks just to get back their normal selves.

For what its worth he treated his employees very well, every time there was something going on for the school senior center, or whatever they always donated.

I just wish some would put themselves, in this case the stores shoes. It's not a lot of fun for them.
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sorry to see it go

Postby cowgirl » Fri Oct 03, 2008 10:47 am

personally i've been to the empire store many times when the burn isn't going on. the people are nice (i walk in there with a friendly attitude to begin with), they've let me use their bathroom, the sandwiches are enormous, and they sell individual snowballs (awesome!). i've purchased chuck dodd's book, noticed one year in july when there were fires along the 447 that they were cleaned out of water and ice b/c the firemen on break bought it all (providing a service to the firefighters), and generally the gas is less $$ than in gerlach.

so wtf is the problem with the place? seriously? i'm really bummed out to hear it closed.
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Postby Kinetik V » Fri Oct 03, 2008 10:53 pm

Yes, I do have a clue what the place is like at other times of the year outside of August and September. As far as the gas goes, it's all from the same source in Reno but my hunch was they had a tank problem of some kind. My equipment did not run well on their gas while the gas I purchased in Gerlach gave me no trouble. And as for pricing, having run my own outfitting business and having several people in the C-store business in my family I am not ignorant when it comes to pricing concerns...far from it. But price took a back seat to the quality of the items on the shelf....that's where I had the biggest concerns.

In short, I can speak about this and not be talking out my ass. You on the other hand...not so much. Feel free to try and choke out some kind of rebuttal, I'll trash it too.

Again, thank Dog it's gone, and good riddance...it's time to build something better out there.
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Postby cowgirl » Sat Oct 04, 2008 12:40 am

kinetic, i'm not sure who you're rebutting, but you're coming across like a jerk. just sayin.
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Postby Kinetik V » Sat Oct 04, 2008 2:36 am

I wasn't trying to be a jerk, I'm just passionate about the subject....and after my cumulative bad experiences in that place I'm just happy to see it go. That being said I hope they build something better out there with easier and safer access to 447 among other changes.
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Postby goathead » Sat Oct 04, 2008 7:11 am

Kinetic V wrote:I wasn't trying to be a jerk, I'm just passionate about the subject....and after my cumulative bad experiences in that place I'm just happy to see it go. That being said I hope they build something better out there with easier and safer access to 447 among other changes.


Really don't care if you liked the store or not.
You don't live here.
So while it might put a SMILE on your face.
We have friends out of work.
More more popping in the store for a jug of fucking milk or maybe a deli sandwich.

Yeah, I hope something is done. Just wondering what fucking year.
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Postby Intubater69 » Sat Oct 04, 2008 11:47 am

Kinetic V wrote:In short, I can speak about this and not be talking out my ass. You on the other hand...not so much. Feel free to try and choke out some kind of rebuttal, I'll trash it too.


Well K, you may not be talking out of your ass, but you sure are coming across like one :roll:
I get to drive the ambulance how fast?!!

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Postby Simon of the Playa » Sun Oct 05, 2008 10:40 am

ah, screw the Not-So-Secret meth Lab, How about utilizing all of that beautiful solar power to grow some Empire Yum-Yums, some Gerlach Green, some of those Nixon Nugs, or Imlay Falls Fun-Stuff?

all you need is some High Pressure Sodiums and a Dream....

(and some good clones)
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Postby Teo del Fuego » Mon Oct 06, 2008 7:51 am

Kinetic, I probably know you from the Colorado Burner scene, just cant tell from your avatar and ePlaya name. So, I hesitate a little to tell you that you come across on this particular thread like a spoiled brat.

My experience with the Empire store was always good. But then, I wasn't expecting a small besieged store to live up to inflated standards.
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Postby Fire_Moose » Mon Oct 06, 2008 9:39 am

I hear ya Kinetic.


Although some may perceive you as being a dick....and it does seem like you cannot see the local's side of it all...you are pretty much right.
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Postby Apollonaris Zeus » Mon Oct 06, 2008 10:13 am

This gas station has been doing this shit for years!

Time to set up a camera or spoof them.

Drive up get gas and steal your own gas cap and give them some shit!
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Postby mars » Mon Oct 06, 2008 10:34 am

Empire Gas is Dead~Long Live Empire Gas!

Next year I will be stationed at the station, stealing peoples' gas caps and selling them back to them. We can do this tag-team...when I leave, someone else can take over. So mote it be.
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Postby Bob » Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:07 am

Maybe more of you people should move out there, gentrify the place, and force out the gyp plant & the railroad. I'm sure they're killing endangered pup-fish and frog-snakes.
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Postby goathead » Mon Oct 06, 2008 10:20 pm

Apollonaris Zeus wrote:This gas station has been doing this shit for years!

Time to set up a camera or spoof them.

Drive up get gas and steal your own gas cap and give them some shit!


Great idea, set up the camera so we can see how long it takes the fucking hippies to realize THERE IS NO ONE THERE.

Reminds me of the dead people found at the drive, they had gone to see
CLOSED FOR WINTER.
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Postby goathead » Mon Oct 06, 2008 10:29 pm

Bob wrote:Maybe more of you people should move out there, gentrify the place, and force out the gyp plant & the railroad. I'm sure they're killing endangered pup-fish and frog-snakes.


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Postby Discosybil » Mon Oct 06, 2008 10:45 pm

Goathead,

I'm sympathetic to the town of Empire and agree with what you said. We have had positive experiences at the store other times of the year. We personally don't stop there on the way or back from BM because of the crowds but I do hit it every other time, when hunting, fishing or visiting a friend in Gerlach.

It's too bad Kinetic (corporate trainer according to his bio) is so harsh on a business.

For example I had to move our 10,000 lb 73 Winnebago (think super heavy brick on wheels) from Denver to Lincoln, NE along I-76 and I-80. I used the 2-3 second rule of getting in behind the trucks and the difference was huge. With that vehicle I run it by the tach and the vacuum gauge...and drafting gave me almost 5 hg difference on the vacuum gauge and an almost 3 mpg difference once I got it out on the flat stretches of I-80 past Big Springs.
Kinetic V

~~~~


Maybe because he has art cars and motorhomes, he has forgotten what it's like for people that have smaller cars to bring extra gas or food due to storage. Maybe he doesn't realize some people like the idea of stopping in the store to get the new issue of the Calendar or a t-shirt to remember the event. The Burning Man website Empire on their site for people to get last minute water, gas & food.

Not everyone is as lucky as Kinetic, We met alot of people from Empire t at a local reservoir while camping. They were lovely people, making a living and excited to invite our whole group over for beers, stories and fire.

It's too bad Kinetic does not understand what it's like to deal with 40 thousand plus people driving through a small town in one week. Not everyone in the town is negative. Like him, there are a few rotten apples that get off thinking they're big people, complaining about what they don't know and using the work "Fuck" alot.
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Postby theCryptofishist » Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:17 pm

Oh for dwag's sake, don't make this about Kinetic. So, he has different experiences than you, makes different choices than you, and expresses opinions you don't like.

Oh, and he swears.


Yeah, let's build a bonfire, belittle him for hours then roast him. That'll learn him to be different.
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Embrace the Sock

Winners never quilt, quilters never win...
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