The only reason no vending is allowed at Burning Man...

All things outside of Burning Man.

Postby Don Muerto » Tue Oct 28, 2003 10:01 am

I think Iso is dead-on, with this addition:

I think WSPR is the latest incarnation of 'LarryHarveysHat', -same stupid name for a decidedly unimaginative troller.
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Postby Guest » Tue Oct 28, 2003 10:11 am

[quote="Isotopia"]Nah, BoyWithPenisSmallerThanWill's unique perspective of things suggests he's been around for a bit. I'd guess he's a bitter, disillusioned, ex-volunteer or undercompensated DPW lame-o. Further, the continued Marian/Crimson ragging suggests either a unrequeited return of affections by one or both of the women at some point [i]or[/i] they've always dismissed this little shithat as the spooky little loser that he undoubtedly is. Yeah, either ex-DPW or some invisible little putz who probably hung out at the HQ for a year or so doing 'volunteer' work so he could get close enough without coming on as a stalker or grovelling lap dog searching for attentions, acknowledgement or a friendly face.

This guy's been around for at least two years I think. His first post I'm betting are the one's that suggested Will was responsible for the unfortunate death that took place up near the 80 acres before the 2002 event.

Sad, sad boy.[/quote]


You're saying that my underendowed namesake was responsible for a death out at 80 acres? I hadn't heard that. Care to tell more?
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Postby stuart » Tue Oct 28, 2003 11:48 am

It's someone who really really really really really wanted the Plonk! and s/he's out to prove why.


that's fucking brilliant! why didn't I think of that?

3 outta 4 trolls can't be wrong; I want my fucking plonk!
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Postby Jane Eric » Tue Oct 28, 2003 11:51 am

My home base BBS is a place that strives for civil discourse, 500 global participants, nearly six years strong, assume goodwill, etc. etc. etc. I never fucking swear over there but even we have a bozofilter.
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Postby Badger » Tue Oct 28, 2003 12:31 pm

I read this guy's pap and I yawn just like someone else mentioned earlier.

Still, sometimes a troll like this guy can serve as a reminder of why the mother's of some animals eat their young.
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Postby Raheer » Wed Oct 29, 2003 4:07 am

Badger wrote:I read this guy's pap and I yawn just like someone else mentioned earlier.

Still, sometimes a troll like this guy can serve as a reminder of why the mother's of some animals eat their young.


I couldn't have said it better myself. (Of course, comparing the general quality of my posts to Badger's, we all know this already, but...).

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Postby DE FACTO » Wed Oct 29, 2003 4:35 am

You know, there's something you guys taught me a long time ago......."don't feed the trolls".
even though...........
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Postby Hotblack Desiato » Wed Oct 29, 2003 12:56 pm

Um... motives of participants aside, methinks Penisperson's point is fundamentally specious.

If BMOrg really wanted to make a pile of loot off the event, they would have busted a Lollapalooza/Woodstock/Coachella years ago. If they opened the event up to corporate sponsorship to cover costs, they'd stand to really rake it in.

The revenue afforded by the odd T-shirt sale is coals to Newcastle compared with what the org would stand to gain by inviting, say, AOL to sponsor the event.

The opening post shows a woeful lack of understanding about how these things work.
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Postby BlueBirdPoof » Wed Oct 29, 2003 1:50 pm

Hotblack Desiato wrote:Um... motives of participants aside, methinks Penisperson's point is fundamentally specious.

The opening post shows a woeful lack of understanding about how these things work.


Lack of something is right!
As the ice sale proceeds are donated to the local communities (I thought this was true of cafe sales as well, but I can't find that on the site, so I could be wrong) you have to refute that on some level or another if you want to argue that Core Staff is motivated solely by greed.

If you do want to declare it all about Larry Harvey's personal gain, you need a much more subtle arguement, i.e. that because his other source of income is the lecture circuit (I know he gives them, I assume he's paid) then additional vending would cheapen the "brand image" as it were of Burning Man and therefore diminish Larry's opportunities to speak. Especially in so far as he speaks of "Potlatch" and "Gift Economy."

That's a potentially interesting discussion.

But far too abstract for the mind that started this thread.
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Postby Hotblack Desiato » Wed Oct 29, 2003 2:07 pm

I still maintain that if A= the amount of profit turned by BMOrg via ticket sales and coffee/merch sales, PLUS Larry's lecture fees, and B= the amount of profit that would be turned if Burning Man invited corporate sponsorship and charged vendors to hustle their wares at the event, than B would be much, much > A. I'm speaking as someone who has worked for various pop-culture-oriented festivals that do allow vending. If the whole Burning Man deal exists solely to make money off schlubs, they could be doing a much better job at it.

Agree that the "is Larry motivated by a quest for personal glory?" question is more interesting, although it's less likely to be resolved in an objective manner.

Penisperson's hater-ass bitching, however, can be resolved, soundly refuted, and put to bed in the minute or two that it takes to review the economic facts of life.
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Postby Kinetic II » Wed Oct 29, 2003 2:40 pm

<Yawn!>
Troll visits the eplaya. News at Eleven.

<Snore!>
Unless Bob finds a more compelling argument to sway me back, I am now firmly in the Yes for PLONK camp. Thanks Will for helping me understand the issue.
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Postby BlueBirdPoof » Wed Oct 29, 2003 3:11 pm

Hotblack Desiato wrote:I still maintain that if A= the amount of profit turned by BMOrg via ticket sales and coffee/merch sales, PLUS Larry's lecture fees, and B= the amount of profit that would be turned if Burning Man invited corporate sponsorship and charged vendors to hustle their wares at the event, than B would be much, much > A. .


Absolutely. "Raking it in" would be the operative term, I believe.

Mine was meant as a side comment, not a refutation or counterarguement to yours.
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lmao

Postby dj big E » Thu Nov 13, 2003 8:42 pm

lmao been a while since i've posted but this looks like good place to start lmao. i have been looking for a way to squash the rainbow gathering vibe thats been going around lately you no bring back the meat and the spontanious burns and a little violence laugh my ass off and i say we start off next years burn with a community flogging of this jackass ie mister rodgers penus or whatever.I got some shirts for sale in bold letters they say hater and i got one for you will lmao. dj big "E"
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Postby Badger » Fri Nov 14, 2003 1:11 am

Big E,

Every time you use 'lmao,' God kills a baby.

Please, think of the children.
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Postby Kinetic II » Fri Nov 14, 2003 7:08 am

Badger wrote:Big E,

Every time you use 'lmao,' God kills a baby.

Please, think of the children.


Mr. Badger: May I respectfully remind you that the Indian subcontinent is on track to pass China as the country with the highest population count very shortly. If comment above is true, myself along with a lot of other people in the Indian government would encourage the fantastic DJ Big E to lmao as many times as he wants. He's actually doing us a public service!
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Re: The only reason no vending is allowed at Burning Man...

Postby Last Real Burner » Fri Nov 14, 2003 8:16 am

WillSmallPenisRoger wrote:...is because Larry and BMORG want to make all the money themselves. If vendors were selling coffee and snacks, that would cut into the profits BMORG makes from the center cafe.


The money from coffee sales goes to the Gerlach schools or sum such thing.

WillSmallPenisRoger wrote:If vendors were selling Burning Man t-shirts and baseball caps, that would cut into the profits BMORG makes from merchandise. If you can't see this, you are extremely naive.


Ha! Ha! Ha! Have you ever seen a commercially made Burningman Tshirt? Of course you haven't People don't buy them, any "real" burning Man Tshirt is handmade by you at the event and they are free. Buying commercially made Tshirts is akin to buying used rubbers, nobody wants to wear 'em (let alone be seen in one), ie no sales.

But your comments are always welcome here. Right Badger.

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intramurally,
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Re: The only reason no vending is allowed at Burning Man...

Postby rogue agent » Fri Nov 14, 2003 8:54 am

Last Real Burner wrote:The money from coffee sales goes to the Gerlach schools or sum such thing.


Does anybody know how much money this is? The cost for ice & coffee supplies is listed at $108,000 for 2002.

Ha! Ha! Ha! Have you ever seen a commercially made Burningman Tshirt? Of course you haven't People don't buy them, any "real" burning Man Tshirt is handmade by you at the event and they are free.


Yah, I got one of those, on the back of one of my NSA shirts. I think it makes a statement.

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Postby III » Fri Nov 14, 2003 9:02 am

>The money from coffee sales goes to the Gerlach schools or sum such thing.


the money for ice sales does. as far as i can tell, the money from coffee sales is used to subsidize cafe expenses and not much else. i can't tell for sure, though. there is, however, a conspicuous absence of documentation showing that it goes towards some philanthropic purpose.

>Have you ever seen a commercially made Burningman Tshirt?

i own one as a matter of fact. they were confiscated by the llc (in '98 i believe), and then handed out to some volunteers as a thank you. they're pretty lame, though.

there are also plenty of officially approved tshirts available
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Postby Rob the Wop » Fri Nov 14, 2003 10:36 am

III wrote:there are also plenty of officially approved tshirts available


Which are most probably created by a commercial graphics company, ie. are commercially created. Just to dispel the myth that the Burning Man organization are entirely composed of idealistic saints. I see no problem with this at all. It's simply smarter and cheaper to use a commercial venue to create tens of thousands of shirts and hats, a handmade version simply can't be created in volumne. And ifins you complain about that- who made the white T-shirt that was "hand modified" at the event, or back farther- the cloth? You can't totally escape the hand of capitalism in this country regardless of where you go. How'd you get to the event? Did you use the roads paved by our government? Do you eat food from a store? What's your tent made of? What about the basic materials, if you created your tent?

I find it kind of amusing when folks frown on a minor aspect of capitalism while sucking down a Starbucks latte (this is metaphorically speaking, of course). I believe that the no vending rule is key to BM's survival, but I fully acknowledge that you do have to give a little. Just make attempts to keep the core concepts at heart. I have great faith in the gods of chaos, they make life funny.
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Favorite BM t-shirts

Postby robbidobbs » Wed Nov 19, 2003 10:00 am

I was amused to find commercially printed t-shirts being sold at the Empire Store last year prior to the Event. There was a sign on the rack that stated clearly they were approved. I'm so all for the Empire Store getting some money for what they do for us. Money is a language they understand, and they deserve our business.

As to my favorite BM t-shirts: The one I made at the Work Ranch in 2001 where I took one of the old t-shirts that Danger dropped off (he brought in BAGS of old clothes for DPW use...YEAH!), I cut off the sleeves, the collar and spray painted Ada's stencil of SUICIDAL BUNNIES in red spray paint. I then ironed on one of my Pooping Man decals on the bosom. That's my favoritie. My second favorite is my Pooping Man t-shirt with the No Moop in the Poop logo. My third would have to be the Pooping Man t-shirt that I made to look like a Designer Fashion...white with PM logo on the lower side. It's still white after all it's abuse!

There are some commercially created ones that don't suck: the ones you EARN by working Gate, Greeters, Rangers, or DPW for instance. I still have all of the above in my storage locker. They are precious to me.

The upshot is: don't bother with the commercially created "normal" t-shirts. Get some cardstock and make your own design with spray paint, or create an ink-jet iron-on for your camp. It will be treasured all the more.
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Postby Angry Butterfly » Thu Nov 20, 2003 1:26 pm

I am notoriously cheap and was happy to plunk down $15 at empire store for a hat. Why? Because I Know what living in a town like that is like ( ever been to hale MI? ) when I was a kid, our town's economy really depended on deer hunting, so much so that we always got a school vacation for deer season. I dig the no vending rule dispite being self emplyed as an artist and actualy selling stuff elswhere, it's like a vacaton. Plus, it is well worth $145 to be free of commercialization for a week. ESPECIALY HAVING TO SELL MY OWN STUFF. Promoting and selling my own work is a pain in the neck, I hate that part so much that if I could hold down a regular job i would.
I took the road less traveled, and now I would like to go back and find the paved one.
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lmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Postby dj big E » Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:25 am

,lmao,lmao, :twisted: ,lmao, :twisted: ,lmao :twisted: ,lmao, :twisted:,lmao,lmao,lmao,lmao,lmao,lmao,!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now if we can take the carcasses and make an installation and force the rainbow people to camp theyre lmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! DJ BIG "E" hey by the way for all you headstrong and hardcore and those with the finances srl will be doing a huge show in las vegas around feb 7th i believe going to be one of theyre largest venues theyve used in a while hoping for some good destruction myself lmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And remember laugh mother fucker don't cry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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