most clueless burner

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Postby Lydia Love » Fri Oct 10, 2003 11:06 am

mocking your retarded cousin for kicks.


How the hell did you know?
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Postby PJ » Fri Oct 10, 2003 11:10 am

Seen on T-shirt:

"If God hadn't meant for us to laugh at crippled children, He wouldn't have made them so funny looking."
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Postby Markov Chaney » Fri Oct 10, 2003 11:28 am

Lydia Love wrote:How the hell did you know?


I used a crystal ball of clairaudience.
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Postby Patience » Fri Oct 10, 2003 12:59 pm

Thank you, Lydia. It's so hard being a misunderstood artist. Alas.

Read some of the posts leading up to mine. Find a story about a cruel asshole demeaning a harmless, well-intentioned creature who, for some reason, can't or won't just haul off and bite the son of a bitch. Draw your own conclusions.

The bit about calling the dog Humanities 232 is true, tho.
It's not that I hate you. It's just that I'm a much better person than you.
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Postby PJ » Fri Oct 10, 2003 5:45 pm

Patience wrote:...why does the dog keep coming back for more?


Part of the problem is the inherent obsequiousness of many breeds of lapdogs. One of my gay male friends, suffering from early-onset mid-life crisis, decided to get a pet since he'd "never get to have children." Knowing fuck-all about animals he bought one of those useless little dogs; the only things it could do were shiver and piss. I tried to ignore it but somehow it could sense that I didn't like it. No matter how many other people were in the house it would ALWAYS come over to me, cower, whimper, and ache for my approval. Rather than hang out with people that would give it loving attention it sought me out because I was the only person that couldn't stand the pathetic piece of shit.

NO self-respecting animal (working sheep dog, good horse, any cat) would behave that way.
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Postby Isotopia » Fri Oct 10, 2003 5:48 pm

NO self-respecting animal (working sheep dog, good horse, any cat) would behave that way.


This from a man that keeps a calf parked half way up his ass.
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Postby PJ » Fri Oct 10, 2003 5:55 pm

Isotopia wrote:...a man that keeps a calf parked half way up his ass.


That's a cow. Note the head size and the dewlap.

It's sad, how far our modern youth have drifted from our agrarian heritage.
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Postby Guest » Mon Oct 13, 2003 9:47 am

Patience wrote:Find a story about a cruel asshole demeaning a harmless, well-intentioned creature who, for some reason, can't or won't just haul off and bite the son of a bitch. Draw your own conclusions.



Maybe the harmless, well-intentioned creature sees the pain that the cruel asshole is in and just wants to help alleviate that pain, because it can see a good and loving person in there where even the person themselves cannot.
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Postby Phydeau » Wed Oct 15, 2003 7:07 am

Kinetic wrote:
Most DPW have attitudes to begin with, and then to have them become Chupacubra on top of that....now I get it.

And I wanted to be a Ranger next year....a little run in with Chupacubra could be fun. Protecting innocent goats....yeah, right. Anyone can put on black clothes and pretend to be badass. Can they really scare me?


I was considering showing up early to experience some of Black Rock City being created and to hopefully assist. More importantly to me, I wanted to stay a week after to assist in the cleanup. Is this an error in judgement for a Burn Virgin?
Afterall, last thing I want to do is to spend half this year's earnings to gain new experiences ... and have those experiences be negative.
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Postby Alpha » Wed Oct 15, 2003 7:48 am

Jumping in with both feet, Phydeau wrote:I was considering showing up early to experience some of Black Rock City being created and to hopefully assist. More importantly to me, I wanted to stay a week after to assist in the cleanup. Is this an error in judgement for a Burn Virgin?


I would say there's some risk to planning on spending 2-3 weeks on the playa when you've never been there before. If you err in your supplies (the right clothing, enough food/water, remedies for playa foot, etc) you might get by (with help from others) for a couple days but anything more than that and you risk having a miserable time.

Nevertheless, I think getting involved with the volunteerism of it is an excellent way to have a good virgin experience at BM, as long as you also budget time for soaking it in.

If you decide to stay that long, I would suggest camping with some experienced burners who don't mind looking out for you a bit. Lots of people are willing to help those who can help themselves, just keep building those relationships over the next 10 months. I'd be happy to take on a virgin but work constraints prevent me from spending that much time on the playa (dammit).
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Postby III » Wed Oct 15, 2003 8:24 am

> I was considering showing up early

this has become a problem, and the llc has made overtures (although not very good ones) of addressing it this year. expect them to get more serious about it in the future.

the party starts on monday. before that, people are busting ass trying to get things ready. if you really want to go out early, make sure you contact the volunteer department and get an okay from them. but i really really recommend against it for a rookie. if you like the event, you can stay behind afterwards and help clean up, and get your extra weeks in that way...
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Postby blyslv » Wed Oct 15, 2003 8:41 am

Phydeau wrote:I was considering showing up early to experience some of Black Rock City being created and to hopefully assist. More importantly to me, I wanted to stay a week after to assist in the cleanup. Is this an error in judgement for a Burn Virgin?
Afterall, last thing I want to do is to spend half this year's earnings to gain new experiences ... and have those experiences be negative.


The first question you have to ask is how much you like camping, and how prepared you are to thrive in a harsh environment. So that's 2 questions, so sue me. I think I remember in another thread you saying that you did not have much experience camping, but I could be wrong. Figure out your systems - hygeine, food, shelter, sleep and honestly answer whether that will sustain you for 2-3 weeks. Also how acustomed to physical labor are you? Do your muscles luxuriate in a lactic acid bath or do you blanch at the sight of a hammer?

And finally I say this next thing not to harsh on you but to learn more about your attitude and mindset. I fear that viewing BM as an "experience" to be purschased will cloud your judgment. You will purchase much on the way, and expend much of your treasure, perhaps (you don't need to and can still make a huge contribution), but you will MAKE BM, not experience it. Or perhaps I should say "you SHOULD make BM, not experience it..." It could be just semantics and me being a prissy, dogmatic old coot, but the last sentence quoted above speaks of a rather passive attitude and that could leave a sour taste in your mouth. And as far as I know, phydough is best wrapped around a mixture of chopped apples, nuts and cinnimon and lovingly baked, and then washed down with copius amounts of retsina.
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Postby Phydeau » Wed Oct 15, 2003 11:20 am

Alpha: If you err in your supplies (the right clothing, enough food/water, remedies for playa foot, etc) you might get by (with help from others) for a couple days but anything more than that and you risk having a miserable time.


Agreed 110% here. If you don't mind my longwindedness, (is that even a word?) this is what I've got "planned" so far.
[list]
[*] Shelter: Pricing on tents is not too consumer friendly. For the space/stability I desire, it seems more cost effective to build a small dome (besides, this is a hell of alot more fun!). I've already drawn/calculated the frame, purchased about 1/2 the material, and drafted the pattern for the covering (at least as far as my unstable math can tell). [small] Side note: I found 3/4 EMT at an old hardware shop that was going out of business for only $1.50 per 10'. Sadly, I only wish he had more. [/small]
[*] Food and water: What I've read tells me that a good rule of thumb for water is 2.5 gallons per person, per day. That's 35 gallons. I'm planning for at least 60 gallons for myself alone. Should be safe. (What I don't use, I can share or take home or something) As for food, I'm finding a wealth of information here, on eplaya about what to bring, even preparation but virtually nothing concerning quantity. So, I'm intending on making sure that I take at least 2 or 3 camping trips in both the winter and summer here in the Texas heat down south of here. This will not only help me work out some of those inevitable "oops" moments with the shelter but, more importantly, get some idea of what amount of food I require alone. Ironically, after a childhood with a large family, followed by a life of parenting/single parenting, I truly have no clue how much food I eat. I work at a Papa John's Pizza, ffs. I haven't eaten out of my 'fridge, but a handful of occasions, in nearly a year. :)
[*] Gifts: In addition to random acts of kindness and remaining plethora of pamperings I might share, I'd really like to have something "material" I can give to people that I bond with and those that may touch my life powerfully, in some fleeting way. I've had a few ideas, but I'm still uncertain what would make better gifting; Creature comforts (ie; cold Fruit Juices, cigarettes or dust masks) or something like a "souvenier from when I met Phydeau at BM2004" [small] Any advice on this particular item would be greatly appreciated. [/small]
[*] Costumes: Ugh ... this is a very difficult one for me. I really seem to be defective in this department. [small] Seriously, my costume for halloween for ages simply been a post-it! note with "BOO!!!" written on it stuck to my chest. (or reasonable facimile. I have donned a dress twice at company halloween parties ... with disasterous results. I really make one ugly female.) [/small] I have had only one idea thus far. My "uniforms" from when I'm doing road work for the bands are either black or white shirts with "Security" or "Staff" or "Drum Tech" or something similar screened onto them. I'm thinking of making a dozen or so up with things printed on them like "Virgin", "Spectator", "Participant", "Dancer", "Singer", "volunteer" and of course the "Burner" to wear out the gate when I finally leave. I'll have a camelback and can roll thinner shirts into remarkably small "packages" so, carrying them to change frequently shouldn't be too difficult. If it gets too bulky, I can always pack lighter later. However, I suspect this would be more "performance art" than a costume. I've got a long while before this one becomes a priority, though. I'm certain I'll decide on something.
[*] Comfort, Convience, Hygine and Medical: Haven't really made it too far in my research here yet. Pretty certain that most will be "common sense items" but have "specialized" necessities (lemon juice to cancel reaction to base alkaline, SPF 8,000,000 lotion, goggles, dust masks, etc) on my "to do" list.

Alpha: Nevertheless, I think getting involved with the volunteerism of it is an excellent way to have a good virgin experience at BM, as long as you also budget time for soaking it in.


Well, not meaning to sound selfish, but I'm planning to only "budget" volunteer time shortly before and then ~week after the event to help the conservation effort, and to give a little love and care to the very earth that just shared itself with me (something that will provide me much personal satisfaction). Unless, of course, I discover somewhere that "feels natural" to labor. I say this not so much out of laziness, rather that I don't want to commit to anything I might neglect or forget about. (I've already read of many virgins losing all concept of time the first few days) Oh, and given the obvious exceptions such as "insisting" I clean up the waste when someone has shared their meal with me, for example.

Alpha: If you decide to stay that long, I would suggest camping with some experienced burners who don't mind looking out for you a bit. Lots of people are willing to help those who can help themselves, just keep building those relationships over the next 10 months. I'd be happy to take on a virgin but work constraints prevent me from spending that much time on the playa (dammit).


Here's where I am hesitant to follow your advice. Yes, I want to arrive a day or so early so that I can choose a good campsite and hopefully meet some friends and voluenteer a little bit in helping some larger camps get setup. I want to camp on my own, but would prefer to be neighboring a group of participants in a single camp. Heh, kinda like bachelor living in the 'burbs. Got great neighbors that you chat with over the fence, but can have privacy on your own terms when you desire it, without being antisocial. I dunno, I could be offbase here. I'm leaving this option open for a while. While I do take pride in my self-reliance, having the guidance of a seasoned veteran with a level head could prove to be invaluable towards maximizing my experience.

III wrote:this <arriving pre-event> has become a problem, and the llc has made overtures (although not very good ones) of addressing it this year. expect them to get more serious about it in the future.


Ah, very valuable information. Thanx for the head's up.

III wrote:the party starts on monday. before that, people are busting ass trying to get things ready. if you really want to go out early, make sure you contact the volunteer department and get an okay from them. but i really really recommend against it for a rookie. if you like the event, you can stay behind afterwards and help clean up, and get your extra weeks in that way...


Yes, I had already planned to contact them and submit a volunteer questionaire, in the event that I choose to arrive pre-event. Additionally, I'll be certain to contact the Guardians about staying after to assist in cleanup.
Lurking about these forums the last week or so, I've seen plenty of sound advice you've offered, so I am definately not rebuttaling you here, but in the interest of my personal edification, would you mind sharing your reasons for such a strong recommendation to not arrive a day or two in pre-event? It seems logical (to my inexperienced eyes) that meeting a few people and possibly assisting a larger camp to setup would prove to be beneficial in selecting a good place to camp near people that I'm confident are of like minds. Kinda like "neighborhood shopping". Again, I'm not disregarding your advice, just wanting a little clarification of the "cons" of early arrival.
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Postby Tiahaar » Wed Oct 15, 2003 11:51 am

Move over Martha, you've got competition. Resist the urge to stress over camp location as a reason to go early.
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Postby Phydeau » Wed Oct 15, 2003 12:04 pm

blyslv wrote:
The first question you have to ask is how much you like camping, and how prepared you are to thrive in a harsh environment. So that's 2 questions, so sue me. I think I remember in another thread you saying that you did not have much experience camping, but I could be wrong. Figure out your systems - hygeine, food, shelter, sleep and honestly answer whether that will sustain you for 2-3 weeks. Also how acustomed to physical labor are you? Do your muscles luxuriate in a lactic acid bath or do you blanch at the sight of a hammer?


You are correct, I do not have alot of experience in camping. I do have a very strong passion for nature and being close to it. Additionally, I live an incredibly simple life with very few "luxury items" by choice. So, I'm confident that the camping portion of this event will be quite a rewarding challenge.

blyslv wrote:
And finally I say this next thing not to harsh on you but to learn more about your attitude and mindset. I fear that viewing BM as an "experience" to be purschased will cloud your judgment. You will purchase much on the way, and expend much of your treasure, perhaps (you don't need to and can still make a huge contribution), but you will MAKE BM, not experience it.

I didn't take the comment negatively at all, s'all good. When I use the term "experience" I mean that quite literally. There is very little in this world that I do not view as "an experience". For it's thru our experiences that we learn, grow and hopefully one day attain wisdom. But, I digress, that is another topic. As for viewing this as "a purchase" and "expending my treasure" I must have really miscommunicated my thoughts (not an uncommon event). The lessons I desire and seek in this world can not be purchased. They are earned Just to give you an idea of who I've grown to be over the years; Long ago, I did work 100 to 120 hours a week, earning far beyond my needs and eventually became shallow, greedy and completely miserable with who I was. That was almost 10 years ago. Now that my children are no longer with me and I am free of obligations, I only work enough hours to support my needs and a very short list of luxuries. My time is spent doing charity work and voluenteering my time for causes that steadily bring me closer to karmaic balance. In short, I assure you, I don't have "consumer's eyes".

blyslv wrote:Or perhaps I should say "you SHOULD make BM, not experience it..." It could be just semantics and me being a prissy, dogmatic old coot, but the last sentence quoted above speaks of a rather passive attitude and that could leave a sour taste in your mouth. And as far as I know, phydough is best wrapped around a mixture of chopped apples, nuts and cinnimon and lovingly baked, and then washed down with copius amounts of retsina.


Nah, yer not being prissy or oversensitive at all ... people's phrasings usually reveal their intent more accurately than their statements seem at face value. "If you never ask, you may never know"

I would like to make sure that I openly admit my "shortcomings" here in regards to my participation levels. "freedom of self expression" is something I'm lacking. I can't provide any insight as to what I can directly contribute to the experience, for this stage of my growth is about me finding out who I am beneath this fascade I've programmed myself to be. It's npt that I'm expecting anyone in this community to heal me or guide me to the answer to my identity crisis. I merely expect most the people I meet to be themselves and be as honest and open with me as I will be with them. If that one expectation can be met, at least by most participants I interact with, there are good odds that someone's unique ability to express themselves might inspire me to follow suit. Ya never know, I might cross paths with a kindred mind that will trigger one of those valuable moments of clarity where we get the rare opportunity to understand ourselves better by understanding another. I might even be so lucky as to inspire someone myself and return the energy and experience I've gained to the cycle.

Ack ... I'm way past my usual sleep time and am starting to ramble from being tired ... damn ADHD. My apologies for being so lengthy, I don't do it often, I promise :)

Thanx to all that have provided me with so much helpful feedback here and in other posts. It's welcomed and appreciated.
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Postby Alpha » Wed Oct 15, 2003 12:50 pm

Phydeau wrote:You are correct, I do not have alot of experience in camping.


Let me reiterate my suggestion that you camp with/near experienced burners whom you've made contact with before the event. Since Ivy hasn't piped up, I'll do it for her: maybe check out SoloCollective (http://www.netquirks.com/solo/).

I'm an experienced camper and have been to BM 4 times. This year I still found myself borrowing (small) things from my campmates. I'm sure I could have gotten by without the help but it made my life easier.

Gifts are hard. Every year I've fallen into the trap of bringing worthless crap that no one wants. :-) This came up in some other threads, but think about what makes you You and tap into that. Where are you from? What are your hobbies? What's your favorite book/poem/song? Your gift needn't be valuable but it will be most cherished if it comes from you.

As for costumage, consider wearing the Post-It note and nothing else. :-) Or go to a local thrift store and look for the craziest stuff that will fit you. Or don't -- as has been discussed in detail in other threads, you shouldn't feel like you MUST be in costume.

The most important thing to bring is an open mind.
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hardly clueless

Postby shiradawn » Wed Oct 15, 2003 4:52 pm

You're welcome! I realize you could have ended up getting booted from another camp and then you truly might have felt clueless....but it worked out just fine.

It was an honor to have you with us.
:wink:

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Founder/Total Fox, JC's Cirque Du Sacrilege



keepthebeat wrote:Sometimes being clueless can work out for the better. I need to share my own clueless behavior.


This year I went to the Burn alone, having broken with my Burnmate from last year. I arrived Monday at dusk, excited and optimistic for adventure. I located a great spot, not to close but still walking distance to Center Camp. The people around me smiled but no words were exchanged, just pleasant nods. I quickly set tent, shade canopy, carpet, inflatable mattress etc. I grab a quick bite and then take off on my bike to visit the man. That night I sleep like a baby after a cold one.

The next AM I awaken before the heat of the day and on the way to the potties, realize I am spread out in a theme camp area. What an idiot I am. I wander over to the nearest person and introduce myself. They don't have a clue as to which camp I have crashed on as it is not theirs. I then wander over to the second person I see and they tell me that I should move as they think that the area will fill up and they will need the room for the rest of their camp.

Here I am, spread out and unpacked, thinking how the fuck am I going to stuff everything back into my compact car as the heat of the day is coming. Faced with this fact, I decide to ask a third person who appears to be part of the camp I have crashed and also happens to be a total fox. I tell her how I realized my mistake and that I was at her mercy but that I really did not relish the idea of packing up.

A brief pause and then the glorious words, "would you like to join our camp"

"hell yeah", I reply.

In the end made some great friends and find out that the person who said I should leave was actually from an adjacent camp area and didn't know her own boundaries.


Thank you to Shira and the JC Cirque de Sacrilege
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Postby III » Wed Oct 15, 2003 5:24 pm

>in the event that I choose to arrive pre-event.

i apparently did not make myself clear:

do not plan on showing up pre-event *until* you hear from them that they need your services.

it is very likely, given your 2-3 week time frame, that you will be informed that there is no way to make use of your services, and would you rather volunteer with something during the event instead.
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Postby Phydeau » Wed Oct 15, 2003 10:00 pm

III wrote:>in the event that I choose to arrive pre-event.

i apparently did not make myself clear:

do not plan on showing up pre-event *until* you hear from them that they need your services.

it is very likely, given your 2-3 week time frame, that you will be informed that there is no way to make use of your services, and would you rather volunteer with something during the event instead.


No, you were crystal clear. I didn't mention waiting for authorization because I felt that it was common sense and didn't need mentioning.

Judging by the reactions I'm receiving, I think it should be mentioned that very little of what I have planned is "written in stone". Nor was it my desire to arrive far in advance. Just to arrive a day or possibly two prior to the rush. Upon my day's reflection, I've decided I will most likely arrive a few hours early and just enter upon opening.
Yes, the fact that your advice has been so matter-of-factly stated was a large portion of my deciding factors. However, it has occurred to me that if I were to arrive early, I'd most likely miss out on ringing the bell with so many others and many other small details that I've read so many hold dear.

All that being said, is it safe to assume that staying over after the event to clean up other's negligence is welcome for all that actually contribute to the effort? I certainly hope so.
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Postby III » Wed Oct 15, 2003 11:25 pm

>ringing the bell

there's generally not so much a ringing of the bell as a bunch of harried workers trying to get their stuff done as the party's going. imagine your hostess cleaning the toilets as the guests are getting ready for their second coktail, and you'll get an idea of what it can be like.

you'll be there for a week, and the good stuff doesn't get done until well into it. while there's no time to see it all, there's not much use in trying to squeeze every last second out of it.

>is it safe to assume that staying over after the event to clean up

unless things have changed, yeah. swing by the dpw, or the volunteers camp, and ask about the coordination. generally, you should be at the morning meeting at 7:00 (starting on tuesday after the event) to figure out what the plan for the day is, and hook up with a crew.
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Postby DE FACTO » Wed Oct 22, 2003 5:56 am

The most clueless burners are the ones that don't get
DE FACTO'S/DIGIMANS posts.
even though...........
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Postby Badger » Wed Oct 22, 2003 9:28 am

The most clueless burners are the ones that don't get
DE FACTO'S/DIGIMANS posts.


Self-aggrandizing poop if ever there was - especially in regards to Digiman. Wreckless, incosiderate and banal were his only hallmarks and his only contribution to this forum.

All post, no substance.

Certainly the criteria for most clueless e-Playan.
Last edited by Badger on Wed Oct 22, 2003 2:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby DE FACTO » Wed Oct 22, 2003 11:08 am

Badger wrote:
The most clueless burners are the ones that don't get
DE FACTO'S/DIGIMANS posts.


Self-aggrandizing poop if ever there was - especially in regards to Digiman. Wreckless, incosiderate and banal was his only hallmark and his only contribution to this forum.

All post, no substance.

Certainly the criteria for most clueless e-Playan.


Well there are more than enough people that have a clue as to what the threads are about and use them. They just keep comming back up to the top some how. They're not as abrasive as some flammers can be here.

I think that's what bothers some here. The fact that there is new blood here that has other topics that others can relate to other than being negative to the nubies.

I think thats a good thing.
even though...........
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Postby stuart » Wed Oct 22, 2003 11:27 am

They just keep comming back up to the top some how.


cites?
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Postby Tiara » Wed Oct 22, 2003 3:41 pm

Phydeau,

It sounds like you are well on your way to being as prepared as possible. That's great! If only everyone took preparations so seriously, there wouldn't be as many "clueless burner" stories to tell.

I just wanted to make sure that you got a point that III made (though not in so many words). . . if you are not on one of the volunteer crews, you will not be on "the list" and will not be allowed through the gates early.

Yes, many people manage to slip in early who are not on "the list". But it doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. Furthermore, there's just not a lot going on before the event opens--just a lot of people working hard.

No matter when you arrive, you should be able to find adequate space to camp, and you can find wonderful people to camp near no matter where you are in BRC.
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Re: most clueless burner

Postby DE FACTO » Thu Oct 23, 2003 3:33 am

antron wrote:i picked up a hitch hiker in reno on the way to the burn. he was from japan, making his way across the usa, and wanted to go to burningman.

his english was not very good but better than my japanese. we talked, laughed and pointed most of the way down 447.

we got to empire, and i realized that he didn't travel with much...just a pack...so i asked him what he would eat...and he pulls out this loaf of bread. and then i asked him what he would drink, and he showed me a couple of litres of water.

i felt guilty and wondered whether i should take him to the playa. but at the gas station, he pulls out this wad of bills, and buys a couple of things. we talked some more about what he needed for bm, and i explained about the bus to town. he agreed that he would use it, and get whatever he needed.

well, i let him off at the gate, and he bought his ticket...last i saw him was hiking into the dust.

i don't really think he knew what he was in for...
even though...........
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Postby Zane5100 » Fri Oct 24, 2003 10:47 am

DE FACTO wrote:
Badger wrote:
The most clueless burners are the ones that don't get
DE FACTO'S/DIGIMANS posts.


Self-aggrandizing poop if ever there was - especially in regards to Digiman. Wreckless, incosiderate and banal was his only hallmark and his only contribution to this forum.

All post, no substance.

Certainly the criteria for most clueless e-Playan.


Well there are more than enough people that have a clue as to what the threads are about and use them. They just keep comming back up to the top some how. They're not as abrasive as some flammers can be here.

I think that's what bothers some here. The fact that there is new blood here that has other topics that others can relate to other than being negative to the nubies.

I think thats a good thing.


Define "good."
middle-aged, wannabe-hipster, dilettante
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Postby PetsUntilEaten » Tue Oct 28, 2003 1:17 am

WillSmallPenisRoger?
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Postby DE FACTO » Tue Oct 28, 2003 1:20 am

PetsUntilEaten wrote:WillSmallPenisRoger?


Yeah, what's up with that. do you guys really know them and are they an OH?
even though...........
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Postby PetsUntilEaten » Tue Oct 28, 2003 1:31 am

OH?
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