300 watts bullshit

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300 watts bullshit

Postby DeafGuy » Sat Sep 10, 2005 9:59 am

Our camp and several neighboring camps were heavily disrupted this year by a couple of nearby "rave" camps that had setup heavy duty outdoor speaker systems and then ran them 24/7 for the last few days of the burn.

We had music too but refused to crank it up enough to compete and thus were drowned out the rest of the week (I am ignoring the fact that our 30 or so folks could not sleep when we finally turned in).

"Sound camps" are supposed to be relegated to areas where they provide mimimal disruption to camps which are not strictly about blasting loud music.

The rule for sound outside of the designated areas is 300 watts. What bullshit. Being into sound setups myself, both nearby camps were running no less than 4,000 watts at full, ear-bleed levels.

Complaints to the BRR achieved nada. They claim that "over 300 watts" offending camps get 3 warnings and then get their plug pulled....never happened!

My ears are just now stopping the ringing that makes you think you were at a rock concert. Ouch!

Great way for inconsiderate neighbors to ruin other's hard work and our own BM experience!!!!!

I hope BRC management gets the message and corrects this for 2006!!
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Postby spectabillis » Sat Sep 10, 2005 10:37 am

yeah, there were quite a few over the 300 limit.
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Re: 300 watts bullshit

Postby DVD » Sat Sep 10, 2005 11:07 am

DeafGuy wrote:Our camp and several neighboring camps were heavily disrupted this year by a couple of nearby "rave" camps that had setup heavy duty outdoor speaker systems and then ran them 24/7 for the last few days of the burn.

We had music too but refused to crank it up enough to compete and thus were drowned out the rest of the week (I am ignoring the fact that our 30 or so folks could not sleep when we finally turned in).

"Sound camps" are supposed to be relegated to areas where they provide mimimal disruption to camps which are not strictly about blasting loud music.

The rule for sound outside of the designated areas is 300 watts. What bullshit. Being into sound setups myself, both nearby camps were running no less than 4,000 watts at full, ear-bleed levels.

Complaints to the BRR achieved nada. They claim that "over 300 watts" offending camps get 3 warnings and then get their plug pulled....never happened!

My ears are just now stopping the ringing that makes you think you were at a rock concert. Ouch!

Great way for inconsiderate neighbors to ruin other's hard work and our own BM experience!!!!!

I hope BRC management gets the message and corrects this for 2006!!


Not to diminish your pain- because I too have suffered through that- but yes, we need BMORG to get bigger. More rules to break and ignore please. More people inventing bizzarre arbitrations of unenforcable nonsense. Yes, we need more of that.

Some other guy on another topic had a good idea- talk to them about bringing it down. Also, bring earplugs. Also, try finding a chill camp to crash in for some good sleep. Also, you could arrange a lynch mob of 'concerned neighbors'. These are all things I have had to try before, admittedly with varying degrees of success.

I am sorry. That sonic wall is a shitty thing to unleash on people but don't rely- ever- on 'the system' to work out there. That is why 'the system' often uses 'radical self reliance' as a shield all.

All the best.
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This happened at 3:30 and Delirium

Postby JediDale » Sat Sep 10, 2005 11:12 am

I set up my camp on Sunday afternoon, then comes "Mister Techno Non-Stop" and erects a huge tower and plays from 6:00AM to 2:AM EVERY DAY!! Did that guy EVER SLEEP?? I had techno hallucinations but thought I had been dosed! I had to use Jedi Self Hypnosis to fall asleep! We also had those bottle rocket terrorists fire a few of them off, one sounding like it may have hit just outside my tent. No biggie, except that since I am a fire performer, I had fuel outside (Sealed of course) and had to jump up to make sure I didn't lose my car or tent. Personally, I would like to see more art and less "Mr Souppa DJ Jamma Man" setups. There was plenty of jams happening at "The Deep End" out at 9:00. Perhaps the solution is to have the jams out on the outer rings.


Genuinely,

Jedi Dale Of Reno
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Your unconscious can Do anything It wishes..
But your conscious mind isn't going to do
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Postby b00m3rang » Sat Sep 10, 2005 11:13 am

Yeah, that's unreasonable. I brought a large system, but camped as close as possible to 10:00, out in BFE, and never played for more than a couple hours a day (and never too late into the night/morning). We got one request to turn it down, which we did, before that person decided to move camps. The other 6 or so comments were all positive, usually including gifts and thanks.

I understand wanting to setup and do your thing on the playa, but if you're not in large scale sound area, you can't impose that on your neighbors all day and night.

The fact that we mixed up the house/breaks/DnB with punk/reggae/ska/rock/country/random show tunes/whatever probably helped relations, also.

That said, I think DVD's ideas for dealing with the problem are the most likely to actually work.
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Postby HughMungus » Sat Sep 10, 2005 11:53 am

In that situation I might have moved my entire camp (in fact, I told my campmates that this was a distinct possibility). If complaints to the BRR's and the offending parties wouldn't have solved the problem, I would have disabled the offending sound system (funny how fuses and extension cords and other essential items can mysteriously disappear one day and re-appear on Monday). I have *no* qualms about doing this to a camp if they are being loud where they should not be. You want to be a jackass? Fine. I'll treat you like one. Oh my someone stole your generator! So sad. Maybe it'll turn-up before you leave.

One reason we did not register as a theme camp is because I was afraid the placement would put us in a noisy spot with bad neighbors. Then again, we tend to camp centered but out past the first 4 streets or so (this year we were at 5:45 and Fetish and I personally had no problems with sound this year).
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Postby DeafGuy » Sat Sep 10, 2005 2:46 pm

Great comments all! Glad we weren't the only ones experiencing the pain.

To
DVD, something I should have mentioned was that BEFORE WHINING TO BRR we did go to the primary offending camp and discuss the situation with their "leader" and "DJ". We explained that since they were not in the designated "ear blowing" areas they had to abide by the 300 watt rule (despite packing in 10 times that capability). They were very, very polite (which frankly suprised me) but said "dude, blame the BM placement....we should've been out by the loud camps and they put us here..." They flatly refused to turn their knobs one bit.

On a side note, we found out from the BRR that regardless of the reason these guys weren't on the fringe they were not allowed to operate more than 300 watts....but inaction followed those discussions.

To
DallasPlaya, several of our camp members grew increasingly irritated at the situation (mostly due to sleep dep) and "voted" to disable/vandalize the rave camps equipment. Most of the rest of us were able to prevail on them as no one wanted violence or worse. Rumors of a similar situation last year had the BRR actually hunting down the vandals rather than dealing with the over-powered system in the first place!!

Our camp was way too complex (and took 3 days to build) for us to consider moving. Ultimately, I just chalked it up to life in the default world....we all can't pick our neighbors.
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Postby DVD » Sat Sep 10, 2005 3:50 pm

DeafGuy wrote:On a side note, we found out from the BRR that regardless of the reason these guys weren't on the fringe they were not allowed to operate more than 300 watts....but inaction followed those discussions.


This doesn't seem to be an uncommon relationship.

If you want to hook up next year, I'd be happy to camp near you. We play music at dusk (100W) and then shut it down until the next day.

We could make a whole new 'area' like Husville but call it the 'Suburbs' or something similarly icky.
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Jedi Agree totally!!

Postby JediDale » Sun Sep 11, 2005 12:51 am

I am with you guys. Maybe 2 large areas should be designated as Hushville. One around 4:00 and one around 8:00. WHy should people be denied relative centralization just to be able to get proper rest? Several people told me to set up a tent one the walk in part, out past Hysteria, and have another for in close fun. Sounds to me like a lot of work, and then who would secure the tents in the outer rim? Art to me seems to more of a visual expression rather than an auditory one, so limiting the
Mista DJ JAmmy Jizm" guys should be implemented, IMHO!


Genuinely,


Jedi Dale Of Reno
You don't have to..Believe Everything I Say...because your unconscious will hear this.
Your unconscious can Do anything It wishes..
But your conscious mind isn't going to do
anything of Importance for Now. And...My Voice Will Go With You...
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Postby Stilesfamily » Sun Sep 11, 2005 6:03 am

Due to unexpected transmission failure half way to the playa this year we did not get to BRC till wed night at which point a nearby rave camp went straight through till 7 in the morning. I wear earplugs but my soul is settled by those few hours of quiet just before dawn on the playa so I kinda woke up frustrated on Thursday. On top of it all we camp in tha AEZ, usually the quietest spot on the playa, short of perhaps low density camping. It was not a problem the next few nights and I was shocked by the dead silence on the night of the burn, it was as quiet as a tomb. Did anyone else notice that? I would not be surprised if we went back to the old theme camp placement system next year.
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Postby unjonharley » Sun Sep 11, 2005 9:58 am

I slept alright. Except for BRC rangers coming home. It was in the wee hours of the morning. They were riding on a sound barge and screaming for people to get up. Sound barges need to stay out of the burbs after midnight. It is very plane those that come out late are there to annoy others. There was a sound stage way out in the distance. There music was crappy, loud and over amped. There MC run out of stuff and was just talking to hear his head raddel. I dought if anyone was there by that stage. Figred it wass around 10:oo while I was at 6:oo about 3 in the morning. Wish soome one would tell the stupid fuck how bad he sounded.
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Postby DeafGuy » Sun Sep 11, 2005 10:27 am

Ear Plugs - great idea. They work perfectly for "reasonable" sound levels, people talking outside a tent, etc. They do nothing when you have a couple thousand watts of speaker power across a road pointed straight at your camp.

We were there from Sunday on. The first few days there was lots of noise, roaming art cars/sound projects, people yelling just because they were happy...etc. All of that was perfectly survivable (and even acceptable/understandable) until the rave machines cranked up. At that point nothing could stop the tremendous bass which rattles every molecule of your body. Ouch. The only people who slept in our camp were taking a variety of drugs and alcohol...dangerous way to get some shuteye.

And that's the sleep part. What was just as bad and ultra-discourteous was how the 2 surrounding rave camps simply trashed our camp with sound. We had sound too but nothing that could (not that we would) compete. Thus you could not listen to our sound, talk or even think within our camp. Ridiculous.

Next year better enforcement or bad things happen.....
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Postby horseradish » Sun Sep 11, 2005 10:48 am

Ear plugs do nothing to prevent the boom-boom-boom of heavy bass from transmitting through the ground into your body, tent or RV.

[quote]
The fact that we mixed up the house/breaks/DnB with punk/reggae/ska/rock/country/random show tunes/whatever probably helped relations, also. [/quote]

I wish there were more camps that played a mix of music. As someone who puts up with (rather than enjoys) techno, I think a lot of camps would gain themselves friends by playing something more than just hard-nosed electronica.
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Postby DVD » Sun Sep 11, 2005 10:53 am

DeafGuy wrote:Next year better enforcement or bad things happen.....


Now now. Don't get yourself in a jam by proclaiming 'bad things'. Remember the three fold rule. I like the activism proposal involving the active mysterious dissappearnce of certain electrical cords and such.

Just don't let it descend in to violence or hardcore vandalism, please. It's just not worth it.
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Postby DeafGuy » Sun Sep 11, 2005 12:35 pm

DVD-you are 100% right!!! I re-read what I posted and think it sounds like a threat....frankly I don't know what I mean.

I talked several campmates OUT of vandalizing our neighbors generators. It actually created a little friction within our camp...that sucks, huh?

I guess what I would do next year is not just go talk to the Rangers but accompany them to the offending camp (after making at least one attempt to work it out without BRR). I hate the idea of taking the "rule book", highlighting the appropriate section and then berating the offender or possibly the BRR into action. But we won't let this happen again next year.

Violence or vandalism...no way. I agree, thanks for pointing it out.
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Postby The Bass » Sun Sep 11, 2005 12:42 pm

flood their zone, and kill em with kindness.

let them understand who you are as people, and try to find out who they are.

it can work.

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Postby unjonharley » Sun Sep 11, 2005 12:54 pm

WE as a city could suggest to BMorg to preresgister a sound stages intent. That way they would be in agreement with the org. Breaking that agreement could be dealt with.
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Postby WebGraphics » Sun Sep 11, 2005 2:29 pm

I hope this doesn't sound insensitive, but I can and did sleep under the super loud rave dj music. I slept in Center Camp a couple times with chattering and performances going on, and usually I got a seat right in front of the speaker.

I have slept in apartments where people are stomping loudly upstairs and still got to sleep fine (most of my roomates didn't though).

So you could do all that stuff (complain, earplugs, lynchmob) OR you could try to learn to sleep very in very loud environments.

It has always surprised me how easily some people fall alseep in front of a loud telivision, in a loud classroom or in a cramped, nousy and uncomfortable vehicle but they cannot stand a drum beat coming from across the street at a drunken teenage party.

Well I guess people are all different, and I do sympathise with your lack of sleep. I guess all I can really do is wish you a comfortable sleep tonight!
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Postby angelface » Sun Sep 11, 2005 6:07 pm

umm.. that whole "just fall asleep even with all the noise" thing doesn't work so well for many people, especially those of us who deal with insomnia even in quiet envrionments off playa..

After a year of being next to a "mis-placed" rave camp, I feel for all the people who've had to suffer through a week of that much sleep dev.. trust me, it's not fun. A little respect for the people around you is all we're asking, running several hundred watts of sound outside the loud areas 24/7 is just fucking rude.. why is their experience more important than everyone elses'?
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my experience

Postby cowgirl » Sun Sep 11, 2005 7:18 pm

ok - it was the one thing this year that irked me and DID not destroy my time BUT:

we had neighbors a few camps down who brought 700 watts and me and my camp had to shout over each other in our shade. this was nearly 1/2 block away. we were at times going nuts over the noise.

i had an event which required music and had a measley 170 watts. i asked them repeatedly to turn their music down during this time.

'you gotta talk to the dj' was what i was told. they turned it down bit and then turned it BACK UP during my class.

frequently they had less than 5 people lingering around the camp. most likely just their own crew.

and they didn't speak to their neighbors or openly engage with anyone not a part of their scene all week.

**yeah this shit bothers me... but its about being a good fucking neighbor moreso than enforcing rules and regulations.**
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Re: my experience

Postby DVD » Sun Sep 11, 2005 7:51 pm

cowgirl wrote:**yeah this shit bothers me... but its about being a good fucking neighbor moreso than enforcing rules and regulations.**


Precisely.

Tangent-
What I wonder about is why, in general, peoplehave such a hard time voicing their opinion or wishes about these things in person.. Is it a fear of being shouted down or fear of appearing wrong? Is it not fear at all and just not wanting to be an imposition? Is it an inablity to express anything but rage in the face of a challenge?

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Postby HughMungus » Sun Sep 11, 2005 7:56 pm

unjonharley wrote:I slept alright. Except for BRC rangers coming home. It was in the wee hours of the morning. They were riding on a sound barge and screaming for people to get up. Sound barges need to stay out of the burbs after midnight. It is very plane those that come out late are there to annoy others. There was a sound stage way out in the distance. There music was crappy, loud and over amped. There MC run out of stuff and was just talking to hear his head raddel. I dought if anyone was there by that stage. Figred it wass around 10:oo while I was at 6:oo about 3 in the morning. Wish soome one would tell the stupid fuck how bad he sounded.


I can't remember if it was this thread or another but I suggested that there be streets where art cars/sound barges are NOT allowed to go. I'm thinking anywhere beyond Fetish or so should be a no-art-car zone (for various reasons, some not related to sound).
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Postby d6 » Sun Sep 11, 2005 10:05 pm

partial playlist from our camp,
please note *one* complaint re: "johnny cash, again?"

COIL
KRAFTWERK
WING
GOLDEN THROATS COMPILATIONS
JACK DANGERS / MEAT BEAT MANIFESTO
MASSIVE ATTACK
PORTISHEAD
DJ SPOOKY
MOST MO WAX LABEL RELEASES
BJORK
JOHNNY CASH, including gifted JC cd given to us by neighbors
PLASTIKMAN
THE LIARS
MOGWAI
MAD PROFESSOR
GODFLESH
CICCONE YOUTH
BLACK SABBATH
BALLY SAGOO
THE RAPTURE
SLUG
PJ HARVEY
RADIOHEAD
DESPISE YOU
MELT BANANA
THE INKSPOTS
CIBO MATTO
MAN OR ASTROMAN?
DAVID BOWIE
HYBRID............................
..........................etc,etc blahblahblah.........
the musickal style changed every hour or so, depending on what equipment worked, and the general mood of our mostly agreeable immediate neighbors.
even then, we'd only operate a couple hours during the day and/or night, (night=when the winds allowed for the screen to be used,never past 1am)

we were in the "quiet" zone (2:45/bipolar), and it seemed like 75% of our neighbors had mightier sound than we, (which was actually overflowing drifting sound from other streets)
but onward we marched,
complaining sometimes due to alkaloid poisoning versus negative sleep,
which finally wore off after friday.........


ugh.

d6,
looking for the ice cream bar...........
your witty rejoinder just flew over my head.....

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camps you don't want to be near: Brain Wash & Set

Postby mickle » Sun Sep 11, 2005 10:32 pm

I think we should start listing the camps that were too loud,
so people will be aware of them next year.
I was camped across the street from Brain Wash & Set
at 7:30 & Ego. These guys set up a large disco dome and
were way over the sound limits on Thurs, Fri and Sat nights.

I will add one good thing, on two of the nights we went over
and asked them to turn it down, and they did a little. But
one night it was really loud and we went over around 3am,
and the place was empty, just a few guys packing stuff up.
This is really rude and inconsiderate behavior.
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hmmmmmmm

Postby dj big E » Mon Sep 12, 2005 8:21 am

While on emt duty overnight I noticed that the city was very quiet between 830 and430 and behind catharsus may i suggest camping in these areas. I camp at 930 and catharsus and it's loud allnight but i am prepared for this. Allthough the last two years there is someone with a very loud sound system that plays a 15-20 minute cd continous 24-7 I know it's the same poeple because the songs the fucking same. Nekt year i will disable this system i promise you fucks. Lmao DJ BIG E
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Postby d6 » Mon Sep 12, 2005 8:25 am

BIG E -
wasnt by chance "the double dutch bus" was it?
we had to hear that fucking "song" endlessly in 2002, and have always feared for its return...............

d6,

einst!
your witty rejoinder just flew over my head.....

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Lmao

Postby dj big E » Mon Sep 12, 2005 9:18 am

No it's a certified trance fucking anthem lmao. The thing about it is everytime it ends for some reason i wake up for a second then theres this 5 second pause then bam bam bam it starts all over. I know other campers know what i am talking about because last year when it stopped i could here cheers in several directions .I have No problems with the sound camps but this is some kind of cruel trance joke lmao. BIG E
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Postby Kinetic IV » Mon Sep 12, 2005 9:57 am

Image

Not that I'm advocating playa justice but....diplomacy does have it's limits. When it falls short these work great.
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Postby DVD » Mon Sep 12, 2005 4:30 pm

Kinetic IV wrote:Not that I'm advocating playa justice but....d


Total tangent-
In your sig "Tell Bush no pre-emptive use of nukes"

Can you even believe that someone has to tell ANYONE that? I just heard that today. What the hell is going on?
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Postby stuart » Tue Sep 13, 2005 3:55 pm

our neighbors bitched about our music after we had a small work party on Saturday before the event opened. Poor guys. They were upset when all we had hooked up were the DJ monitors, albeit at full crank. We knew it would only get louder. I felt a little bad for them but the org put us both on the esplanade. Anyway, midweek they left some burning tikis unattended near some flapping fabric. A member of our camp suffered 2nd degree burns saving their camp from a total flameout after part of their structure caught fire. Needless to say, we garnered a rather haughty attitude when further sound reduction requests were made.

I do want to thank them for playing the De-Phazz cover of 'wait 'til you see him' once a day. It's one of my favorite tracks EVER.
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