Black Rock City Address System Unveiled

No matter your skills or interests, there's a way for you to participate in the creation and manifestation of Black Rock City, both at the event and year-round.

Finding Camps is:

Good
21
48%
Bad
7
16%
Indifferent
16
36%
 
Total votes : 44

Black Rock City Address System Unveiled

Postby Donna Matrix » Sat Dec 22, 2007 10:53 am

Come one, come all!

Two burners have come up with an address system for Black Rock City.

SO WE CAN FIND CAMPS

Can be used in the Who, What, Where Booklet for your camp address; for the BRC Post Office; Rangers; Medical; etc..

Check it out:
http://63.195.16.5/~donna/BRC/index.html

And please, give us your feedback here.

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Postby motskyroonmatick » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:50 pm

I like the system although it is a bit complex. That complexity will help make deliveries more accurate and sucessfull but I would have to use a reference card to address anything. I have found using an estimation of the to the minute time that I am at on the circular street works well.
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I did not know what the exact address was going to be since we were not a registered theme camp.

My actual address turned out to be about 8:38 on G. When at the event I have found that that kind of address allmost allways gets good results.

Maybe BRCPO wants to get involved? Maybe you are BRCPO.
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Postby Donna Matrix » Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:02 pm

I am a greeter and philosopher is BRCPO.

The Who, What, Where booklet last year didn't have any addresses. So, we decided to do something about it.

We formatted the addresses kinda like email addresses with an @.

Just trying to formailize them so we can find camps.
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Postby the fire elf » Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:13 pm

there seems to be a point worth raising...

something along the lines of seeking and finding notions of names and addresses

whether it draws attention away from immersion in the experience and tends more towards sightseeing itinerary or what not


not that it takes any effort not to use a map that's there

but collectively, does it move things toward a group thesis of an effigy left to individualized comprehension?

or parley off into structured fun?
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Postby Valkyrie » Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:17 pm

Interesting idea, but I'm not sure how it gets any better results than the current ad hoc system of estimating the time.

Granted, the further from the man you get, the harder it is to estimate the time (since the radial streets are further apart).

It seems that it'd be a whole lot easier just to have convenient little markers at 5 minute intervals (5 between streets) and then people have as exact an address as you could get.

Since the placement people place everything that goes into the WWW (which I think everyone agrees was pretty incomprehensible this year), and then they place the stakes for those camps, it seems entirely reasonable that these designations can be put in the guide.

Of course, the REAL challenge to all this is getting the camps placed before the guide goes to the printer. If that doesn't get done, then NO system for identification will help in directing people to the events. I have a strong suspicion that the loose confederation of guides we had this year was a result of this very problem.
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Postby Token » Sat Dec 22, 2007 3:44 pm

The site you link to does not format and display well in Firefox so I could not see what you are suggesting. Links overlap so I cannot click in many of the sections.

Either way, I agree with TF Elf on this; makes BM more of a tourist destination which I dislike.

Makes us all tourists.
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Postby the fire elf » Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:45 pm

perhaps not making tourists out of us, as we make ourselves, be it ever in waves of social pressure

but it's the question of how to approach something too big to see

feet that might have gone one way may go another, and is it caused by knowing, or thoughts of something considered known, perhaps even psychosomatic linguistic cues played by whomever whenever
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Postby Donna Matrix » Sat Dec 22, 2007 5:11 pm

The idea is to have each individual camp in control of their address. The camp would put their address into the WWW along with their event. This is already a feature - to input event information via internet schedule.

BMorg already reserves space for orgainzed camps so it would be a two step process.

1. get a area for your camp from BMorg (which is then reserved for your camp)

2. pick a spot in your area for your marker or signpost and make an address to that spot

I, for one, would like to be able to find all the cool stuff I want to go to via the WWW booklet - something I haven't been able to do as of yet (3 years attendant).

As for camps not in WWW, they could register with Info booth after arrival and then others could get the address and just bike to the camp.

I am also in favor of sign post or marker of inside time on the outlying streets. They are quite long and one can get lost quickly. But that would be up to DPW. We could try asking them really really nicely. :)
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Postby Donna Matrix » Sat Dec 22, 2007 5:15 pm

tourist destination?

BM has always had address, the problem has been - it never has worked.

The previous address have never made BM into a tourist destination, so why should this one?
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Postby the fire elf » Sat Dec 22, 2007 5:27 pm

whether or not is actually has an address is a philosophical query in the ballpark of whether people have names

perhaps what wasn't working was a cut and dry approach to allocating your time to bask in pre chosen swaths of 'coolness' (in a habitual mannerism of sell-your-soul-hours land)

this comes down to playing teeny-event promotion at a large event observed and expressed, but at variance with ad clutter



why should i view your map any different from a popup ad from the internet, or one of those commercials from it's predecessor the nefarious tv?
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Postby the fire elf » Sat Dec 22, 2007 5:51 pm

the trick to truly being timely is to do it without looking...

why this guide to looking before leaping?

why not jumpjumphopskip-aroony?
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Postby the fire elf » Sat Dec 22, 2007 5:54 pm

out there the cool denseness is thick enough you don't have to worry 'bout every other wonderful cool and amazing thing you happen to be half a city from

be in zen

taste the sun
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Postby Eric » Sat Dec 22, 2007 6:55 pm

I think whats meant by "tourist destination" is that its a step in just making BRC another city, as opposed to being something different, something outside the ordinary.

To be blunt, this system is waaaaaaaaay to complex to ever catch on. A street a letter, a squiggle... *bleh*. I've never had any problems finding someone with the current system, and, even better, when I go around and ask people for "'Camp Pink Poodle' which is supposed to be around here", I get to meet new people and have some interactions I wouldn't otherwise get. If I was just cruising down the street looking for an address I would never get to meet those people.

I'm out there to get away from the structure of my life, not to bring it with me.
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Postby the fire elf » Sat Dec 22, 2007 7:06 pm

I'm out there to get away from the structure of my life, not to bring it with me.


and its more than easy not to.

like falling in a hole, but giddy fun and suddenly astoundishly delightful

not to poop on her umbrella, or anything, but it wasnt'even raining
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Postby philosopher » Sat Dec 22, 2007 7:16 pm

The address format Donna Matrix and I are proposing is actually quite simple, simpler than "Leave No Trace" seems to be, judging from the obvious difficulty people have in picking up after themselves.

As a long-time Delivery Specialist for the BRCPO who tries to do just about all of it all on foot because of those wonderful serendipitous encounters, I have often had to bring mail back after long treks because of careless addressing. Some of them were post cards with relationship-changing messages on them and suchlike. Doesn't seem right when that happens.

There's no tourism thing going on with this proposal because the tourist attractions are by and large easy to find. It's finding friends and mail recipients that would be so much improved if people used this system.

Of course the BRCPO will attempt to deliver anything, and we have delivered thousands of pieces of US and playa mail using the existing address conventions. But, all sadism and profanity aside, we seriously are looking for ways we can improve our reliability and are delighted that Donna Matrix opened up this conversation last summer.

On the way to the proposal we posted, DM and I went through many possible addressing schemes. There is, for example, a whole discussion of markers that we have left in the background, but one salient point was that any marker that can easily be kidnapped as a souvenir will be. For this reason, we are proposing a system that works without any new markers or labor on the part of the already overworked placement people.

We have been trying over the past few months to come up with an addressing system that was simple and intuitive while still conveying a higher level of useful information than present practice. It will be most helpful if proposals to improve what we have put on the table keep these considerations in mind.
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Postby philosopher » Sat Dec 22, 2007 7:38 pm

Eric wrote:I'm out there to get away from the structure of my life, not to bring it with me.


No one has to use the address system. But for people who want to be found, their wishes will be closer to fulfillment.

Oh, and about that complexity thing, an address is basically street, cross-street, side-of-street. Call me crazy, but I don't think this will cause smoke to pour out of anyone's ears.
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Postby mayavin » Sat Dec 22, 2007 8:57 pm

simple intuition drops the drapes from the windows and walks through psychosolid walls

you task yourself how you see fit, and your gift is kindly met

as put, for your wishes to come closer to fulfilment is a linear/point model of who is who and where is who, and this i kindly neglect to assist, while questioning which way you wish to evolve
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Postby Donna Matrix » Sat Dec 22, 2007 10:45 pm

While we appreciate all comments, we are especiallly interested in comments from those people who might use the system rather than nay-sayers who just want to boo-hoo any system.

It's just fine if you don't want to use this, that, or any system. No problem. We are against coercion of any kind. We are not in any position of power to force anybody to do anything nor do we want to be.

But for those of us who want to find other camps or other people there is a lack of any cohesive method of doing so. Hence, why this system came to be. Any similarity to the default world is not intentional.

Besides, there are no hard and fast rules about what happens up at BM. It's a community in flux. We are just adding a possibility. Who knows what will come of it.
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Postby Toolmaker » Sat Dec 22, 2007 11:03 pm

I like the existing mail address system but agree that additional info could be handy. 4 and C could mean 4 different places so having info as to the direction could greatly ease the workload BRCPO has to do. Rather than get into symbols and whatnot how about this.. "4 and C toward 415 and D". A camp between 4 and 430 could use "415 and C toward 430 and D". A camp across the street could use "415 and C toward 430 and B".

Personally I'm with some of the other about a participants experience. Some of the best times I had were from just wanderin around randomly and chattin it up with folks.
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Postby Donna Matrix » Sat Dec 22, 2007 11:19 pm

What I'm not getting here is why having an address system would stop anybody from wandering around? How would having a decent address system stop people from doing things?

What do you think is going to happen? We are going to form Address Police? Gee whiz...
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Postby The CO » Sun Dec 23, 2007 12:09 am

I'm all for more specificity, but is this setup really that different from what exists now? Camps still won't get their true address till they are out there, and registering at playa info has always been available. I think the most helpful thing would be a return to the old WWW format. Lord knows this years was useless.
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Postby theCryptofishist » Sun Dec 23, 2007 12:14 am

Are we going to be insulted if we don't use the system?
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Postby bigbluedoggy » Sun Dec 23, 2007 12:38 am

Not trying to poo poo on this... just a point of note: Even though a theme camp is told they will be placed at a certain location: 3:00 and Arctic for instance, for the most part you will not know which corner of the intersection you will be at until you get to the playa or even if you are on a corner. You may get some clues from your placer beforehand (thanks Shadow), but generally the specifics of your locale are not given out until you are actually placed when you get there. Same goes for street addresses like E and 8:30. That could be a corner or it could be on either side of 8:30 on either side of E. So really, the only way to get an address published into the WWW is to use the simple coordinates you are given when the placement list comes out, unless the whole system is revamped this year.

IMHO, Your symbols are kind of cool and all, but most people will glaze over when presented with those instructions and just go "huh?" I'd just go with inner or outer when describing which side of a circular street something is on and something like deepside or centercamp side for the radial streets.

My two cents. Thanks.

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Postby philosopher » Sun Dec 23, 2007 1:29 am

theCryptofishist wrote:Are we going to be insulted if we don't use the system?


I'm not sure about this, Fishy, but I think the rule is (1) that you will be insulted if you don't use the system and you are posting on eplaya and (2) you will be insulted if you do use the system and you are posting on eplaya.
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Postby Donna Matrix » Sun Dec 23, 2007 9:46 am

This is a discussion board. We are trying to use it as such.

I realize that often what happens here is snarking, cryptic replys and condemnations. One has to have a thick skin to post here.

Feeling insulted is meaningless because posts can be taken many ways depnidng on how one reads them. Posts are not personal because we don't know each other - we all just reply to posts (posts are not the person).

I am not trying to snark, insult, or annoy. I am trying to help. Maybe everybody needs to examine there own motivation for posting here rather that casting judgments on others.
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Postby oneeyeddick » Sun Dec 23, 2007 9:48 am

I would prefer to be tazered than insulted.
My inner child can't deal with negativity but
my outer child always deserves a spanking.
Maybe walking around with bullhorns could
help carriers find addresses easier ?
It's always worked for me in the past.
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Postby mayavin » Sun Dec 23, 2007 9:49 am

While we appreciate all comments, we are especiallly interested in comments from those people who might use the system rather than nay-sayers who just want to boo-hoo any system.


ostracizing aside, i am interested in system reliance both on and off playa,

and the post system is of particular interest to myself, as apparently i've got a grandfather postman that either discreetly or indiscreetly sired my sire

for me to understand myself is for me to understand how i've come about and to understand how nonliving systems rule peoples lives



didn't tell you not to...
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Postby AKAparttime » Sun Dec 23, 2007 11:26 am

No need to reinvent the wheel hear kids
I'm letting you in on a well kept secret
put a mail box out in front of your camp with camp name on it...
We:
The Embassy
Camp I am
Magic forest
always get our mail in a timely fashion...& people can find us too....
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Postby The CO » Sun Dec 23, 2007 12:15 pm

Ya, out mailbox coupled with the 4'x8' sign at our camp works well.
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Postby Ugly Dougly » Sun Dec 23, 2007 12:24 pm

Not quite chaotic enough for me.
Please to visit PAGE TWO.
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