post what you didn't like about 2011 here

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post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby atomosk » Wed Sep 07, 2011 9:31 am

I ended up going again this year. My first burn was in 2000 and I haven't missed a year so I think I can speak a little bit about how it's changed over the years. Initially the major shift was that it got much much younger 5 or so years ago. Twenty somethings were starting to outnumber those older than them and with them came more electronic music, larger sound camps, a larger overall footprint, and there were many fewer overt attempts at swinger and goddess warship camps. In general, the art has gotten larger and more elaborate. People seem more numerous later into the evenings. Etc.

I also notice that in the last few years there's been another looming demographic shift. Frankly the playa is developing a large ghetto component. People are assholes to each other, pettier and there was so much more bullshit out there this year than others. There seems to be a major graffiti and theft component that didn't exist to this degree even a few years back. There are people out there who would come directly to Burning Man from the gathering of the juggalos and jerk themselves off all week steeling small things from everyone, owning only one fuzzy hat, who live a playa lifestyle driven by the entitlements their lack of empathy as a mere spectator allows them.

There were several borderline personalities I met who seemed to roam in large groups, scaring people and driving them out of otherwise great areas. There were those who were so burnier-than-thou that I heard fights breaking out about peeing on the playa or not wearing enough light while in their own camp and others so boorish they would ride as fast as they could unlit on the esplanade and virgin europeans who would shit in all the RVs around them until they got caught.

Now that we're back e-playa is full of name calling and bitterness and disillusionment. Post burn people are immediately putting each other's lives in danger on the road driving like assholes.

Frankly, burning man is really just a big party in the desert. It has gotten so mainstream that a larger and larger segment of the population every year will not respect any of the principles and other "hippie-crap" and are going just to do whatever they want. Younger people into it ONLY through drugs and EDM and not because of any philiosphiocal reasons are going to sap a lot of fun out if it for the rest of us just like those my age did for the older crowd when we brought massive sound out there in the first place.

In saying all this, I would like to open a thread inviting people to post all the things that really bothered them, people who hurt them, and ways in which you thought this year was different.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby jobi » Wed Sep 07, 2011 9:44 am

I'm kind of bummed that there wasn't a proper whiteout this year. There was only one last year too, on burn night. Are whiteouts too cool for Burning Man now?
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby bluesbob » Wed Sep 07, 2011 9:50 am

I'm sorry to say....but if Burning Man ever dies it will be the 20-somethings who killed it, primarily young men. (I use the word "men" very loosely) They show up by the thousands with no clue about principles and community. They just drink, drug and look for fights. Every ugly or near ugly thing I witnessed involved someone from this age group. They just think BM is a giant club scene where they act out their stupid competition for male dominance.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby atomosk » Wed Sep 07, 2011 9:52 am

Actually there was a whiteout this year, but somebody spray painted a penis on it right away, so it spent the rest of the burn put away. :P
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby Ugly Dougly » Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:01 am

Sorry to hear about your penis.

Any small town is more intimate than a large city. There's no reason this shouldn't be true of BRC. It's just a reality to deal with.

And many similar events - such as Ren Faire - become more formulaic and mainstream as time goes by, that just a given.

It does bother me a little that before Burning Man, people had their own imaginations and creativity to rely on, and created their own events and celebrations. As creative and edgy as Burning Man is, it tends to become a "plug-in" event, and those who can't go to Burning Man often sit around moping rather than finding something else to do.

But all in all, Burning Man is great and wonderful. :)
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby changoloco » Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:09 am

When dancing to Christian Martin at Disco Knights on Friday night, some young kid (25-ish) started trying to dance with my wife, which is fine, I am not the jealous type. Whenever guys dance with my wife, I keep one eye on her to make sure that they don't get out of line. This guy thought that it was time to,literally, grab my wife and pull her towards him. My wife looked obviously scared. I grabbed the kid by the collar and pulled him off of her. I said, "Don't ever fucking grab a woman like that without permission!" His friend came at me, I was wearing my trusty disco-ball helmet. Who the hell tries to fight someone with a helmet on? I looked at them both and shook my head. I told them that they should probably move to another dance floor before there is more trouble than they can deal with. The kids friend still tried to chide me into a fight with him, which, I was refusing to engage. I do however protect my wife whenever she needs it. Luckily one of their other friends was waving a peace sign to me and he helped to get them out of there. The vibe of the young, aggressive, twenty something males is getting a little out of control IMHO.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby devilgrrl » Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:58 am

I didn't like the over officious faux-rastafarian asshole at Center Camp that hassled fellow burners for napping in the wee hours of the morning when no one was there. WTF????
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby theCryptofishist » Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:06 am

devilgrrl wrote:I didn't like the over officious faux-rastafarian asshole at Center Camp that hassled fellow burners for napping in the wee hours of the morning when no one was there. WTF????

It's so people (or drainbows) who didn't bring tents don't squat there making it unpleasant for everyone else.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby devilgrrl » Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:09 am

theCryptofishist wrote:
devilgrrl wrote:I didn't like the over officious faux-rastafarian asshole at Center Camp that hassled fellow burners for napping in the wee hours of the morning when no one was there. WTF????

It's so people (or drainbows) who didn't bring tents don't squat there making it unpleasant for everyone else.


That is understandable but it was a cold evening and most people nodding off were just getting away from the cold before running back to their tents. There was hardly anyone around and I was put off by the notion that I was a squatter. It's not nice.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby atomosk » Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:38 am

devilgrrl wrote:
theCryptofishist wrote:
devilgrrl wrote:I didn't like the over officious faux-rastafarian asshole at Center Camp that hassled fellow burners for napping in the wee hours of the morning when no one was there. WTF????

It's so people (or drainbows) who didn't bring tents don't squat there making it unpleasant for everyone else.


That is understandable but it was a cold evening and most people nodding off were just getting away from the cold before running back to their tents. There was hardly anyone around and I was put off by the notion that I was a squatter. It's not nice.


It isn't nice. I didn't even know there was a derogatory term for this. Just don't overstay your welcome anywhere, and people have been sleeping at center camp as long as it's existed. It's your center camp as much as anyone's. There are too many derogatory terms out there anyhow (drainbow, darktard) that don't enforce conformity so much as they inspire contempt.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby Sprocket09 » Wed Sep 07, 2011 12:45 pm

I had trouble seeing so much food go to waste. A statement from the 20 something broke males out there. "This too shall pass". Eventually those 20 year olds should turn the ripe age of 30 was it? I was actually astounded by some folks solidarity. I'm not perfect, I obviously fit the degradation of this thread and possibly the playa itself, but shit I'm trying to enjoy the sights and sounds as much as the next person for all our benfit and so often being told to fuck off. Not good enough for the Goa young lad! Lol

Welcome to the west. Please, never get a flat, we don't like to help strangers. :?: What do you mean you don't have triple A? You's must be some kind of degenerate!

That being said the Rainbow gatherings been doing everything in its power to empty all our pockets this summer. Nobody said we are trying to be broke and worthless as shit here just learning a new kind of living situation, one with music, dance, and all that jazz.

Oh yeah,.. Too many cameras! OMG! I mean its great I guess I should get comfortable with that, your image is beheld for sure.

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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby AntiM » Wed Sep 07, 2011 12:53 pm

I had a lovely burn. The wonderful parts jump to mind faster than the bad, which is a pleasant change for me. Staying at the Booby Bar made me joyous and relaxed, Terminal City was a welcoming home.

Too many damn feathers though. I did make snide, but educational, remarks.

Oh, and whoever thought it was okay to add water to our tiny evap pan on Sunday. If we'd had a pond, I could see the temptation, but our teeny pan? Just thoughtless. It worked out though.

And Miss Sparkle-takemypicture-Pony who was hogging the art. You ain't that hot, honey, not once we see your face.

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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby atomosk » Wed Sep 07, 2011 1:06 pm

AntiM wrote:I did make snide, but educational, remarks.


I am glad the good jumps to mind faster than the bad, and it's hard to come back comepletely ok. Good for you man. Though to the remark above I want to say, snide is not educational, it's a dare and an insult.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby kubikub » Wed Sep 07, 2011 1:17 pm

There seemed to be a lot more renegade fireworks than the last two years I've witnessed. I was camped on 3:30&F, and on Saturday night just after our camp met up again after the man burned, we hear what sounded like one going off right next door. The day before one of our neighbors lit a tent in our camp on fire after not spinning his staff off properly, so we were a little sensitive to things involving fire and hauled ass outside to discover... two fucktards setting off fireworks. In the middle of our neighbor's circle of tents. And these guys were not our neighbors. They were so fucked up they nearly shot one sideways at the RVs across the street from us.
We got em to leave after threatening to call the Rangers on them, but it took the entire camp yelling at them. Not sure why we didn't follow through with that, actually. They were so messed up they could barely walk away, ugh. What a sad, blatant disregard of basic safety and common sense. That really riled everyone up.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby AntiM » Wed Sep 07, 2011 1:24 pm

atomosk wrote:
AntiM wrote:I did make snide, but educational, remarks.


I am glad the good jumps to mind faster than the bad, and it's hard to come back comepletely ok. Good for you man. Though to the remark above I want to say, snide is not educational, it's a dare and an insult.


Ma'am, not man, please.

A dare and an insult? No, not at all. Trust me, I did no name calling.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby atomosk » Wed Sep 07, 2011 1:51 pm

AntiM wrote:
atomosk wrote:
AntiM wrote:I did make snide, but educational, remarks.


I am glad the good jumps to mind faster than the bad, and it's hard to come back comepletely ok. Good for you man. Though to the remark above I want to say, snide is not educational, it's a dare and an insult.


Ma'am, not man, please.

A dare and an insult? No, not at all. Trust me, I did no name calling.

I hope that ironically this doesn't become a snide remark, but the deffinition of snide is "derogatory or mocking in an indirect way," or "devious and underhanded." By deffinition that is insulting. You don't have to call people names, but comments intended to put people in what you think their place should be is hurtful and no one should react to it with a personal epiphinous realization. If you really intend to educate you can't be rude or scoffing or snide, or they'd be justified in challenging your so called teachings by looking down on you and doing the opposite, if only to protect their egos.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby AntiM » Wed Sep 07, 2011 2:04 pm

Perhaps I should have said funny or humorous. You are so serious my teeth ache.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby trilobyte » Wed Sep 07, 2011 2:21 pm

The worst thing about this year's event (for me, anyways), was the DPW "parade" on Thursday.

It started nicely enough, a bunch of vehicles that NEVER should have been allowed to parade the city streets (regular cars and flatbeds with nothing more than a propane jet coming off it), but they carried DPW logos. Not really a problem in my book, while other people are working on their camps and art cars they're working on building the city infrastructure. And the vehicles were loaded with DPW team members, waving to people as they passed by. Those of us at camp came out and waved and cheered - hell yeah, I'm thankful for the weeks they work or volunteer for the community. As a campmate and I were about to go pull some cold drinks from our coolers and start running them out to people, some DPW jackass comes from the street past our art and to our shade structure, demanding that we give them booze and kiss their ass for letting us stay in their city. We chased him out and shunned the rest of the parade - shame on everyone involved in that sham of a parade, whether it was the whole crew's attitude or a few individuals acting alone, it makes the whole DPW look bad and was the low point of the event for me.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby headquarters » Wed Sep 07, 2011 2:38 pm

I haven't been since 2005. Something that struck me is the way that most of the first few streets on a radial, and down A street just seemed like parking lots. I understand people have to park, but it wasn't very fun in a lot of the areas around where I stayed (4 & J).

The busyness up there and parking lotness drives me forever back onto our suburban streets where the people seem a little more pleasant.

Good times though
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby gekko59 » Wed Sep 07, 2011 3:17 pm

I was a virgin. I had a great time, but could ya'll do something about the dust next time? Thanks. :wink:
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby Savannah » Wed Sep 07, 2011 3:22 pm

I was a virgin. I had a great time, but could ya'll do something about the dust next time? Thanks. :wink:


I'm on it. :)
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby bradtem » Wed Sep 07, 2011 4:03 pm

What, attitude from the DPW? I'm shocked, shocked.

Yes, while they are surely among the hardest working and longest-staying on the playa, saying "we built this city" has always been to me an unpleasant expression of that famous attitude. You worked very hard, and did a valuable service for which thanks is deserved, but you built 0.5% of the city.

But as to what I didn't like this year:

  • Exodus wait of 7 hours even leaving 8am Monday, a time that used to breeze out
  • Plant Earth, a camp with a volume level for 2 or 10 o'clock, but playing all night in 9 Plaza so you could not even have a conversation in camps around the plaza.
  • No proper white out
  • Theme had little impact
  • Disarray around the burning of the Greek horse -- sea of bikes mixed with viewers, art cars at the front, etc.
  • Core projects burned even earlier than announced time, nobody hear of Playa time?
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby theCryptofishist » Wed Sep 07, 2011 5:14 pm

Savannah wrote:
I was a virgin. I had a great time, but could ya'll do something about the dust next time? Thanks. :wink:


I'm on it. :)

Yes, there will be at least 6 hours of white-out next year.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby damien_pfc » Wed Sep 07, 2011 7:28 pm

People jumping on moving art cars without asking was my biggest problem.

A woman jumped on our art car as it was moving down a busy street. She didn't like our blank stares of disbelief at this breaking of two rules (not asking, and jumping on a moving art car), and she took an attitude that she was in charge and we should be less rude to her. We give rides all week long, and we always slow down and ask people if they want rides - never rude, never turn anyone down if we have room. This woman was a piece of work though, she seemed to think she had some power over art cars, as if she was the girlfriend of a DMV hottie or something and would get us busted for being rude to her. I stopped the car and then she realized we weren't going to play along with her entitlement game, so she got off the vehicle and proceeded to try to take down our mutant vehicle number.

This happened one other time when some kid decided to ride up on his bike and jump off of it onto our car. At least he didn't try to pull rank on us and humbly jumped right back off. I suppose this is the price we pay for not having a gigantic 12 foot tall art car anymore.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby DoriumLux » Wed Sep 07, 2011 8:15 pm

Entitlement seems to be more of an issue. It is no longer the gift economy, but people assume everything is up for grabs. "Hey, maaaaaaaaaan, it's BURNING MAN."

I had an argument with a nearby camp when I caught not one but three people sneaking into my Coleman Shower tent to shower...Then to top it off, they stole my solar shower.

Later in the week, a man crawled out of my small tent in his underwear around 9 PM on Wednesday. Apparently, he had been sleeping there for sometime..

I also experienced random people asking for things. One guy rode into our camp asking for a specific drink, because he was unhappy with what another camp had gifted him, and if they could have my chapstick. The year prior someone stole our flags and dented our car with a bicycle. Nothing was said...

On the upside, people quit pissing on the porta potty seats.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby Dustdevil » Wed Sep 07, 2011 9:45 pm

bradtem wrote:But as to what I didn't like this year:

  • Exodus wait of 7 hours even leaving 8am Monday, a time that used to breeze out
  • Plant Earth, a camp with a volume level for 2 or 10 o'clock, but playing all night in 9 Plaza so you could not even have a conversation in camps around the plaza.
  • No proper white out
  • Theme had little impact
  • Disarray around the burning of the Greek horse -- sea of bikes mixed with viewers, art cars at the front, etc.
  • Core projects burned even earlier than announced time, nobody hear of Playa time?


The CORE project burned exactly at 9:00 pm, as scheduled.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby weirdscience » Wed Sep 07, 2011 9:57 pm

changoloco wrote:When dancing to Christian Martin at Disco Knights on Friday night, some young kid (25-ish) started trying to dance with my wife, which is fine, I am not the jealous type. Whenever guys dance with my wife, I keep one eye on her to make sure that they don't get out of line. This guy thought that it was time to,literally, grab my wife and pull her towards him. My wife looked obviously scared. I grabbed the kid by the collar and pulled him off of her. I said, "Don't ever fucking grab a woman like that without permission!" His friend came at me, I was wearing my trusty disco-ball helmet. Who the hell tries to fight someone with a helmet on? I looked at them both and shook my head. I told them that they should probably move to another dance floor before there is more trouble than they can deal with. The kids friend still tried to chide me into a fight with him, which, I was refusing to engage. I do however protect my wife whenever she needs it. Luckily one of their other friends was waving a peace sign to me and he helped to get them out of there. The vibe of the young, aggressive, twenty something males is getting a little out of control IMHO.


kids my age are always itching to fight... theres no reason to, theres enough hate and violence in the world to add more violence and hate, especially on the playa theres no reason to if your in the wrong appologize and walk away you wronged yourself thats what kids my age dont understand no need to fight talk it out . if burning man is destroyed by people my age i have no hope for the future
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby JStep » Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:07 pm

atomosk wrote:I ended up...


WOW, sucks to be you...
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby penrose » Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:39 pm

Peeve 1:
On 8:30 between A and B was a huge "anonymous" camp of luxury RVs housing people who'd flown in and had everything catered, from food to showers to an on-the-spot costume seamstress. There was even a servants quarters in this faux little paradise, in that the paid workers didn't live with and weren't supposed to fraternize with the customers. How they could do this without greasing some of the BMorg's dirty palms I don't know. (I know there were several east coast CEOs and at least one state governor's wife, and I heard at least one Hollywood scumbag name being dropped as well.) Another one across 8:30 from there, luxury RVs, a rack of dozens of identical bikes, etc. had a big party Sunday night, in hindsight I regret not crashing it to see what the fuckers were up to.

Peeve 2:
Learning the new permit plans for BRC growth to 70k by 2016. I don't get that. Wouldn't it be better to limit the permit to approx 40k, or even less, tier out the ticket prices more rationally, and just not worry about people who try and buy too late? The event needs to get smaller, not bigger.
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Re: post what you didn't like about 2011 here

Postby Bob » Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:11 am

Use of the term "BMorg" went out with the burnman-list, something I don't regret about 2011.
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