evolution of the event

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.

evolution of the event

Postby stuart » Wed Jun 09, 2004 6:09 pm

I grepped this from another thread...



If you loved the BM of, say, 96 and felt particularly emotionally invested in that experience and state of the festival I could see how you might be bitter about it's state now.

I wonder what our respective opinions would be if in the early '90s BM existed as it did now and evolved to present day to be like it was in, say, '94. Evolving in reverse as it were. What perspective would we have. How would we feel about the event, the org.. What slanders would the old timers fling at the current incarnation? How would the rookies defend against them?
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Postby Badger » Wed Jun 09, 2004 6:19 pm

Hmmmm....

Need to chew on this one for a bit.
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Postby stuart » Wed Jun 09, 2004 6:26 pm

I eagerly await your response. Hope to see something tomorrow morning.
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Postby Rob the Wop » Wed Jun 09, 2004 8:47 pm

"You art loving bastards don't appreciate the Raves of the past, dammit! Whippersnappers! Back then we had RULES dammit! We didn't have guns n fire. Didn't need it when we had just X and techno."
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Postby Apollonaris Zeus » Wed Jun 09, 2004 10:19 pm

Rob the Wop wrote:" Didn't need it when we had just X and techno."


In the Year, 2035:

Young whipper snapper: "Wow, Rob the Wop(an old man in his 80's), you were in BM back in the Days, dude, when they did drugs, danced nude and had sex!"

(editors note- all sexual reproduction at this point in time is "In Vitrol", all people are given a drug in their drinking water that stops all cravings for drugs and sex. It also makes them carry out the lies of the whitehouse willingly and without question!)

YWS- "I heard about those days man!"

Rob the Wop- "Yes it was before fucking Ashcroft took over the whitehouse with the White Shirts and gave us G.O.D.(tm), burnt all the DJ's alive and declared himself, Caesar Adolphist, and all because Larry Harvey burnt himself out fucking BM teenage groupies on bad X. He lost his mind and sold out to Time-Warner-Playboy just before the polical power house party "Burning People" was to elect him President with a 65% popular vote!"

YWS- "you mean people use to elect government officals back then too! They don't teach us that in school! I always thought that was false rumor!"


RTW- "Yea, and there's no I in fuck off either, asshole!"

Young Whipper Snapper runs off crying and screaming to his cyborg nanny.

Rob the Wob heads back to his XTC lab in the mountains of the Columbia valley.

A II Z
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Postby Rob the Wop » Wed Jun 09, 2004 11:16 pm

Apollonaris Zeus wrote:Rob the Wob heads back to his XTC lab in the mountains of the Columbia valley.


Note to self: They're on to ya- ditch the future lab plans.
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Postby Bob » Thu Jun 10, 2004 1:33 am

Back in '96 I don't remember ever asking a Ranger a damned thing except, "Where the fuck is that chopper trying to land? Should we run?"

In '97 it was, "How do you like your pork? Lady Di? No, really?"

In '98 it was, "Umm... Anyone on Comm? I'm seeing flames go up from a pile of hay bales... Ya'll notice that First Camp is on fire?"

In '99 it was, "If you lazy fucks don't do something about it, do you care whether I get out an axe and chop their speaker cords myself?"

In '00 it was, "Where do you want that?"

In '01 it was, "When do you want that?"

In '02 it was, "Was it really necessary to pin that guy in the cow costume on the ground with a knee in his back and check his udder for controlled substances?"

In '03 it was, "You want a taller safety barrier? Won't people just be more likely to fall off the catwalk on the pyramid if you make a barrier they're just going to ignore even taller? Got a couple of antihistamines to spare, btw?"
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Postby theCryptofishist » Thu Jun 10, 2004 12:41 pm

Apollonaris Zeus wrote:
(editors note- all sexual reproduction at this point in time is "In Vitrol"


Well in my futuristic distopia all reproduction is "In Vitriol"
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Postby ness » Fri Jun 11, 2004 1:26 pm

some people are thinking is gettin better and some think is all going to hell in a hand basket, I think its better than 5 yrs ago , but the crime kinda bums me out....rape, theft and that kinda shit used to be rare or was never heard of.
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Postby Zulegoona » Fri Jun 11, 2004 7:11 pm

So what do you think would happen if an enterprising promoter would create a sort of competing festival say closer to Vegas more tailored to the Yahoo set. Would that go a long ways to fixing the problems old timers see? Would that also mean the slow death of Burning Man because this years Yahoos are next years Burners? Would many Burners opt for a different gathering if it wasn't a leave no trace event and had commerce if it was a " Hot " party?
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Postby TommyTheCat » Fri Jun 11, 2004 10:00 pm

Im going to be a n00b burner, but reading all this "use to be better" shit makes me sad. Its as if the elitest burners(from what i hear, only a few) dont want it to grow, therefore keeping youngins like myself from being exposed to it. But i couldnt come 5 years ago, so what the hell. Am i not welcome because i couldnt come alone when i was 13? I dont know, my statement doesnt make much since, im really tired haha.

And i wouldnt want to come if it wasnt leave no trace and commerce filled.
I got ma ride...blargh!
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who knows

Postby rev. lucifer » Sat Jun 12, 2004 12:27 am

New burners are always welcome as long as they pick up after themself, respect other people and their artistic expression, and don't steal my bike. In the 4 years I have gone there has been a change, but with more people comes more control. More "law" enforcement to make sure we all behave. My only concern with Burning Man is that I feel it's missing some of it's spirituality. I miss the fire circles on the playa, the ones where people went to help connect with their soul. Burning Man will always be my HOME and I will always love her and the time we spent together. :?
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Postby Tiahaar » Sat Jun 12, 2004 12:48 am

Finally having got to the awesome place of making it to Burning Man last year I want it to keep its spirit at least another decade. Working on making my camp nicer and artsy this year! Next year...the playa art piece challenge beckons : ) The weather was so nice last year that attendence is sure to be up this year...didn't someone say a good storm would be good to put some radical in the survival? I like the way instead of capping ticket sales the price is ratcheted up towards the end, that curve could always steepen to control growth.
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Postby Tiahaar » Sat Jun 12, 2004 12:56 am

Zulegoona wrote: Would many Burners opt for a different gathering if it wasn't a leave no trace event and had commerce if it was a " Hot " party?


Sure, MTV Spring Break types and they could have it.

LNT/no commerce/radical self-reliance + Awesome Creativity is THE draw for me.
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Postby zzberlin » Sat Jun 12, 2004 7:55 am

Everything changes.

Something else is now what Burningman was ten years ago.

And when you figure out what it is, let me know!
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Postby Badger » Sat Jun 12, 2004 3:30 pm

In '97 it was, "How do you like your pork? Lady Di? No, really?"


Funny thing - ironic actually - is that by the time the playa telegraph relayed the message to the back 40 of the event it was Reagan who had died. We didn't find out about the news until post-event rolling into Reno.
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Postby robotland » Tue Jun 15, 2004 6:10 am

Singlecell Man

Lungfish Man

Biped Man

Homo Flammabilis
Howdy From Kalamazoo
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old timers disease

Postby theshaman » Thu Jun 24, 2004 4:41 pm

This is always such an interesting topic to me. I went to my first burn in 02. It was an amazing spiritual journey for me. It altered my life completely. I remember sitting on my porch when a guy came up and hung out with us, sharing our shade and a beer. When he left he gave us sticker that said "it was better last year" It made me laugh...I have worked in the movie industry and was very familiar with the "been there, done that, everything sucks now" attitude.

Yet, I will admit that last year I went with a much bigger plan (can you say second year burner disease?) and a lot of expectations....guess who got upset and had some bad times? I have thought about it in retrospect and realized it actually didn't have anything to do with what Happened...it was my own expectations...I didn't have any the first year.

I camp with people who have gone 6 - 8 times....many of then took last year off, and highly recommend a "vacaton from the burn" every few years. They say when they come back they appeciate it all the more and can see it with fresh eyes.
Buddha wasn't a Christian, but Jesus would have made a good Buddhist

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Postby Badger » Thu Jun 24, 2004 5:15 pm

It Was Better Last Year:

Waiting to read the responses to the DMV vehicle policy this year - especially as it relates to paring down the number of unregistered, non-mutated vehicles.

Will probably post Ranger/Gate/DMV guidelines for non-registered vehicles here in the near future.
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Postby buzcut » Fri Jun 25, 2004 3:58 pm

I agree there
Crack down on them at the gate dont let em bring the death makers in.



/MOOOOOO
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It's Evolution Stupid

Postby Mithra » Sat Jun 26, 2004 10:56 pm

Seeing that change is the only constant and burners are like supposed be more enlightened than the average tom, dick or shirley, why do they seem to resist change just as much as any other segment of the population?

Personally, I live for change, it's staying the same that makes me all oggily.

I mean you have a choice right? You can focus on all the things you like and try to foster thier growth, which would hopefully result in a net increase in the tnings you like right?

Or you can bitch and complain about how BM sucks and the ORG is trying to keep me down man. Find something you have no conrol over and piss into the wind.

I mean why the fuck would anyone choose the later?

Endlessly Hopefull,
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Postby paps » Sat Jun 26, 2004 11:30 pm

Knee jerk is knee jerk.

Change which lasts, lasts.

(nipples as caveman)
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Postby amnesia » Sat Jun 26, 2004 11:33 pm

I forgot what I was going to say.
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Postby nipples » Sat Jun 26, 2004 11:42 pm

"nipples as caveman"
(paps)

i am more though a whelp
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Postby paps » Sat Jun 26, 2004 11:47 pm

Whelp this!
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Postby amnesia » Sat Jun 26, 2004 11:52 pm

Oh yeah.

I just remembered!

THANKS!
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Postby Badger » Sun Jun 27, 2004 4:13 am

Nipples, I just wanna sleep with you.

Nothing sexual. Nothing perverse.

Just a nap. Next to a big cuddly bunny.

There.

I said it.
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Postby Ivy » Sun Jun 27, 2004 6:06 am

Hey Badger,

Get in line.
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Postby bullD » Sun Jun 27, 2004 9:33 am

My first years were 91 and 92. Ehhh, I think 91 was the first year on the playa in Black Rock Desert. I then managed to somehow stay away for nine years and returned in 01 and again in 02. 03 was filled with a few of lifes larger lessons and so I took last year off from BM.

So,,, given that everytime I have gone has been magical in one way or another (burn night in 91 and 01 were off the charts magical), I have to say that I totally appreciate what BM has morphed into,,, yahoo's and all.

Way back, the event, I feel, was a bit more dangerous. There was no entrance to speak of, you just pointed your vehicle towards the middle of the playa "until you see the light of the man," camps were spread out, there were no streets, vehicles were driving/racing around freely, gun use was not an issue but then again it was. Uncontrolled chaos if you will,,, but the participants mostly kept it together. It was not an environment for the weak, still isn't in many regards, and yahoos were a much smaller portion or percentage of the BM population.

So after nine years it was a pleasant surprise to see BRC's infrastructure; the streets with signs, center camp (COFFEE!!!), all of the wonderful peeps that give their time to BM in one way or another, MEDICAL FACILITIES, etc. etc.... I feel that having all this allows people to become much more participatory with their art and music and whatever. It is now a controlled chaos and again, I feel this is a good thing, yahoos and all. If at least one yahoo becomes enlightened, so to speak, while attending and becomes more aware of what BM is about (of course what BM is about is different to all), and becomes a PARTICIPANT in the process, then we can all feel proud of that fact. That is a portion of what BM has morphed into,,, turning peeps on to a different way of thinking about themselves and others. The BRC infrastructure helps a bigger percentage of attendees to GET IT... Thus, future burners...

SO,,, getting on to Stuarts original post/question here:
This reversal scenario is quite interesting. Same gripes different polarity, I would think.
This reminds me of reading about the great '"Boomtowns"' or the great '"Industrial mecca's"' here in the united states. These towns/cities grew very rapidly. Then when resources evaporated or when the great industrialists began to die off, these towns/cities did exactly the same thing. Thus we now have ghost towns and cities that seem like ghost towns. The inhabitants of these towns/cities talk of the prosperous days with kind regard. Ask them what their town/city is like currently and they may still hold much love for it only now it is bittersweet as things have become more difficult.
Is BurningMan following this same pattern, or will the event have staying power like some of the other great world parties like Carnival, Oktoberfest, Mardi Gras??????? Hmmmmmm,,,,,,,
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Postby DVD Burner » Sun Jun 27, 2004 9:38 am

WHOLY COW!


bullD is an old timmer. what took you so long to hit eplaya?
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