If you could change one thing about Burning Man..

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.

Postby Cheyenne » Tue Nov 09, 2010 4:25 pm

So I'm thinking that whilst we will be helping out with a camp on the Esplanade in 2011, we will probably want to camp in Hushville and bike to 'work' - I'd rather camp somewhere which is less likely to be 24/7 music - be it techno or otherwise..

In fact, from what i've seen and listened to on t'web, the 'techno' doesn't sound like techno at all!!! Techno is excellent and comes in many well produced forms - but the stuff those art cars are belching out sounds more like shit house music...

Bring on the techno-punk! - oh, and folk, and postpunk, and acoustic and...............
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Postby CapSmashy » Tue Nov 09, 2010 5:05 pm

Is there a correlation between the prohibition on firearms and the rise on bad music?
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Postby Simon of the Playa » Tue Nov 09, 2010 5:12 pm

CapSmashy wrote:Is there a correlation between the prohibition on firearms and the rise on bad music?



can't be, i like both.
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Postby ygmir » Tue Nov 09, 2010 5:49 pm

CapSmashy wrote:Is there a correlation between the prohibition on firearms and the rise on bad music?


an astute observation, and, I'd bet, applicable.
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Postby ibdave » Tue Nov 09, 2010 7:44 pm

flatlander13 wrote:I would bring back the guy who drove around all night my first night at Burning Man in 2001 who had a megaphone that had an echo saying………BLOW JOB…..BLOW JOB…….BLOW JOB………………….BLOW JOB……..BLOW JOB………BLOW JOB……….
What a welcome………..

I would like my camp to actually all be there again………we haven’t seen everyone out on the playa since 2006………..



Looking good on our end campymate... 8) 8) 8)

we need some phone-time... oh baby oh baby.......


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Postby teardropper » Tue Nov 09, 2010 7:56 pm

CapSmashy wrote:Is there a correlation between the prohibition on firearms and the rise on bad music?


Yeah, they used to shoot the guys that played bad music...
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Postby theCryptofishist » Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:00 pm

teardropper wrote:
CapSmashy wrote:Is there a correlation between the prohibition on firearms and the rise on bad music?


Yeah, they used to shoot the guys that played bad music...

But they had to play even worse music to cover up the gunshots, so it was a wash.
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Postby Fire_Moose » Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:46 am

More titties
More beer
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Postby Lord Of Ruin » Wed Nov 10, 2010 11:11 am

EmilyD wrote:NO OOOONCE-blasting vehicles driving through the streets all night!!!!

I know many folks LOVE that sound but that is truly the only thing I hated at Burning Man. I tried to embrace it every way I could think but alas, it never stopped irritating my cells. You can call it the heartbeat of the man or whatever but it's still monotonous, obnoxious, single-noted, unimaginative, annoying sound pollution. I think it's fine to have it in stationary locations so that folks who don't want to be slathered can remove themselves from it. With it on the move, there's no escape, and it really harshed my playa groove. I'm sure I'm not the only one.


Never understood this either. You spend all year (or more!) building this expensive, distinctive piece of art and then you blast the same shit everyone else does? I don't get it.

There are so many genre's/themes of music that would lend themselves to funky artcar atmosphere but everyone seems to just punt to the ooontz.

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Postby Ugly Dougly » Wed Nov 10, 2010 11:16 am

It must be getting them laid, or they wouldn't do it. ;)
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Postby teardropper » Wed Nov 10, 2010 11:23 am

Gotta' say, I did hear more different kinds of music this year. Rock, blues, even heard bluegrass on one. Maybe it's a trend.
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Postby Simon of the Playa » Wed Nov 10, 2010 11:39 am

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fU1jTK5dRsM[/youtube]
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Postby ibdave » Wed Nov 10, 2010 5:29 pm

The flying carpet for me, always has good tunes with the right speakers and not so loud it's fucked up..

plus its a fucking flying carpet with hot chicks on it... hello..... 8) 8) 8)
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Postby Elliot » Wed Nov 10, 2010 6:46 pm

:D
So... there have been a couple of suggestions for moving The Event to a different location, but nothing that sounded realistic. I'm still waiting for somebody to suggest moving the event away from the corrosive dust.

I don't mind breathing it. I don't mind eating it. But the stuff does hecka lot of damage to mechanical and electrical equipment.

Now.... Let me be the first to point out that the hardships of the event serve to weed out "tourists". But dang, the damage the alkali dust does to Stuff.

No, I don't know where would be a good alternative. But let me mention something: In 1997 I spent sunrise to sunset for a week on the Bonneville Salt Flats. The environment is a lot like the Playa, and it was all quite magical. The salt does not create dust. Even the rooster tails behind the race car tires just fall back to the ground -- no dust. Of course, the salt is extremely corrosive, and rain can wipe out whole days -- maybe the whole event. So Bonneville is out. But my point is that there are other places out there.

This isn't anything like a request or suggestion. I bring it up only as a thought for possible discussion. It may be just that I am overly emotional about Playa dust damage to my toys. Thoughts?
:D
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Postby JStep » Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:05 pm

Elliot wrote::D

I don't mind breathing it. I don't mind eating it. But the stuff does hecka lot of damage to mechanical and electrical equipment.


This virgin is quite concerned about this. I am planning to buy a friends shorty school bus for the trip, it's in immaculate shape (even has "Midvale School For The Gifted" on the sides, for any Far Side fans out there) and I worry I'm going to be wrecking it by taking it to the playa.

Does everything you take to BM turn to shit if you don't go over it with lemon juice and a Q-Tip?
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Postby theCryptofishist » Wed Nov 10, 2010 7:31 pm

Truck wash. Twice. It's between Wadsworth and Reno.
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Postby Elliot » Wed Nov 10, 2010 10:06 pm

Well, JStep, I suppose it is all a matter of degree and a matter of perception. A school bus is a fairly rugged piece of equipment, and I don't worry about mine at all. (I have a 40 foot Blue Bird -- four burns so far on this bus.) Maybe electrical equipment like light switches could suffer.

By the way, I feel that a school bus is the perfect BM vehicle. See my "School Bus 101" thread in the Q&A section.

People worry a lot about their bicycles, and if you just bring it home and leave it outside, it will become solid "yard art". But if you invest some time in maintenance, and/or keep it indoors the other 51 weeks, it will be OK.

I'm more concerned about electronic equipment -- which I can not so easily wash and oil. For example, I'd like to run movies on the side of my bus with a digital projector, but I don't dare bring this $800 electronic gadget out there. I would have to build a ventilated box with filters, like others do.

No, everything does NOT turn to shit. Not at all. But the risk of corrosion is a factor.

It may be a psychological quirk of mine -- like I am totally OK with breathing the stuff; doesn't bother me at all. At the other end of the spectrum, I worry what it will do in the long run to my $1.700 Honda generator. Somebody around here said the gasoline tank on his Honda rusted thru after a few years. That would tick me off to no end.

It's just a silly brainstorm -- what other options might exist as a location for Burning Man? The current location is perfectly fine. I just like to brainstorm, I suppose.
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Postby wraith » Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:34 pm

Honestly, from what's been posted about the actual composition of the playa dust, it's no worse on a car than winters in the midwest, with the roads covered in salt and sand. If you're driving out, I'd just hit a carwash somewhere around Reno, then detail it better when you get back home and get unpacked. :D
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Postby teardropper » Thu Nov 11, 2010 10:22 pm

wraith wrote: it's no worse on a car than winters in the midwest


umm, maybe...
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Postby SilverOrange » Fri Nov 12, 2010 5:14 am

teardropper wrote:
wraith wrote: it's no worse on a car than winters in the midwest


umm, maybe...


No, really.
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Postby AntiM » Fri Nov 12, 2010 5:59 am

We don't have road salt in our door hinges, but there's playa dust deep inside there. The dust can infiltrate where road salt cannot.

Our exterior window seals "weep" playa whenever it rains. The professional carwash people ran it through four times and it still has playa in deep crevices.

LOL, Elliot, the salt flats are in Utah. We could never have the event here, as it is, we have to make our regional an 18+ event and have a guest list. The state laws about children and nudity are enough to keep it in Nevada, because the Utah cops would enforce the laws.
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Postby mdmf007 » Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:37 am

Elliot wrote::D
So... there have been a couple of suggestions for moving The Event to a different location, but nothing that sounded realistic. I'm still waiting for somebody to suggest moving the event away from the corrosive dust.

I don't mind breathing it. I don't mind eating it. But the stuff does hecka lot of damage to mechanical and electrical equipment.

Now.... Let me be the first to point out that the hardships of the event serve to weed out "tourists". But dang, the damage the alkali dust does to Stuff.

No, I don't know where would be a good alternative. But let me mention something: In 1997 I spent sunrise to sunset for a week on the Bonneville Salt Flats. The environment is a lot like the Playa, and it was all quite magical. The salt does not create dust. Even the rooster tails behind the race car tires just fall back to the ground -- no dust. Of course, the salt is extremely corrosive, and rain can wipe out whole days -- maybe the whole event. So Bonneville is out. But my point is that there are other places out there.

This isn't anything like a request or suggestion. I bring it up only as a thought for possible discussion. It may be just that I am overly emotional about Playa dust damage to my toys. Thoughts?
:D


The turf farms in Oregon are completely viable, in fact what BM pays BLM for fees a year would more than pay the mortgage on a farm and operations. BMORG could see the grass every year as well and help defray costs.

Tell me having the burn on a nice lawn wouldnt be awesome. Is there enough room you ask? yup.

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Postby ygmir » Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:45 am

mdmf007 wrote:
Elliot wrote::D
So... there have been a couple of suggestions for moving The Event to a different location, but nothing that sounded realistic. I'm still waiting for somebody to suggest moving the event away from the corrosive dust.

I don't mind breathing it. I don't mind eating it. But the stuff does hecka lot of damage to mechanical and electrical equipment.

Now.... Let me be the first to point out that the hardships of the event serve to weed out "tourists". But dang, the damage the alkali dust does to Stuff.

No, I don't know where would be a good alternative. But let me mention something: In 1997 I spent sunrise to sunset for a week on the Bonneville Salt Flats. The environment is a lot like the Playa, and it was all quite magical. The salt does not create dust. Even the rooster tails behind the race car tires just fall back to the ground -- no dust. Of course, the salt is extremely corrosive, and rain can wipe out whole days -- maybe the whole event. So Bonneville is out. But my point is that there are other places out there.

This isn't anything like a request or suggestion. I bring it up only as a thought for possible discussion. It may be just that I am overly emotional about Playa dust damage to my toys. Thoughts?
:D


The turf farms in Oregon are completely viable, in fact what BM pays BLM for fees a year would more than pay the mortgage on a farm and operations. BMORG could see the grass every year as well and help defray costs.



I could go for that.........and, a bonus would be, you could tell the friendliest folks, by where the grass stains are (knees, for instance)
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Postby Dr Helix » Fri Nov 12, 2010 9:45 am

I really think the playa is exactly where this event needs to be. The beauty and starkness of the desert, coupled with the bizzarre and sublime that is Burning Man is to me a sweet mix. Building large art out there (first year for me) was amazing and the contrast between all the art and the surroundings was great. Certainly there is a price to pay with the dust, but there's always going to be something. My girlfriend goes to a smaller festival, Shambala up in Canada which is held in a beautiful forest location. Perfect, right? Well she says the dust there is mixed in with cow dung from the locals who run cattle in the same area and she's come back with lung and sinus infections almost every time. So for it's size, and sheer scope of what you can do, the playa seems like a great match for the event.
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Postby Elliot » Fri Nov 12, 2010 11:23 am

:lol:
I had not thought of "The Utah Factor"! I guess my camp mates could not let their three year old kid run around nude on the Salt Flats. :lol:

But as I said, the Salt Flats seem to be subject to more rain showers, and the rain takes forever to soak in or dry out, so that alone rules it out.

A turf farm does sound interesting. But how would the turf stand up to all the traffic? And what about rain in Oregon? Would we not risk that the whole event might drown in mud?

My mind keeps trying to think of some rain free land with neutral soil in the southwest. I've been to Quartzsite, Arizona, in winter -- where massive numbers of "snowbirds" hang out in RVs, many on BLM land if I understand it right.

But I agree that the Black Rock Playa is a good place.
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Postby mdmf007 » Fri Nov 12, 2010 12:22 pm

it doesnt matter how the turf hold up, replace it the next season. Takes less than a week to strip a farm that size, and another week to reseed it. Way less man hours and cost than the current system of de-mooping, A permanent location would also have the benefit of permanent structures. Bathrooms that are sanitary, in ground power instead of laying miles of wires every year.

I agree Black Rock Desert kicks ass, problem is the fees are doing nothing but climbing skyward as well as the caveats added every year.

Bonneville has its own problems and is still BLM land I believe.
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Postby Elliot » Fri Nov 12, 2010 1:43 pm

All right, now.... First of all, I realize that the organizers of the event are not monitoring this silly forum for ideas.

And I would not be surprised if they already have thick files on dozens of potential sites -- just in case reasons ever arise to move the event.

That said, the Oregon turf farm idea does seem interesting. Are you sure we would not risk wading ankle deep in mud after the first day or two? What I'm thinking about is what sort of soil and drainage there is below the "crop".

I suppose other farm land might also qualify for consideration -- like hay fields.

I'm not up on the fees and other issues with BLM land. In my five years I have learned to think of BLM as a benevolent host. But I understand that a good part of my admission ticket money goes to them -- for use of land that you and I already own.

Permanent toilets with lighting.... I expect a very good case could be made for that, from the health point of view.

And a permanent venue could perhaps be rented to other events during the year -- Renaissance Fairs and such.

But then.... But then a thought pops up: What on Earth am I talking about?! One of the Key Things that make Burning Man what it is, is the fact that we start with a blank canvas and create a city from scratch, then remove all traces of it!

I'll hush up now. :lol:
Curb the loud techno, and Burning Man will be perfect as it is.
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Postby Elderberry » Fri Nov 12, 2010 1:50 pm

Elliot wrote:But then.... But then a thought pops up: What on Earth am I talking about?! One of the Key Things that make Burning Man what it is, is the fact that we start with a blank canvas and create a city from scratch, then remove all traces of it!


Excellent point! I was actually starting to like the idea of grass too--until I read this.

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Postby teardropper » Fri Nov 12, 2010 2:05 pm

Yeah, it seems that part of the beauty is just that. It springs forth from one of the most hostile places there is, a city for 50,000 is built and it is returned to its hostile condition each time. You really can't see where it was.

"We" do own it, but it is rented to a for profit. That may be the difference between me going out on the playa to camp for a while with some friends and camping with a few tens of thousands of others at an event that at least makes enough profit to do it again. (LLC, they don't have to tell us. Rightly so.)

I love Oregon, but don't know if I'd like to do this on something, anything, else than the playa. (How many shower stalls would it take to clean BRC?) And the Black Rock playa has what I want.
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Postby Elliot » Fri Nov 12, 2010 2:56 pm

:D
One of the most valuable things about "brainstorming" is that it can serve to eliminate bad ideas. And I come up with a lot of bad ideas.

But... Burning Man on a nice lawn.... That is a seductive thought. :lol:
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