If Burners Ran the World

Share your views on the policies, philosophies, and spirit of Burning Man.

If Burners Ran the World

Postby Clar-i-ty » Fri Aug 13, 2010 11:09 pm

I had a really hard week, but invariably I was reminded that Burners really know how to get it done with a minimum amount of BS. It made me stop and wonder. What would it be like if Burners ran the world? Would every day end with a roar of celebration as the sun dips behind the horizon? Would peer pressure lead to innovative creativity? How would our institutions be? What would our institutions be? I leave this here for your consideration.

Of course I know this is an imaginary scenario, we all do, but all things must be imagined before they become a reality.
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Postby Simon of the Playa » Fri Aug 13, 2010 11:23 pm

you would see more ads like this....


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Postby Trishntek » Sat Aug 14, 2010 10:05 am

Philosophically, I would like to think a Burner Society would be based upon rugged individualism, self-reliance and independence. A society where those who are able and willing to help themselves will be encouraged to succeed by the community. Those who obviously NEED help will get it. And those who EXPECT others to provide for them while contributing nothing will be shunned.

Ill-gotten gain would not be tolerated. Thieves, rapists and murderers would be banned to a place where nothing exists without food, water or clothing,,,, someplace like,,,, ohhhh let's say a dry lake bed in the middle of Nevada or Western Utah.
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Postby Elderberry » Sat Aug 14, 2010 10:24 am

Trishntek wrote:Philosophically, I would like to think a Burner Society would be based upon rugged individualism, self-reliance and independence. A society where those who are able and willing to help themselves will be encouraged to succeed by the community. Those who obviously NEED help will get it. And those who EXPECT others to provide for them while contributing nothing will be shunned.

Ill-gotten gain would not be tolerated. Thieves, rapists and murderers would be banned to a place where nothing exists without food, water or clothing,,,, someplace like,,,, ohhhh let's say a dry lake bed in the middle of Nevada or Western Utah.


Actually, I think that's the goal of all mankind--but being human, you see what it devolves into. Idealism is only a dream that is constantly being corrupted by humanity.

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Postby Token » Sat Aug 14, 2010 10:58 am

Begin demographic.

10% would do cool stuff, build and run the place.

20% would be severely emotionally damaged, bitching and whining about how everything is wrong, and then proceed to do nothing when given the opportunity.

40% percent would buy costumes and come to party.

30% would refuse to bathe, beg, panhandle and mooch off of everyone including themselves.

/end demographic.

80% would be drunk, high or otherwise FUBAR.

If I had to live in a "Burner Society", I would eventually stockpile vast amounts of small arm and end up going on a homicidal rampage.

I would call it the "Radical herd Culling (tm)", the 13th principle.
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Postby capjbadger » Sat Aug 14, 2010 11:50 am

Token wrote:Begin demographic.

10% would do cool stuff, build and run the place.

20% would be severely emotionally damaged, bitching and whining about how everything is wrong, and then proceed to do nothing when given the opportunity.

40% percent would buy costumes and come to party.

30% would refuse to bathe, beg, panhandle and mooch off of everyone including themselves.

/end demographic.

80% would be drunk, high or otherwise FUBAR.

If I had to live in a "Burner Society", I would eventually stockpile vast amounts of small arm and end up going on a homicidal rampage.

I would call it the "Radical herd Culling (tm)", the 13th principle.

Which of those groups do you think includes you Token? *chuckle*

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Postby Simon of the Playa » Sat Aug 14, 2010 12:01 pm

capjbadger wrote:
Token wrote:Begin demographic.

10% would do cool stuff, build and run the place.

20% would be severely emotionally damaged, bitching and whining about how everything is wrong, and then proceed to do nothing when given the opportunity.

40% percent would buy costumes and come to party.

30% would refuse to bathe, beg, panhandle and mooch off of everyone including themselves.

/end demographic.

80% would be drunk, high or otherwise FUBAR.

If I had to live in a "Burner Society", I would eventually stockpile vast amounts of small arm and end up going on a homicidal rampage.

I would call it the "Radical herd Culling (tm)", the 13th principle.

Which of those groups do you think includes you Token? *chuckle*

-Badger




actually, what i find interesting about token's breakdown is that it would pretty much apply to ALL groups or communities big or small, diverse or homogeneous, one could even say the whole human race.

what does this mean?


well, it means that contrary to popular myth, the notion of equality runs counter to the science of evolution.

based on his numbers, we are DEVOLVING.

the top 10%, most likely intellectually and financially, are always going to be the ones who get shit done.

the betas are content that they arent deltas or worse and that they dont have to work as hard as the alphas. Hell, lets party...

and so on.

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Postby Token » Sat Aug 14, 2010 3:23 pm

capjbadger wrote:
Which of those groups do you think includes you Token? *chuckle*

-Badger


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Postby geekster » Sat Aug 14, 2010 5:04 pm

If burners ran the world, your community would do what your community does, and it really wouldn't be interested in enforcing their values on other communities nor would they want values imposed on them from other communities.

The "central government" would be limited to that infrastructure required to allow those communities to communicate and thrive without imposing culture on them. But of course that might be changing now that the org is doing all this plotting and planning. I have a feeling we might be headed for an even greater degree of being told how to be and how not to be in the coming years, even at BM.
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Postby Token » Sat Aug 14, 2010 6:17 pm

If you want to participate in this hypothetical right now, join the Tea Party movement.

The most compatible classification of Burning Man and how it operates is Anarchism.

Yes, Anarchy in the US, and it's not a punk rock movement.

Don't confuse Anarchy with the common American interpretation of the wild west, cats and dogs sleeping together, bands of marauders raping pillaging and burning, and Zombieland. That is Chaos, quite different than Anarchy and Anarchism.

For centuries, Anarchism has been a political, social, economic and moral philosophy. Many of its factions and red headded step children remain today with fancy names of Federalism, Libertarianism, Socialism, Marxism and the ever popular Tea Bag Movement.

Pierre Joseph Proudhon wrote extensively and coprehensively on the subject, as the leading philosopher of Anarchism of the times.

The really cool stuff for all the grognards of the Russian revolution is the fact that it was a crapshoot 50/50 chance that the Ruskies went Marxist (Marx, Lenin) vs. Anarchist (Bakunin).

But the Kozaks and the Federalists failed to win and then before you know it: The Cuban missile crisis.

So all those dopey looking Tea Baggers are really just burners, and they just don't know it.

This revolution will be televised in High Definition on CNN.
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Postby Clar-i-ty » Sat Aug 14, 2010 6:56 pm

In that case Token, you must be sure to join me for a cup of tea on the Playa. Jasmin or Darjeeling?
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Postby Token » Sat Aug 14, 2010 7:15 pm

Darjeeling with a shot of Scotch. Drinking straight tea is way too much hydration for me. Might go into Delirium Tremens.
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Postby Trishntek » Sat Aug 14, 2010 9:34 pm

I've always understood Anarchy to be no gubmint. That would be diametrically opposed to socialism, communism/marxism which seek the all-knowing, all-benevolent, all-consuming gubmint.

Federalism promotes localized government and acknowledges the need for a federal gubmint for continuity of commerce and common protections of the federation's borders along with diplomatic relations with other nations. Otherwise, under Federalism, the individual states run the show.

Libertarianism seeks as much possible individual liberty within the framework of common law. It is kind of like the Wiccan creed which ends with something like, "If it not harm another, do what you will."

This is just my simple mind rambling about something I'm just beginning to grasp. Bottom line, burners would seek liberty over tyranny.
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Postby Token » Sun Aug 15, 2010 9:15 am

Yes, they are all different now but in the historical context, as the philosophies evolved, they all shared a broad overlap in core values that over time developed different means of achieving prosperity.

Anarchism, Marxism, Communism, Socialism etc all share a certain degree of egalitarian ethos, even though each takes it to a different place and through different means.

Now, these types of conversations are best done with Darjeeling tea, Single Malt scotch and some rope bondage around a burn barrel.

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Postby Trishntek » Sun Aug 15, 2010 10:15 am

I prefer Earl Grey.

I'll bring a bottle of Macallen's.

Rope bondage,,,,,, now yer talkin!!!!

:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:
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Postby Token » Sun Aug 15, 2010 11:49 am

Clar-i-ty is in charge of the tea. I got the Scotch though heaven knows I never turn down a Macallan.

Matter of fact; smoking my pipe and sipping some 10yo Macallan right now, before the heat sets in and the mrs. demands I do laundry and dishes.
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Postby capjbadger » Sun Aug 15, 2010 12:07 pm

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eELH0ivexKA[/youtube]
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Postby Token » Sun Aug 15, 2010 2:15 pm

I watched and watched ... and it just seemed like masturbation without the payoff. 

Here, this is short, sweet and to the point:


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Perhaps the burners are ahead of the curve?

Postby ZeroandOne » Sun Aug 15, 2010 3:03 pm

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3ti7cx68OA&NR=1[/youtube]
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Postby Trishntek » Sun Aug 15, 2010 3:24 pm

Speaking of transitions,,,,,, how about the new definition of "terrorists"

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgDS0bSzW1U[/youtube]

So when will congress pass the "What Americans have the Right to Think" bill?
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Postby ygmir » Sun Aug 15, 2010 4:01 pm

crap!!
yeah, they'll tell us what we should know, and, how to think about it.

amazing, no protesters against any of this stuff the prez, et al, are foisting upon us........I guess, as usual, if it's "their guys" doing it, it's ok.......
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Postby AntiM » Sun Aug 15, 2010 4:19 pm

We'd have our Burn on Mars; long trek, bring what you need, harsh conditions, leave no trace. And the back of the ticket would be far more meaningful.
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Postby Clar-i-ty » Tue Aug 17, 2010 9:23 pm

Token wrote:Clar-i-ty is in charge of the tea. I got the Scotch though heaven knows I never turn down a Macallan.

Matter of fact; smoking my pipe and sipping some 10yo Macallan right now, before the heat sets in and the mrs. demands I do laundry and dishes.


I got the tea. Someone bring some fig newtons and we're in beezneez. Thursday at the meet n greet. I live there anyhoo.
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Postby Sanddog42 » Wed Aug 18, 2010 12:59 am

ygmir wrote:amazing, no protesters against any of this stuff the prez, et al, are foisting upon us

What should we be protesting exactly?
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Postby Trishntek » Wed Aug 18, 2010 8:28 am

Sanddog42 wrote:
ygmir wrote:amazing, no protesters against any of this stuff the prez, et al, are foisting upon us

What should we be protesting exactly?


1. Bailouts and government ownership of "private companies".

2. The Federal Reserve Bank's existence, refusal of accountability and manipulative actions.

3. The all consuming government which has destroyed the economy by giving money to those unworthy and punishing those who create wealth.

4. The creation of bureaucracies which have no accountability to Congress or the People and are willing to regulate ideological goals into existence without regard to laws, rights or established protocol.

5. Federal intervention in issues of local and state concern. The states should control the fed gov, not visa versa.

There is so much more,,,,, but then,,,, if someone is asking, "What should we be protesting exactly?" It exemplifies the ignorance which got us into this mess in the first place.
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Postby ygmir » Wed Aug 18, 2010 8:39 am

+1
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Postby Simon of the Playa » Wed Aug 18, 2010 8:41 am

Trishntek wrote:
Sanddog42 wrote:
ygmir wrote:amazing, no protesters against any of this stuff the prez, et al, are foisting upon us

What should we be protesting exactly?


1. Bailouts and government ownership of "private companies".

2. The Federal Reserve Bank's existence, refusal of accountability and manipulative actions.

3. The all consuming government which has destroyed the economy by giving money to those unworthy and punishing those who create wealth.

4. The creation of bureaucracies which have no accountability to Congress or the People and are willing to regulate ideological goals into existence without regard to laws, rights or established protocol.

5. Federal intervention in issues of local and state concern. The states should control the fed gov, not visa versa.

There is so much more,,,,, but then,,,, if someone is asking, "What should we be protesting exactly?" It exemplifies the ignorance which got us into this mess in the first place.




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Postby Sanddog42 » Wed Aug 18, 2010 10:56 am

Trishntek wrote: if someone is asking, "What should we be protesting exactly?" It exemplifies the ignorance which got us into this mess in the first place.


Actually, I was asking because I wanted your perspective without bringing in my preconceptions. I was hoping two burners could have a civil exchange of ideas, but you would rather call me ignorant.

But I'm willing to give it another try. I'm open to being persuaded. So, specifically, what do you protest? All the items you listed are pretty general except No.2, but the Federal Reserve existed well before the current administration, so I don't see how that's particularly relevant. And as for No.1, TARP was signed into law by the previous administration, so that's not really relevant to "the prez."

Of the rest, I'll pose a few questions to get a more specific idea of what you're actually talking about.

1. Exactly hich "private companies" do you mean?

2. Who exactly are the "unworthy" you refer to?

4. Which bureaucracies exactly?

5. Which local and state concerns, exactly?
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Re: If Burners Ran the World

Postby AnyPlace » Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:48 pm

[quote="Clar-i-ty"]I had a really hard week, but invariably I was reminded that Burners really know how to get it done with a minimum amount of BS. It made me stop and wonder. What would it be like if Burners ran the world? Would every day end with a roar of celebration as the sun dips behind the horizon? Would peer pressure lead to innovative creativity? How would our institutions be? What would our institutions be? I leave this here for your consideration.

Of course I know this is an imaginary scenario, we all do, but all things must be imagined before they become a reality.[/quote]

Anarchy is really cool for the strong and represented but what about the rest?
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Re: If Burners Ran the World

Postby knowmad » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:22 pm

AnyPlace wrote:
Clar-i-ty wrote:I had a really hard week, but invariably I was reminded that Burners really know how to get it done with a minimum amount of BS. It made me stop and wonder. What would it be like if Burners ran the world? Would every day end with a roar of celebration as the sun dips behind the horizon? Would peer pressure lead to innovative creativity? How would our institutions be? What would our institutions be? I leave this here for your consideration.

Of course I know this is an imaginary scenario, we all do, but all things must be imagined before they become a reality.


Anarchy is really cool for the strong and represented but what about the rest?


The Rest? Well Lead follow or get out of the way works for alot of that. Seriously though, when my fellow man expects to be goverend, or believes his athority includes subjecting others to his will. I am not free. Just seeing needs of others subjects me to pitty. and as a mature human I pay guilt for pitty, and enable the Rest if you would, to continue on with thier Oblivion, and or Delusions.

Every day we work hard to put an exact replica of yesterday into todays place. Every disaster and mess, is recreated, drawn out and floged to greule. and we debate the best way of minimizing our impact on others and ourself.
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