Inexcusable waste of time and car emissions in and out

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Inexcusable waste of time and car emissions in and out

Postby Luap » Wed Sep 03, 2008 10:33 pm

IMHO
BM makes an unnecessarily HUGE Carbon footprint - it's hypocritical - and a shameful waste of auto emissions and people's time.
Sometimes it's a 5 hr wait to get in, and longer out; could be fixed using some of the $$$ resources that the BMORG collective isn't using there.
Only 2 stoned border agents searching vehicles when I waited for 3 hrs after a virtually empty road on the way up - you can't even offer a free ticket to get more guards - greeters?
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Postby Ugly Dougly » Thu Sep 04, 2008 11:08 am

Yeah, we definitely needed more cops and less burning. ;)
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Re: Inexcusable waste of time and car emissions in and out

Postby ZaphodBurner » Thu Sep 04, 2008 11:37 am

Luap wrote:IMHO
BM makes an unnecessarily HUGE Carbon footprint - it's hypocritical


I don't go to the desert to hug trees. People don't build flamethrowers and pyrotechnics to save the world.

You must be thinking of the Rainbow Gatherings, but, if not, you could always lower the carbon footprint by walking to Burning Man. Participate!

The entrance/exodus times do indeed suck.

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Postby theCryptofishist » Thu Sep 04, 2008 1:01 pm

Does the op have a breakdown of carbon emmissions of bm compared to other vacations?
Disneyland, perhaps? Hawai'i maybe? Paris? Japan?

Or maybe progressives aren't supposed to have vacations, which is why they tend to be short tempered and self rightious, because all work and no play makes jack a very dull man indeed.
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Postby BitterDan » Thu Sep 04, 2008 3:06 pm

I could give a shit about teh carbon footprint but I do know that it is VERY dangerous to leave us sitting in exodus for 5 hours (yes, it took me 5 hours to get to the highway). By the time I could go 60 mph, i was so tired that I thought I was going to fall asleep on the road. Since there are very few places where one can stop to sleep/rest (especially considering that if you do the cops will most likely come harass you) it makes for a risky drive home.

Is there some reason we cant have 3 exits? One that goes to Trego/Jungo with traffic control to keep people from going toward Gerlach from that way, one for people headed south to Reno/Wadsworth and one that is for people heading north.
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Postby Ugly Dougly » Thu Sep 04, 2008 3:06 pm

We need more noobs to tell us how it's supposed to be.
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Postby primate » Thu Sep 04, 2008 3:10 pm

We need to drink more Ten High.
I hear Ten High helps reduce your carbon foot print- or at least stop caring about it.
I came here to kick some ass and drink some Ten-high and I am almost out of Ten-high.
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Postby motskyroonmatick » Thu Sep 04, 2008 5:29 pm

It seemed to me that exodus went really well this year from the radio reports. I think more people planned to leave at low traffic times and there was no wait until 10 or later on Monday morning.
BLM dictates that we can only have one exit point and that is to control traffic volume on highway 34 for safety reasons(Road carrying capacity).
I leave Tuesday AM after a full nights sleep and I have had no wait whatsoever.
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won't work

Postby Otisserie » Thu Sep 04, 2008 5:29 pm

BitterDan wrote:Is there some reason we cant have 3 exits? One that goes to Trego/Jungo with traffic control to keep people from going toward Gerlach from that way, one for people headed south to Reno/Wadsworth and one that is for people heading north.


This has been suggested time and again, and it just won't work. The problem is if there is a 3 hour line going south and a 15 minute line going north then hundreds of cars will get in the north-bound exit. They will drive 1/2 mile up the road and try and turn around; and there is no way you can police the road enough to prevent it. The cars will cause a great clusterfuck turning around, and another one trying to get through the flaggers at 8-mile heading south. This will screw up any local traffic unlucky enough to be on the road at the time.

The bottom line is this: there's a two lane road going out of BM and that ain't gonna change.
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Postby Kenny Z » Fri Sep 05, 2008 12:38 pm

I tend to look at the traffic jams as positive. Yeah, it sucks to wait in line 5 hours to leave but after spending an entire week having fun, 5 hours of misery is nothing. On the other hand, if I got there on Friday and left Sunday, that 5 hours would almost seem not worth it. To me, traffic jams and dust storms are yahoo filters and a necessity. Looking at the positive side of negative events will definitely help your state of mind. :wink:
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Postby chrispburn » Fri Sep 05, 2008 1:41 pm

what ever happened to the staging lines idea??? This is what I thought the process was from when I started in 2001

start a single line, then when it maxed out, start out line two, then three, etc.
tell people to shut off their engines.

wait for line 1 to clear the gate, then line two can start their engines again and drive out. continue process as needed.

IT IS ABSOLUTELY RIDICULOUS to have 5-8 lanes of traffic all idling their engines, waiting to merge into 1 lane.

I am specifically reacting to 2007, Sunday afternoon/evening. The irony of the "Green Man" theme and the disorganized cluster fuck just completely blew me away and bummed me out. IT was the BM community at it's worst.
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Postby BitterDan » Fri Sep 05, 2008 2:01 pm

Kenny Z wrote:I tend to look at the traffic jams as positive. Yeah, it sucks to wait in line 5 hours to leave but after spending an entire week having fun, 5 hours of misery is nothing. On the other hand, if I got there on Friday and left Sunday, that 5 hours would almost seem not worth it. To me, traffic jams and dust storms are yahoo filters and a necessity. Looking at the positive side of negative events will definitely help your state of mind. :wink:


Typically I wouldn't mind it but after spending 8 hours breaking down camp and cleaning moop it really drains you to sit in traffic for 5 hours before having to driving 110 miles to Reno. Indian Tacos saved my life this year, if it wasn't for that stop I think I would have killed someone.
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Postby mars » Sun Sep 07, 2008 10:39 am

This is one good reason to share rides and not travel alone. Once person can get a little sleep while the other drives and the two can trade off. Also, try to get some sleep the night before you leave or take a quick cat-nap before you get on the road. You have to just plan for a long exodus and then if you get out without one, all the better.
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Postby willyloafofphora » Mon Sep 08, 2008 2:34 pm

I left Monday afternoon at around 3:00 and only had to wait about a hour and a half or so. There was a bar and grill set up in the middle of the road and they fed me grilled cheese. It was really nice, I didn't think exodus was that bad at all this year but its definitely important to make sure your well rested before you head out.
As for the carbon footprint of the event I don't think its that bad considering what comes out of it. I mean I live I SoCal where like 25% of the population drives huge trucks to the desert every other weekend so they can then spend 2 or 3 days screaming yippee, speeding all over sensitive habitat on vehicles with no emission control, smoking meth and downing buttwiper. Other peoples vacations often involve traveling on jets to places like Las Vegas, Hawaii, or Cancun where their environments are almost constantly air conditioned and they need a rental car to get around and see all of the sights. Once you get to the playa chances are you drive nothing but a bike for the whole week.
I drive a car that gets over forty miles to the gallon and always try to conserve energy around the house and never shop at Walmart. If I want to borrow or rent a truck once a year and drive 1200 miles round trip to hang out with the weirdest funnest people in the world then I,m gonna fucking do it dagnabit and I'm not going to feel bad about it. I also think that the burn is a huge amazing learning experience for everyone involved and that the benefit of this far outweighs the negative aspect of carbon emissions. Besides once on the playa I barely burn anything. This year I went through 3 gallons of gas in my super efficient Honda EU 1000 generator and a little bit of propane on a communal stove and that was it that was all I personally burned while on the playa. If I had stayed at home I would have used more energy than that just using my computer and lights.If your really concerned about your carbon foot print empty your refrigerator before you leave and turn it off. You don't have to burn to have fun at the burn one of the funniest things of the whole week was when the fire conclave didn't get to do their thing. I know they practice all year and whatnot but I just don't think its that exciting anymore burning the man is more than enough fire for me.
Oh I do really like the staging lines idea that way you could take a little nap while waiting or hang out with other burners and keep the party going till the very last second and save on fuel and emissions.
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Postby theCryptofishist » Mon Sep 08, 2008 2:40 pm

Oh, don't try and talk sense to these people.


Well, okay, do. It makes me feel a little less lonely.
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Postby gyre » Tue Sep 09, 2008 1:09 am

The staging lanes thing really needs to be done.

You can enlarge your carbon footprint by changing to those long life light bulbs and burning things.
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Postby bluedragon » Tue Sep 09, 2008 5:48 am

we took a nap after the temple burn......woke up at 3:30 am and drove out in !5 minutes........had fun all day on Sunday instead of sitting in a line and then pulled over to join a small roadside cluster of burners to sleep until morning. The staging line sounds like a great idea as idling for 5 hours sucks.
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Postby ZaphodBurner » Tue Sep 09, 2008 12:10 pm

I like the staging lines idea, too. Makes too much sense, though.

During the day, or even at night, older vehicles are going to overheat idling or rolling at .25 mph (measured by GPS) Or, they'll shut their engines off, restart, shut them off, restart, etc until they've hammered their battery without allowing it to recharge.

Idling for hours is bad, m'kay? Plus it's goddamn dangerous for x-thousand dusty, hungover, playaed-out drivers to hit the highway on a holiday weekend after sitting in line for half a day or night.

The staging arrangement makes perfect sense. Maybe a friendly burner petition to the org is in order. At the very least, they could try it for half a day next year to measure wait times against the rest of exodus.

I'm not intending for this to be criticism, just participatory suggestion on how to improve the experience, fuel economy and safety. Cheers!

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Postby Isotopia » Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:26 pm

BM makes an unnecessarily HUGE Carbon footprint - it's hypocritical - and a shameful waste of auto emissions and people's time.


Hey Luap, I'm not sure which is blowing more carbon based gas here. The exhaust of vehicles waiting to get out of the event or your whining about it

If you don't like what you see I'm sure the volunteer folk in the Exodus group would be more than happy to listen to your constructive ideas and how you hope to see them through.

Otherwise you're just talkin' out your....






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Postby theCryptofishist » Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:33 pm

Just another contestant in the playa game show Spend Larry's Money.
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Postby Dave_techie » Tue May 05, 2009 11:11 pm

tiered exodus not only gives you that decreased footprint, and more energy, but more time to hang out, instead of bing in your car, you can hang out with other burners in line with you, a la gas stations circa carter administration.
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Postby Captain Goddammit » Wed May 06, 2009 6:46 am

Hey, that odd-even gas rationing idea worked great! Didn't it?
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Postby Playa Tom » Wed May 06, 2009 9:09 pm

Perimeter, Gate, Greeters and Exodus are staffed by volunteers. If the wait is too long you have a chance to do something about it. Quit whining and volunteer for a shift or two.
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Postby dragonpilot » Thu May 07, 2009 1:46 pm

I've always advocated a special line for northbound travelers. You minimize the line cutters with a quick glance at a drivers license...if it's an address south of Gerlach...no go! If N. Calif or further north...it's a go!

Even reducing the Exodus line by 20% (approx number of NB travelers) would go a long way to reducing everyone's wait time.

Of course BLM will prolly never permit it, but I envision a road parallel to Rt 34 on the playa popping out at the 3-way intersection just north of Gerlach. For that matter, the traffic on Rt 34 north of Gerlach isn't really that bad, so just allowing northbound travelers a special line to the hardball would work too.

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Postby RedheadBarbie » Sat May 09, 2009 7:23 am

Leave before the burn, no line at all. It was great. You couldn't pay me to sit through Exodus.
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Postby ibdave » Sat May 09, 2009 8:41 am

RedheadBarbie wrote:Leave before the burn, no line at all. It was great. You couldn't pay me to sit through Exodus.



Did that last year and will do the same this year.... :shock: 8) :idea:
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Postby ygmir » Sat May 09, 2009 8:43 am

I'm hoping to hitch a ride out on Simon's helicopter............

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Postby FilXeno » Mon May 11, 2009 11:21 pm

ygmir wrote:I'm hoping to hitch a ride out on Simon's helicopter............

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If you do, are you gunna drop snakes on the rest of us?
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Postby ygmir » Tue May 12, 2009 6:06 am

FilXeno wrote:
ygmir wrote:I'm hoping to hitch a ride out on Simon's helicopter............

Image


If you do, are you gunna drop snakes on the rest of us?


some may think so if we're flying naked............giggle..........
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Postby gaminwench » Tue May 12, 2009 1:35 pm

Last year we left Monday afternoon, as always, and for the first time in 9 years there was NO STOPPING at all. Kinda blew my normal Exodus routine...feed the parked Burners, playabath, change into 'regular' clothes(or just put some on!!). Had already gone through Gerlach when I realized I didn't have a shirt on...oops!!
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