Pain Management Thread

All things outside of Burning Man.

Pain Management Thread

Postby KinestheticThought » Tue Nov 26, 2013 4:45 am

I am starting this thread for the following reasons:
1) As a place to exchange information about ways to cope with pain (especially chronic and/or severe pain).
2) As a place to give and/or ask for support.
3) To help myself and others track their progress/efforts (which can help identify pattens and help deal with times that are worse...also see reason#2 when this occurs)

#1 exchange information about coping with pain:
* Remember that pain cycles come/go in waves. Sometimes bad pain can last a really long time, and it's easy to forget the good times...but try to remember times in your life you have felt better and work to convince yourself that this (whatever this is whather it is a new injury or something you have struggled with for years-or both...whatever it is you are suffering, convince youself that this is the lowpoint on a sign wave....you have been on the upcurb before and will again...)
* If you were born on a downcurve, focus on what you think could be. Doctors didn't think I'd walk at all when I was born, but I became a ski instructor, an although it has been hard for me to believe it could be possible...I try to remember to set my signs on the slopes and work toward skiing again. Personally I am very inspired by someone with CP who is absolutely adamant that someday he will walk. He does not let the severe effects of his condition stop him from scuba diving, skiing, sky-diving and he is certain his continued efforts in adaptive spots will help him to one day be able to walk. He's never walked before, his doctors say he can't...but with his attitude, I believe he will someday.
* Focus on NOW. Don't worry about pain you've had in the past, how long it's been, or how long it might be...focus on just right now. Just this very minute. Evaluate how good/bad you CURRENTLY feel in and at this moment. If you are hurting, identify where/why and begin taking steps (even if you don't think they will work) toward dealing with it (ice/heat, TENS, schedule a massage, accupuncture, craniosacral therapy, physical therapy, seeing a pain management specialist-including following through on things like triggerpoint injections, epidurals...whatever you/your dr think is right for you. And if the last thing didn't work, keep trying while also reaching out for support to keep hope toward trying<---words of a person who just a few days ago had no hope, felt the pain would never go away....but I tried another treatment and it hurt but helped more than it hurt. Even if it doesn't fix everything, it was worth doing...the last treatment I had had left me in months of agony-I felt like giving up and was sure that since that last treatment hurt so bad I didn't want this one...but this time it was worth it, so know that I'm not belitling your pain when I try to help you minimize it by staying in the moment and staying focused on trying whatever you can today/right now whether it's trying an old thing again b/c today is a different day or trying something new because you've already tried x repeatedly...it can sometimes be hard, but try to stay in the now, today, this moment and find one thing you can do for yourself. then the next moment do another thing, then another...focus on what you want or can do for yourself right now in this moment (and if painful like some PT can be, then focus on how what you are doing NOW is actively doing something to improve your future...go ahead and feel good about the investment you are making right now and appreciate yourself in that moment for what you are doing even if it doesn't immediately pay off. If it helps, give yourself a hug (or pat or rub...whatever feels good to you, even if it's just putting yourself in your most comfortable position to comfort yourself, do it) and tell yourself thats a hug from you in the future when you feel better (lke the future that feels better comforting the current you that is doing the work and going through the trenches). It can be hard to look from the trenches toward the future, so maybe try thinking from the perspective of a future me/you that doesn't hurt coming to visit...what would they say? what would they do? ...probably tell you to do one more round of your excercises even though it hurts and offer a hug as a thank you for doing it even though it sucks. They'd probably make you call your doctor when you know you need to but have been putting it off because __fill in blank with what seem like justifyiable reasons...but your future self calls BS and hands you the phone__ ....it might be a way to give yourself the hard kick in the pants to do what you need to while also loving yourself for being willing to.
* My doctor said, "Just focus on things other than the pain. Think about life, not pain." I replied that's easier said than done, but that I appreciate the point. The thing is, this is really important. When in pain, it's SOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooo hard to do....but (once you have done EVERYTHING on your list of things to do to help ease your pain/long term improve your condition, repeatedly, until they are no longer of benefit to you, looked for and tried/exhausted new options and have done literally everything upteen times) then there is a point of acceptance that involves finding ways to connect to life despite the severity of your condition.This may involve friends/family, religion, volunteering....find SOMETHING that mkes you feel like life is worth living and focus on and expand that vitality, that life, that joy that that that thing bring you-and keep trying repeatedly and/or different things if it doesn't immediately help you feel better-unfortunately these things take some.
* Make a list of reasons it's important for you to continue to try, then read over that when hopeflessness creeps in.

#2 Give/Ask for Help
My Give: Starting this thread is out of love for myself and others.
My Ask: Please do not pity me, or allow me to pity myself. However, offer your support as things have been really tough. I need people to remind me to apply the advice I give others to my own life.
I need people to check-in with me so that I feel connection with others and feel cared about.
I need to shake a current slump of depression, retrain my mind to deal with each individual moment instead of keep saying "I'm in pain" "I've been in pain forever" etc...I need to start doing things again (PT, social, household chores, everything). I need to retrain my brain to "I can" instead of can't as first-line, then deal with situations where I really can't...but I need to push my boundaries instead of let them close in on me...need to do more to deal with the pain not do less because I'm in pain....so I guess for this one I am asking for encouragement, opportunity to be strong and supprt others (meanwhile pulling myself up along with every individual I help and each strong statment I make), and any suggestions people having for changing automatic negative thoughts like these.
I need people to help make sure I follow through with making and keeping important medical appointments (PT, accupuncture, mental health care, everything I can possibly do I need to keep the fire lit to do EVERYTHING). <--family/friends are working on this, but it never hurts to have more people checking in in a supportive way

THANKS, in advance :-)

#3 Track progress/efforts
I have a long history with pain. My first operation was when I was just a few months old, and by my teen years I had almost as many surgeries as birthdays. I've dealt with a number of things over the years, and am just now starting to see how my differnt conditions (foot, knee, hip, back, neck, psychiatric) are all interlinked. We have always known that my foot problem caused leg-length discrepency-but just now discovere it is NOT the leg with the severe club foot that is short, it's the "normal" leg....so we have been correcting it the wrong direction! Correcting this is leading to major improvements in posture, which have drastically reduced my pain. However, my brain will aknowledge that then go right back to thinking I've had this pain forever, gonna have it forever....the negative thougths I've labeled "pain brain." Right now my physical pain is reduced, and I need to convince my mind of that so that I get full benefit out of my treatments and continue to improve.

That history sumarizing many years worth of progress/efforts, here are the most recent efforts:
DATE: Summer 2013
WHAT I DID: Got care for my back/neck instead of just the more obvious problems of my foot, knees, and other areas that have had surgeries. Started the ball rolling toward getting an MRI, getting into pain managment, and taking a more active role in dealing with the pain instead of trying to pretend it didn't exist (which CAN be a skill, but only if you've really legitimately tried everything, not just think you've tried everything which is where I was in months preceeding)
IMPROVEMENT: None at first, then felt good, then bad, then horrible...now relatively better and working my way back up

DATE: September 2013
WHAT I DID: Finally started going to pain management in addition to already established PT, craniosacral therapy, etc
IMPROVEMENT: None (at first). Made me worse September-November 25, 2013.

DATE: November 25
WHAT I DID: Even though my experience with injections has been HORRIBLE, I allowed them to try triggerpoint injections. This helped immensely until my muscles (and mind from so many years of having to be careful not to hurt myself) instinctively began splinting...I have worked all day to continue to relax, remind myself that it IS ok to move now...the pain isn't what it has been, FEEL how it is NOW, do what I can for the now. I started this (which was empowring for me and also a gift to all of you).
IMPROVEMENT: Significant, but still struggling.My improvement has gone from literally suicidal (had a severe headache every day since October...during which time I had had accupuncture, craniosacral,pt, ice, TENS, chiropractic, mental health care...everything I could think of and I couldn't see any way out of the pain, couldn't see any future, and fell into a very bad depression where I saw no worth in me anymore, no hope for regaining who I used to be, etc....)....then I had this treatment and the headache went away fully for a second so I know it's possible, and now is much more manageable.. I'm tipping between a "I'm totally fine, just stop worrying about my neck/back and just go do things without regard for pain" attitude and realizing that although my doctor has told me to increase activity, he did say to work up to it slowly and pain (when really present and as strongly as I perceive it to be) is there for a reason...I guess right now I'm seeking the balance thereof and to do whatever I can to improve/maintain the benefit of this treatment.

In the next few days, I need to:
* Practice slowly moving my neck and finding out where my boundaries really are. Tell myself I'm going slow, not going to go past discomfort to pain (and in fact once I find discomfort back off sliglthy to it remains a pleasant stretch/exploration. I need to do this regularly to find out how my body really is now (my mind is trained to think it's broken, hurts, need to be careful, etc...but the reality is that I need to be careful/slow in pushing/exploring my new post-procedure boundaries)
* I need to do every form of PT I've ever been shown, and not give up just because it sucks (unless one specific thing really HURTS in a way I think might be bad, then I'll do all other excercises/stretches/etc and ask about the thing that hurt hurts)
* I need to try to sleep even though it is difficult for me to fall/stay asleep, I need to work on relaxation techniques to get there.
* Continue ice/heat, TENS, meds as needed, stetching...everything you have been doing and can possibly think of to do, do it...don't just think about doing it...do it!


I'm hoping that the way that I have formated this may be helpful to others. It can be hard to figure out how to say what you need to when you're in pain....but I think this is laid out fairly clearly, and if everyone followed the format everyone who posted would both give and receive :-) (Welecomed though not necesary...sometimes we just can't, but please try :-) )
KinestheticThought
 
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 12:28 am

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Simon of the Playa » Tue Nov 26, 2013 5:40 am

TOO LONG DIDN'T READ.



the answer is Marijuana.




that is all...


seriously.
fuck you, it's magic


Less Hanky, More Panky™

A gift for the Playa

THIS YEARS POSTERS

2015 posters
User avatar
Simon of the Playa
 
Posts: 15517
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:25 pm
Location: Rochester, Nevada.
Burning Since: 1996
Camp Name: La Guilde des Hashischins

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Dr. Pyro » Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:52 am

Just trying to get through that entire tedious thread gave me a pain.
User avatar
Dr. Pyro
 
Posts: 3952
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 8:11 am
Location: Newcastle, CA
Burning Since: 1999
Camp Name: Barbie Death Camp & Wine Bistro

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby GreyCoyote » Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:10 am

Boy, that was a read. :mrgreen: And an eyeopener.

Dunno what to say here except "I feel for you". That is lame as hell, but sympathy is about all I can offer.

Pain is a very personal road. Those who have never really experienced chronic pain wont understand it.
"Resistance is futile. You will be commodified"..."
c.f Larry Harvey, The BMOrg
User avatar
GreyCoyote
 
Posts: 1540
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 9:24 am
Burning Since: 2000

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby ygmir » Tue Nov 26, 2013 9:34 am

I hope this thread turns into exactly what you want.
Good on ya for starting it. Lots of info, some may skip the intro post, but, the idea is super and undoubtedly helpful to several in our "community".

I have nothing but sympathy, to offer for now, you covered all my knowledge. But I do have some knowledge, having a herniated and two crushed disks, torn knee ligaments, and cranio-rectal inversion.
YGMIR

Unabashed Nordic
Pagan
User avatar
ygmir
 
Posts: 27201
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:36 pm
Location: nevada county
Burning Since: 2017
Camp Name: qqqq

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby lucky420 » Tue Nov 26, 2013 9:36 am

^^^@Yggy :lol: :lol:
Oh my god, it's HUGE!
User avatar
lucky420
 
Posts: 5593
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 10:47 am
Location: Reno, NV
Burning Since: I'm not sure
Camp Name: Dye with Dignity

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Dr. Pyro » Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:14 am

ygmir wrote: cranio-rectal inversion.


As I always suspected.
User avatar
Dr. Pyro
 
Posts: 3952
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 8:11 am
Location: Newcastle, CA
Burning Since: 1999
Camp Name: Barbie Death Camp & Wine Bistro

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby FIGJAM » Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:16 am

Dr. Pyro wrote:
ygmir wrote: cranio-rectal inversion.


As I always suspected.


I thought Yg caught it from you? :P
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

"If I can't find an answer, I'll create one!!!"

Fuck Im Good Just Ask Me
User avatar
FIGJAM
 
Posts: 8470
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:39 am
Location: apache junction az.

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Elliot » Tue Nov 26, 2013 11:58 am

ygmir wrote:I hope this thread turns into exactly what you want.
Good on ya for starting it. Lots of info, some may skip the intro post, but, the idea is super and undoubtedly helpful to several in our "community".

I have nothing but sympathy, to offer for now, you covered all my knowledge. But I do have some knowledge, having a herniated and two crushed disks, torn knee ligaments
, and cranio-rectal inversion.

Oatmeal with honey ALLLL over the screen.

Hey K.T.; glad you started the thread. I'll try to plow thru it now. :wink: (Please read my latest PM soon. :D )
Elliot's Naked Bicycle Service & Piano Bar - a 2015 BRC Theme Camp

http://www.elliotsbikes.org

---------------Bike come unglued? Take it to the nude dude!---------------


Image
User avatar
Elliot
 
Posts: 6282
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 9:41 pm
Location: Clearlake, Northern California
Burning Since: 2006
Camp Name: Elliot’s Bicycle Service

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby H.G.Crosby » Tue Nov 26, 2013 12:12 pm

Image
Once I noticed I was on fire, I decided to relax and enjoy the fall™
User avatar
H.G.Crosby
 
Posts: 1918
Joined: Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:47 pm
Location: Boston, New York, Paris, Tangiers

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Elliot » Tue Nov 26, 2013 12:45 pm

K.T., I have "chewed on" your post now for half hour, and I recognize/understand a lot of it. There are also other ePlayans who have similar issues, and we are indeed a community of folks who support each other. So laugh at the wisecracks, keep it short and to the point, and I think we can make some progress here. :D
Elliot's Naked Bicycle Service & Piano Bar - a 2015 BRC Theme Camp

http://www.elliotsbikes.org

---------------Bike come unglued? Take it to the nude dude!---------------


Image
User avatar
Elliot
 
Posts: 6282
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 9:41 pm
Location: Clearlake, Northern California
Burning Since: 2006
Camp Name: Elliot’s Bicycle Service

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby tatonka » Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:09 pm

Simon of the Playa wrote:TOO LONG DIDN'T READ.



the answer is Marijuana.




that is all...


seriously.


so true :)
winners never quit , quitters never win

4 wheels move the body , two wheels moves the soul

Music is the great healer of the soul
User avatar
tatonka
 
Posts: 1849
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:28 pm
Location: oregon
Burning Since: 2013
Camp Name: Rancho Deluxe

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby KinestheticThought » Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:38 pm

To all of the "Too long didn't read" people...you obviously don't suffer chronic pain. Fine. Go to another thread.

To all the "Marijuana is the answer" people...I do hear you. Medical Marijuana saved my life in 2005 when I was in so much pain I was going to commit suicide but someone introduced me to the herb (I'd been to the ER and their drugs did nothing to reduce my pain from 22/10 and still climbing...but one hit of marijuana stopped the pain from continuing to climb and in a matter of minuted reduced it to a tolerable 4/10). HOWEVER, there is such a thing as tolerance, inability to drive whie impaired, job random tests (which the ADA does NOT protect you from even if legal medical marijuana patient becuase feds don't recognize those state laws)...so it cannot be a patient's ONLY source for relief. If it could, I wouldn't be here posting this. I woudn't cry every day/night. I wouldn't need help if this were all I needed. ...and I know I'm not the only one.
KinestheticThought
 
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 12:28 am

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby KinestheticThought » Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:43 pm

Anyone know how to delete this thread and try again with an intro post that isn't TLDR?
KinestheticThought
 
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 12:28 am

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Eric » Tue Nov 26, 2013 9:32 pm

KinestheticThought wrote:Anyone know how to delete this thread and try again with an intro post that isn't TLDR?


We don't delete or remove posts because of tl;dr - they pretty much have to break the few rules around here for that to happen (extreme personal attacks, publishing another parties information without consent, commerce, etc). The ePlaya has a strong tradition of "stand by your words", which is one reason you can only edit your posts for a short period. Don't worry, everyone has made a "clumsy" post at one point, and this thread has barely gotten any snark. You're actually doing pretty good. :D

You're free to try another summary within this thread, but please don't make another thread on the same topic - we'll just have to merge them together. You also have to take into consideration that the people with chronic pain issues on the board may not want to talk about them here, or already talk about them in the "Fuck" thread or the Bar. This thread has existed less than 24 hours, it may yet turn into something. It may not. You never know which threads are going to catch on here.
Survival Guide * First Timers Guide * Ticket Info

It's a camping trip in the desert, not the redemption of the fallen world - Cryptofishist

Eric ShutterSlut
Ass't Editor, BRC Weekly
User avatar
Eric
Moderator
 
Posts: 8290
Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 9:45 pm
Burning Since: 2003
Camp Name: BRC Weekly

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Canoe » Tue Nov 26, 2013 9:43 pm

Due to a surgeon letting his student perform surgery in place of the surgeon, I ended up with chronic pain. After several years, I discovered this:

Canoe wrote:I was on morphine three times a day. By eliminating coffee and cola drinks from my diet, in one week I went to needing morphine once or twice a week. In the following months and for some years:
  • a serving of coffee or cola drink would aggravate the pain to prior levels for two to three days before tapering off.
  • Tea did not have an affect (I have dozens of types).
  • Decaffeinated coffee also did not have an affect.
  • But a serving of decaffeinated coffee along with a serving of tea (or other caffeine source, typically some soft drinks) within roughly a half day of each other would have the same pain aggravation as having regular coffee.
This gives the appearance that the culprit is something that is in coffee other than caffeine (alkaloids?), combined with a source of caffeine (of course both are in non-decaffeinated coffee).

Over ten years later, I can now tolerate an occasional serving of coffee or cola drink, but experience an increase in pain levels, be it minor to moderate, for one to three days, along with a one in three chance of triggering significant pain. Over the past couple of years I slowly discovered cold brewed coffee, which - for reasons unknown has not triggered an episode of significant pain - so far.

As with all pain patients, your results may vary, greatly. But eliminating coffee from one's diet is very low cost to try.


In addition, I found that citrus fruits would also increase pain, more intensely than coffee, but recovery was in hours. And wheat would increase the pain, so I minimized it and discovered that its affect was a minor boot in pain, but it would last days.

Your results may vary...
Odd. No bears to watch in the dump. Oh well, lets go across the road & pick blueberries.
.
... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.
User avatar
Canoe
 
Posts: 2090
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:01 pm

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Canoe » Tue Nov 26, 2013 9:44 pm

I found immense benefit in looking for one thing each day, that made it worthwhile having enduring that day's pain. Be it a song on the radio, or seeing sunlight shining through leaves. Which reminds me, having a view of nature was very valuable. A view out a window was better, but photos, videos, even the computer desktop...
Odd. No bears to watch in the dump. Oh well, lets go across the road & pick blueberries.
.
... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.
User avatar
Canoe
 
Posts: 2090
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:01 pm

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby BBadger » Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:35 pm

I haven't suffered much of the kinds of pain -- chronic pain -- described above and hope I never do. It's hard for me to do useful work even with a just a regular headache.

The worst pain I've felt was from a butt-cramp I suffered after jumping into a cold lake twice after a long hike up to the lake. I was fortunate enough to not drown from my seizing calf muscle, and managed to float my way to the shore and gimp my way back to my tent. Once I reached the tent though, my calf- and butt-muscles started cramping severely and I was literally clawing the ground in agony trying not to move. The pain was worse than when I got a big goose-egg on my cheek from a sledge hammer handle hit it as a kid -- leaving a scar.

I eventually made my way slowly to the toiletry bag I brought and dumped out the pill bottle containing the magnesium supplements I had actually brought so I could sleep well that night. I downed about twice the daily recommended amount (recommended because it can affect your shits), and the muscles eventually relaxed after another 5 minutes as I rested -- which felt like forever.

So what's the point of the above story? Get some magnesium supplements. They relax the muscles, and usually you won't be eating enough vegis with mag in it to make up the difference. It's done wonders for myself and my family. My dad in particular would leap out of bed in the middle of the night due to pains related to muscle cramping. After he's started taking more mag before going to bed or after doing work and it has cut that down dramatically. Cramps are debilitating, even if for a short while. Most (American) football injured players you'll see on the ground are from cramps. I've also even taken them during hikes when my muscles were feeling stiff and I couldn't afford to have them not moving well.

Get some electric heating pads too. They're so cheap, and so simple, and yet can make you feel better when you're sore or just cold. They help increase circulation, and comfort. Older people should definitely use them to keep warm, and are often unaware of their existence or use. A warm house is often not enough to keep those limbs warm especially when sitting. It beats using a space heater too.
"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

Hate reading my replies? Click here to add me to your plonk (foe) list.
User avatar
BBadger
 
Posts: 4432
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 11:37 am
Location: (near) Portland, OR, USA
Burning Since: I'm not sure

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby BBadger » Tue Nov 26, 2013 11:03 pm

Canoe wrote:This gives the appearance that the culprit is something that is in coffee other than caffeine (alkaloids?), combined with a source of caffeine (of course both are in non-decaffeinated coffee).

In addition, I found that citrus fruits would also increase pain, more intensely than coffee, but recovery was in hours. And wheat would increase the pain, so I minimized it and discovered that its affect was a minor boot in pain, but it would last days.


From a cursory reading, coffee does contain opiod receptor binding compounds. These occupy the receptor and prevent it from being activated by opiods such as morphine. Also, which citrus fruits? Grapefruit in particular affects substantial numbers of enzymes, often preventing them from being metabolized by the liver. Some people try to use this to their "advantage" to extend their highs, but it may also affect drugs that need to be absorbed and metabolized into other forms to work. If it's just orange juice, it could be that the acidity (not alkalinity) of the drink -- and this would also include coffee and soft drinks -- that is causing your kidneys to flush more of the opiods to your urine, rather than allowing it to be absorbed.

All-in-all, a good plan of action is to keep a journal of what foods, drinks, supplements, etc. you're ingesting in order to nail down exactly what might be causing problems. Sometimes just compounds such as flavonoids will antagonize certain receptors, or prevent certain compounds from being broken down. With enough data you can work out some correlations in what is causing problems (as you have above), and see what the constituent compounds are that may be causing problems.
"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

Hate reading my replies? Click here to add me to your plonk (foe) list.
User avatar
BBadger
 
Posts: 4432
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 11:37 am
Location: (near) Portland, OR, USA
Burning Since: I'm not sure

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Canoe » Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:09 am

BBadger wrote:... Get some electric heating pads too. They're so cheap, and so simple, and yet can make you feel better when you're sore or just cold. They help increase circulation, and comfort. ...

I got huge reduction in pain following a single Far Infrared heat treatment at a ski&bike shop. I'd gone in looking for an easy-to-ride step-through bike, obviously in pain, shortly barely able to talk as that movement had aggravated the pain in my chest from the adhesions & scar tissue. They told me about a machine they had for treating their stiff & sore ski customers. After an hour of treatment ($40), I was hugely relaxed, and energized, I could walk and move with ease, little pain, and minimal pain talking. The machine had a series of Far Infrared "domes" that went over me while I laid on a Far Infrared heating pad, followed by a "chi machine" supporting my ankles while it moved them side to side in what seemed to be a continuous figure eight motion. With each side-to-side, I could feel scar tissue stretching gently, little by little. As I left the room I had to resist doing some forward rolls from my Aikido days. Pain subsequently returns, but I get relief from subsequent treatment. Morphine once a month, and - with limitations - I have a large part of my life back.

A friend hurt her neck and was told it would be a number of weeks, likely two to three months before the pain would be reduced enough before they could start physio-therapy, and then six months to a year before she should expect to be able to be back to work. She went to that ski&bike shop for a Far Infrared treatment, one a day for a week. She started physio-therapy a week later, bought one of the treatment beds ($$$) and put it in a spare bedroom. She was back to work in a month and a half, with physio continuing for eight months.
Odd. No bears to watch in the dump. Oh well, lets go across the road & pick blueberries.
.
... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.
User avatar
Canoe
 
Posts: 2090
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:01 pm

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Canoe » Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:24 am

BBadger wrote:... From a cursory reading, coffee does contain opiod receptor binding compounds. These occupy the receptor and prevent it from being activated by opiods such as morphine. ...

Nice to know. The why was always a mystery.

BBadger wrote:... Also, which citrus fruits? ... it could be that the acidity (not alkalinity) of the drink -- and this would also include coffee and soft drinks -- that is causing your kidneys to flush more of the opiods to your urine, rather than allowing it to be absorbed...

Orange, lemon, lime, grapefruit. Recently I've tried pomelo, but not had a pain increase. But as my pain is down, the aggravating affect of citrus is also down, as though it causes a % increase in pain, not an increase by a set amount.

I also had a meaningful decrease in pain, and hence ease in breathing, with a prescription NSAID. It was the one pulled after being associated with heart issues. I had relief after a matter of hours of starting on it. Over subsequent weeks, the 12" x 1" surgical scar was no longer raised nor inflammed red, despite having remained so for some years after the surgery. When the NSAID was discontinued, the benefit it had given remained. As the pain seemed aggravated by inflammation, I paid attention to the list of food thought to aggravate the inflammation of arthritis, which led to figuring out about the citrus and the wheat, hence to being able to avoid some episodes of aggravated pain. Other foods on that list didn't appear to aggravate my pain. Every one is different.
Odd. No bears to watch in the dump. Oh well, lets go across the road & pick blueberries.
.
... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.
User avatar
Canoe
 
Posts: 2090
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 8:01 pm

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby BBadger » Wed Nov 27, 2013 8:04 am

Canoe wrote:The machine had a series of Far Infrared "domes" that went over me while I laid on a Far Infrared heating pad, followed by a "chi machine" supporting my ankles while it moved them side to side in what seemed to be a continuous figure eight motion. With each side-to-side, I could feel scar tissue stretching gently, little by little. As I left the room I had to resist doing some forward rolls from my Aikido days. Pain subsequently returns, but I get relief from subsequent treatment. Morphine once a month, and - with limitations - I have a large part of my life back.


Far infrared, beyond the spectrum of heat then? That sounds similar to low-level laser therapy (LLLT) using near-IR (720nm - 1400nm) and red light (~650nm) -- of course, not without the articulation machine. Originally I thought LLLT was quackery, but upon further investigation I've read it helps help with some forms of pain (arthritic, back pain, wound healing), with stimulating blood flow, and even helping with hair loss/growth. Rather than ponying up for treatment or buying some multi-thousand-dollar product, some people have even made their own laser arrays for hair loss.

If you're interested in making your own, you can buy low-power red lasers for super cheap on eBay and then just hook them up like the guy on the site has done or in some other array. I've bought some of the above lasers for other projects and they appear to work fine. The $0.25 price is much better than paying $4/laser. Each laser has its own resistor, so all you need to do is hook up the right voltage. Might be worth a shot if things get pricey.

An alternative is to buy a single higher powered red laser and defocus it. Remember, however, that you'll need to buy some eye safety goggles for that. Other laser wavelengths are available too for near-IR (830nm, 720nm, etc.). You will need really need special goggles that filter IR for those because your eye will not even blink when exposed to them as they appear invisible.

There are also LED solutions, but they're much less efficient than the lasers. You also need to make sure you're getting the 650nm or 660nm LEDs, not the more common 635nm LEDs. Using high quality grow lights might work if you don't want to build them yourself, but make sure they're the correct wavelength. In general you'll want the 650nm anyway if you want to grow tomatoes or other plants indoors in the winter.
"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

Hate reading my replies? Click here to add me to your plonk (foe) list.
User avatar
BBadger
 
Posts: 4432
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 11:37 am
Location: (near) Portland, OR, USA
Burning Since: I'm not sure

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby AntiM » Wed Nov 27, 2013 8:34 am

Everyone is indeed different. I have moderate arthritis pain, plus back pain, and the pangs/stings associated with my abdominal surgeries and hernia mesh. These are in no way major pains, but they do wear me down. Okay, some moments do get intense. Nerve pain, joint pain.... different animals for me.

I find if I do not have caffeinated coffee daily, at least one cup, but never more than three, my joints flare up. I have given up nightshades completely, especially tomatoes, as they ratchet up the arthritis pain a great deal. MyLarry is even more sensitive to that, his hands are gnarled and getting worse. No problem with citrus, but I don't consume enough to notice.

I was taking Celebrex, but my blood pressure was staying high. I tried ginger, and it has done wonders. I take a capsule or two daily, plus have it around in other forms, fresh, candied, and tea. Eases inflammation beautifully ... for me. Others have had mixed results with ginger, but because it has little or no side effects or interactions, it is a good one to try.

Milk and dairy has aggravated my arthritis pain for the last few years, but I could always get away with small amounts of yogurt or cheese, never more than a few ounces, six at the very most, and not every day. Lately I have started taking calcium/D supplements. Bad Idea. My knee started acting up, I thought it was the bike at the gym. Got worse and worse, enough so I've been taking long afternoon naps to avoid the pain. Having trouble getting up and down from the bed or toilet. Crabwalking up and down stairs, waking up in the middle of the night. Getting very depressed at the amount of continuous ache. Pretty sure it is the calcium. Makes sense, can't have dairy, shouldn't have calcium. Anyone want a couple big bottles of calcium gummies?
Some sunshine, some dust, a little paint and a tutu. Yeah.
User avatar
AntiM
Moderator
 
Posts: 17604
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2004 6:23 am
Location: Wild, Wild West
Burning Since: 2001
Camp Name: Anti M's Home for Wayward Art

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby BBadger » Wed Nov 27, 2013 10:02 am

AntiM wrote:Milk and dairy has aggravated my arthritis pain for the last few years, but I could always get away with small amounts of yogurt or cheese, never more than a few ounces, six at the very most, and not every day. Lately I have started taking calcium/D supplements. Bad Idea. My knee started acting up, I thought it was the bike at the gym. Got worse and worse, enough so I've been taking long afternoon naps to avoid the pain. Having trouble getting up and down from the bed or toilet. Crabwalking up and down stairs, waking up in the middle of the night. Getting very depressed at the amount of continuous ache. Pretty sure it is the calcium. Makes sense, can't have dairy, shouldn't have calcium. Anyone want a couple big bottles of calcium gummies?



I wouldn't abandon the calcium, as your bones need it, but if you're not absorbing it in the first place it's doing you no good.

Not to keep pushing the magnesium but...

Your body can't absorb calcium with Vitamin D unless it has enough magnesium to supplement the absorption. The calcium/magnesium ratio is generally 2:1. From your description, your pain might be because calcium acts as a muscle contractor. Without the magnesium, you'll suffer cramps, muscle contractions, stiffness, etc. It may even be enough to just add the magnesium, or perhaps in conjunction with whatever calcium you may take.

Might be worth a shot.
"The essence of tyranny is not iron law. It is capricious law." -- Christopher Hitchens

Hate reading my replies? Click here to add me to your plonk (foe) list.
User avatar
BBadger
 
Posts: 4432
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2011 11:37 am
Location: (near) Portland, OR, USA
Burning Since: I'm not sure

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby AntiM » Wed Nov 27, 2013 10:18 am

This feels like joint pain, not muscle pain. I know I need calcium, but even with the magnesium I am hesitant to try. This is much more pain than I am used to experiencing. I might even talk to a doc, but getting out to base is such a hassle.
Some sunshine, some dust, a little paint and a tutu. Yeah.
User avatar
AntiM
Moderator
 
Posts: 17604
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2004 6:23 am
Location: Wild, Wild West
Burning Since: 2001
Camp Name: Anti M's Home for Wayward Art

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby theCryptofishist » Wed Nov 27, 2013 11:15 am

I completely understand why those civil war amputees got addicted to morphium. Although, I wouldn't call it "pain" so much as "activity"--pins and needles, basically. But it can get bad enough to not sleep. It's there constantly, despite the fact that I am usually med compliant. Right now it's an awareness, but it shades into near take over of my mind, if I've forgotten the meds. Actually, I forgot the daytime dosage yesterday, so it may not have completely built up the amount in my body last night and this morning...

Post-accident I had a deficiency of not magnesium, but manganese. (Sounds like an overdose of Japanese comic books, doesn't it?) Which really has nothing to do with anything, but those two names are close enough that I have to carefully think about which one I'm talking about.

Just like all those ytt-- elements.
The Lady with a Lamprey

"The powerful are exploiting people, art and ideas, and this leads to us plebes debating how to best ration ice.
Man, no wonder they always win....." Lonesomebri


Get a Taint, you pathetic cur!
User avatar
theCryptofishist
 
Posts: 39905
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 10:28 am
Location: In Exile
Burning Since: 2017

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Simon of the Playa » Wed Nov 27, 2013 4:20 pm

i have marfans syndrom and my cartilage is dissolving as i type, so Yeah, i KNOW chronic pain.



still too long didn't read.
fuck you, it's magic


Less Hanky, More Panky™

A gift for the Playa

THIS YEARS POSTERS

2015 posters
User avatar
Simon of the Playa
 
Posts: 15517
Joined: Thu Sep 06, 2007 6:25 pm
Location: Rochester, Nevada.
Burning Since: 1996
Camp Name: La Guilde des Hashischins

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby H.G.Crosby » Wed Nov 27, 2013 4:22 pm

edited as to not be such a rude asshole.


my apologies.


sorry your in pain, hope you feel better.


carry on.
Once I noticed I was on fire, I decided to relax and enjoy the fall™
User avatar
H.G.Crosby
 
Posts: 1918
Joined: Sun Jul 12, 2009 4:47 pm
Location: Boston, New York, Paris, Tangiers

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Roberto Dobbisano » Wed Nov 27, 2013 4:29 pm

the swamp gas is obviously getting to you.
"10 principles? you cant HANDLE the 10 principles..."
User avatar
Roberto Dobbisano
 
Posts: 2973
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2009 5:54 pm
Location: Dobbidossola, Italy.

Re: Pain Management Thread

Postby Thecatman » Wed Nov 27, 2013 4:58 pm

In September of 2012, I got rear ended by a transfer dump truck traveling between 63-68mph just north of Reno. I was in a three axle crash atinuator (edit spelling) truck going between 7-10mph that weighed about 52,000lbs gross. Shot me about 242ft down the freeway. I wasn't hurt but the other driver.....was in hospital for two days. My supervisor said I had to go to the hospital in the ambulance. They did a CAT scan and found that I have arthritis in my neck. Not related to the accident. Now I know why I've had cracking when I turn my head. Doesn't really hurt though, more annoying.
My cats are cuter than your grandkids!
"We in Arizona (and the rest of the United States) have been more than patient waiting for Washington to act."
"Government is not the solution to our problems, government is the problem."
Thecatman
 
Posts: 2397
Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2007 8:47 pm
Location: Nevada desert 120miles S. of BRC
Burning Since: 2002
Camp Name: alone

Next

Return to Open Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: MSNbot Media, tatonka and 5 guests