MV tail lights

Planning to build and bring a mutant vehicle? Talk about your plans and recruit crew members here.

MV tail lights

Postby Captain Goddammit » Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:30 pm

I read this line in the Law Enforcement edition of the Jack Rabbit Speaks: "Headlights and taillights on art cars will also be monitored while on playa."

I've scoured the DMV rules, and have never found anything that said MVs need normal street-legal lighting, but that line leads me to believe MVs have to have two red tail lights. I know the last time I registered mine in 2008, they threw the two red tail lights thing at us at the DMV completely by surprise and I had to quickly cobble something together on the spot. (Thanks for the borrowed trailer lights, fellow eplayan WeDeliver!)

Does anyone know what the deal is?

P.S. I have emailed the DMV but I expect them to be very busy, could be a while to hear back from them.
Last edited by Captain Goddammit on Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Whaoomph! Whaomph! Burbbleburbblepattpattpattpatt... WHAAAAAaaoooaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa........!!!"
Top fuel dragster, by Elliot Naess
User avatar
Captain Goddammit
 
Posts: 4499
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 9:34 am
Location: Seattle, WA
Burning Since: 2000
Camp Name: Camp Fuck The Vehicle Passes

Re: MV tail lights

Postby Rice » Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:39 pm

Captain Goddammit wrote:I read this line in the Law Enforcement edition of the Jack Rabbit Speaks: "Headlights and taillights on art cars will also be monitored while on playa."

I've scoured the DMV rules, and have never found anything that said MVs need normal street-legal lighting, but that line leads me to believe MVs have to have two red tail lights. I know the last time I registered mine in 2008, they threw the two red tail lights thing at us at the DMV completely by surprise and I had to quickly cobble something together on the spot. (Thanks for the borrowed trailer lights, fellow eplayan WeDeliver!)

Does anyone know what the deal is?


Since the information comes from the Law Enforcement edition of Jack Rabbit Speaks, it would be pretty easy to interpret that as laws being enforced by the police (LE). Not every rule is created by Burning Man LLC. (I might be wrong, but, then again. I might be right...)
Love Rice

Roach: "I feel like in this day and age, every girl should know how to build a flamethrower."
User avatar
Rice
 
Posts: 1642
Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:33 pm
Location: Great White North, Saskatchewan, Canada
Burning Since: 2007

Re: MV tail lights

Postby Captain Goddammit » Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:41 pm

I tend to agree, I'm going to err on the side of caution and outfit my MV with a set of red tail lights, but I think it's an important detail that's been grossly overlooked that I'd like to spread the word about, if it is indeed a requirement.
"Whaoomph! Whaomph! Burbbleburbblepattpattpattpatt... WHAAAAAaaoooaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa........!!!"
Top fuel dragster, by Elliot Naess
User avatar
Captain Goddammit
 
Posts: 4499
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 9:34 am
Location: Seattle, WA
Burning Since: 2000
Camp Name: Camp Fuck The Vehicle Passes

Re: MV tail lights

Postby Rice » Mon Aug 05, 2013 6:44 pm

Captain Goddammit wrote:I tend to agree, I'm going to err on the side of caution and outfit my MV with a set of red tail lights, but I think it's an important detail that's been grossly overlooked that I'd like to spread the word about, if it is indeed a requirement.

I have never tried to register an art car with the DMV, is it unreasonable to expect them to have the requirements listed somewhere???

{edit}

I just read the requirements and it is indeed unclear! Sure, it says the front and back should be lit, but nothing specifically about tail lights... ?? Hmmm

http://www.burningman.com/on_the_playa/playa_vehicles/criteria.html
Love Rice

Roach: "I feel like in this day and age, every girl should know how to build a flamethrower."
User avatar
Rice
 
Posts: 1642
Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:33 pm
Location: Great White North, Saskatchewan, Canada
Burning Since: 2007

Re: MV tail lights

Postby TT120 » Mon Aug 05, 2013 7:37 pm

I'd go with what the LEO's say because they're the ones who will write you a ticket.
Life's a bitch, then you go to Burning Man - Unjonharley

W6BJD
User avatar
TT120
 
Posts: 949
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 8:43 pm
Location: Sacramento, CA.
Burning Since: 2012
Camp Name: Orphans Too

Re: MV tail lights

Postby EspressoDude » Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:15 pm

next thing ya know they are going to require windshield wipers. If it is like Oregon wipers are required, but a windshield is not required.
Is 4 shots enuff? no foo-foo drinks; just naked Espresso
Tactical Espresso Service http://home.comcast.net/~espressocamp/
Field Artillery Tractor
FOGBANK, GOD OF HELLFIRE
BLACK ROCK f/x Trojan Horse,Anubis,2014Temple
burn shit and blow shit up
User avatar
EspressoDude
 
Posts: 4714
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2006 8:30 pm
Location: the first Vancouver

Re: MV tail lights

Postby Captain Goddammit » Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:06 pm

Well, the DMV got right back to me, I was surprised!
Essentially they said they don't have the specific tail light rule, but the Law Enforcement Officers may choose to enforce such things.
So - I'm sayin, all Mutant Vehicle operators, equip your rig with headlights and tail lights!
"Whaoomph! Whaomph! Burbbleburbblepattpattpattpatt... WHAAAAAaaoooaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa........!!!"
Top fuel dragster, by Elliot Naess
User avatar
Captain Goddammit
 
Posts: 4499
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 9:34 am
Location: Seattle, WA
Burning Since: 2000
Camp Name: Camp Fuck The Vehicle Passes

Re: MV tail lights

Postby theCryptofishist » Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:09 pm

Captain Goddammit wrote:Well, the DMV got right back to me, I was surprised!
Essentially they said they don't have the specific tail light rule, but the Law Enforcement Officers may choose to enforce such things.
So - I'm sayin, all Mutant Vehicle operators, equip your rig with headlights and tail lights!

I'm reiterating:
all Mutant Vehicle operators, equip your rig with headlights and tail lights
Simon's real sig line?

Embrace the Sock

Winners never quilt, quilters never win...
User avatar
theCryptofishist
 
Posts: 37413
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 10:28 am
Location: In Exile
Burning Since: 2017

Re: MV tail lights

Postby SnowBlind » Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:23 pm

Captain Goddammit wrote:I know the last time I registered mine in 2008, they threw the two red tail lights thing at us at the DMV completely by surprise and I had to quickly cobble something together on the spot.


It was never a DMV rule. The DMV doesn't care about taillights, as long as your Vehicle is radically illuminated in other ways.

What happened that year was that the Cops started pulling people over, using missing tail lights as probable cause. The DMV got word of it and started warning people to put tail lights on.

For the following years they started working with the LEOs on that, and as far as I know they now have some wording in the permit that says that any vehicle approved by the DMV is considered to be adequately lit.

Will the cops that potentially pull you over be aware of that? Maybe. If they *do* pull you over, I'd report it to the LEAL team.
User avatar
SnowBlind
 
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 5:27 pm
Location: SF Bay Area

Re: MV tail lights

Postby Captain Goddammit » Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:40 pm

I hope it doesn't escalate to the obvious levels it could.
My MV has no seatbelts. No wipers. No brake lights or turn signals. There's any of eleventy zillion reasons it's not street legal. If the police at the event are going to hold clearly NOT street-legal, event-only vehicles to regular street-legal equipment laws, well... that's just not right.
I can only hope adding a goddamm set of tail lights to an already lit like Vegas MV makes them happy. I'm trying to comply with every possible DMV and police rule.
"Whaoomph! Whaomph! Burbbleburbblepattpattpattpatt... WHAAAAAaaoooaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa........!!!"
Top fuel dragster, by Elliot Naess
User avatar
Captain Goddammit
 
Posts: 4499
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 9:34 am
Location: Seattle, WA
Burning Since: 2000
Camp Name: Camp Fuck The Vehicle Passes

Re: MV tail lights

Postby FIGJAM » Tue Aug 06, 2013 7:09 pm

The way most vehicles are lit you couldn't see the tail lights anyway. :lol:
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

Fuck Im Good Just Ask Me
User avatar
FIGJAM
 
Posts: 7072
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:39 am
Location: apache junction az.

Re: MV tail lights

Postby BRCDMV » Thu Aug 08, 2013 8:51 am

All,

Some clarification. The statement regarding LEOs monitoring brake/tail lights of Mutant Vehicles at the event was actually incorrect in the Jack Rabbit Speaks. Vehicles ENTERING the event may be monitored for tail lights, etc. however Burning Man's agreement with the BLM has an exception for Mutant Vehicles for certain requirements (including lighting) that they would normally enforce for street/off-road vehicles.

As folks have noted previously in this thread that the Black Rock DMV does not specifically mention Tail/Brake lights as a requirement for Mutant Vehicles.

That being said, while this is not a requirement of the BRC DMV, Nevada state law differs and while LEOs at the event have not generally enforced laws regarding tail lights at the event, they have on occasion stopped some vehicles (old dog/new tricks syndrome), so we generally suggest MV Owners consider that risk in your design plans.

As always, if you still have questions or need additional clarification please email us at dmv@burningman.com

Sincerely,

-Chef Juke for the DMV Hotties
BRCDMV
 
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:23 pm
Burning Since: 2003
Camp Name: Department of Mutant Vehicles

Re: MV tail lights

Postby gyre » Sat Aug 10, 2013 5:34 pm

I would mention that some race cars with no other lighting are required to have brake lights, but not tail lights.
if you add something extra, I suggest brake lamps.

I have avoided a ticket after a crash, in a street vehicle, by proving that my high power reverse lamps were very visible even in sunlight.
I can't imagine a ticket for tail lamps on an mv not being laughed out of court.
User avatar
gyre
 
Posts: 15346
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 6:01 pm
Location: ΦάÏ

Re: MV tail lights

Postby knowmad » Sat Aug 10, 2013 6:22 pm

BRCDMV wrote:All,

Some clarification. The statement regarding LEOs monitoring brake/tail lights of Mutant Vehicles at the event was actually incorrect in the Jack Rabbit Speaks. Vehicles ENTERING the event may be monitored for tail lights, etc. however Burning Man's agreement with the BLM has an exception for Mutant Vehicles for certain requirements (including lighting) that they would normally enforce for street/off-road vehicles.

As folks have noted previously in this thread that the Black Rock DMV does not specifically mention Tail/Brake lights as a requirement for Mutant Vehicles.

That being said, while this is not a requirement of the BRC DMV, Nevada state law differs and while LEOs at the event have not generally enforced laws regarding tail lights at the event, they have on occasion stopped some vehicles (old dog/new tricks syndrome), so we generally suggest MV Owners consider that risk in your design plans.

As always, if you still have questions or need additional clarification please email us at dmv@burningman.com

Sincerely,

-Chef Juke for the DMV Hotties


the way I interpret that is;
LEO's operate erratically and unpredictably, avoid with caution.
............................................Image...........................................
Oh yeah, this year I was totally twerping out at the fence. ~Lonesombri
User avatar
knowmad
 
Posts: 3304
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:33 pm
Location: Puget Sound
Burning Since: 2009
Camp Name: 09-11 Specialist Clan
12 BWS BDV/DPB

Re: MV tail lights

Postby EspressoDude » Sat Aug 10, 2013 6:49 pm

word from Obama, Congress, House of Representatives courtesy of the Federal Register:
https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2013/07/25/2013-17844/notice-of-temporary-closure-and-temporary-restrictions-of-specific-uses-on-public-lands-for-the

H. Motor Vehicles

1. Must comply with the following requirements:

(a) The operator of a motor vehicle must possess a valid driver's license.

(b) Motor vehicles and trailers must possess evidence of valid registration, except for mutant vehicles, vehicles used by disabled drivers and displaying disabled driver license plates or placards, or other vehicles registered with the BRC LLC organizers and operated within the scope of that registration.

(c) Motor vehicles and trailers must possess evidence of valid insurance, except for mutant vehicles, vehicles used by disabled drivers and displaying disabled driver license plates or placards, or other vehicles registered with the BRC LLC organizers and operated within the scope of that registration.

(d) Motor vehicles and trailers must not block a street used for vehicular travel or a pedestrian pathway.

(e) Motor vehicles must not exceed the posted speed limit.

(f) No person shall occupy a trailer while the motor vehicle is in transit upon a roadway, except for mutant vehicles, vehicles used by disabled drivers and displaying disabled driver license plates or placards, or other vehicles registered with the BRC LLC organizers and operated within the scope of that registration.

(g) Motor vehicles, other than a motorcycle or golf cart, must be equipped with at least two working headlamps, except for mutant vehicles, vehicles used by disabled drivers and displaying disabled driver license plates or placards, or other vehicles registered with the BRC LLC organizers and operated within the scope of that registration—so long as they are adequately lit according to Black Rock City, LLC Department of Mutant Vehicle requirements.

(h) Motor vehicles, other than a motorcycle or golf cart, and trailers must be equipped with at least two functioning tail lamps, except for mutant vehicles, vehicles used by disabled drivers and displaying disabled driver license plates or placards, or other vehicles registered with the BRC LLC organizers and operated within the scope of that registration—so long as they are adequately lit according to Black Rock City, LLC Department of Mutant Vehicle requirements.

(i) Motor vehicles, other than a motorcycle or golf cart, and trailers must be equipped with at least two functioning brake lights.

(j) Motor vehicles and trailers must display an unobstructed rear license plate, except for mutant vehicles, vehicles used by disabled drivers and displaying disabled driver license plates or placards, or other vehicles registered with the BRC LLC organizers and operated within the scope of that registration.

(k) Motor vehicles and trailers must be equipped with a mounted lamp to illuminate the rear license plate, except for mutant vehicles, vehicles used by disabled drivers and displaying disabled driver license plates or placards, or other vehicles registered with the BRC LLC organizers and operated within the scope of that registration.

2. The public closure area is closed to motor vehicle use, except as provided below.

Motor vehicles may be operated within the public closure area under the circumstances listed below:

(a) Participant arrival and departure on designated routes;

(b) BLM, medical, law enforcement, and firefighting vehicles are authorized at all times;

(c) Vehicles operated by BRC LLC staff or contractors and service providers on behalf of BRC LLC. During the event, from 6:00 p.m. Sunday, August 25, 2013, through 6:00 p.m. Monday, September 2, 2013, these vehicles must display evidence of event registration at all times in such manner that it is visible to the rear of the vehicle while the vehicle is in motion;

(d) Mutant vehicles, art cars, vehicles used by disabled drivers and displaying disabled driver license plates or placards, or other vehicles registered with the BRC LLC organizers and operated within the scope of that registration. During the event, from 6:00 p.m. Sunday, August 25, 2013, through 6:00 p.m. Monday, September 2, 2013, such vehicles must display evidence of registration at all times in such manner that it is visible to the rear of the vehicle while the vehicle is in motion;

(e) Motorized skateboards, electric assist bicycles, or Go-Peds with or without handlebars;

(f) Participant drop off of approved burnables and wood to the Burn Garden/Wood Reclamation Stations (located on open playa at 3:00, 6:00, 9:00 Promenades and the Man base) from 9:00 a.m. Sunday, September 1, 2013 through the end of day Tuesday, September 3, 2013, post event; and

(g) Passage through, without stopping, the public closure area on the west or east playa roads.

3. Definitions:

(a) A motor vehicle is any device designed for and capable of travel over land and which is self-propelled by a motor, but does not include any vehicle operated on rails or any motorized wheelchair.

(b) Motorized wheelchair means a self-propelled wheeled device, designed solely for and used by a mobility-impaired person for locomotion.

(c) A trailer is any instrument designed to be hauled by a motor vehicle.
Is 4 shots enuff? no foo-foo drinks; just naked Espresso
Tactical Espresso Service http://home.comcast.net/~espressocamp/
Field Artillery Tractor
FOGBANK, GOD OF HELLFIRE
BLACK ROCK f/x Trojan Horse,Anubis,2014Temple
burn shit and blow shit up
User avatar
EspressoDude
 
Posts: 4714
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2006 8:30 pm
Location: the first Vancouver

Re: MV tail lights

Postby Captain Goddammit » Sat Aug 10, 2013 8:02 pm

That document appears to indicate that mutant vehicles, if lit in accordance with BRC DMV standards, do not need headlights or taillights but they DO need brake lights!
Sheesh...
"Whaoomph! Whaomph! Burbbleburbblepattpattpattpatt... WHAAAAAaaoooaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa........!!!"
Top fuel dragster, by Elliot Naess
User avatar
Captain Goddammit
 
Posts: 4499
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 9:34 am
Location: Seattle, WA
Burning Since: 2000
Camp Name: Camp Fuck The Vehicle Passes

Re: MV tail lights

Postby knowmad » Sun Aug 11, 2013 3:26 pm

But the back of some MVs are indistinguishable from the front, not to mention the fact that lots of them have more lights on their ass end than an Anunnaki Discotek.
............................................Image...........................................
Oh yeah, this year I was totally twerping out at the fence. ~Lonesombri
User avatar
knowmad
 
Posts: 3304
Joined: Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:33 pm
Location: Puget Sound
Burning Since: 2009
Camp Name: 09-11 Specialist Clan
12 BWS BDV/DPB

Re: MV tail lights

Postby gyre » Sun Aug 11, 2013 8:14 pm

I can think of one mv that actually doesn't have a front or rear, except for the driver's seat, which can rotate.
User avatar
gyre
 
Posts: 15346
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 6:01 pm
Location: ΦάÏ

Re: MV tail lights

Postby mrchiff » Mon Aug 12, 2013 7:30 am

LEO has pulled MV's over for not having a red, rear facing light. At a minimum, zip tie a red bike light somewhere on the rear, probably by your DMV sticker.
mrchiff
 
Posts: 45
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2011 7:45 am


Return to 2013 Mutant Vehicles

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest