Ethical tickets: what is a fair markup for re-sale tickets?

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Re: Ethical tickets: what is a fair markup for re-sale ticke

Postby A Jester » Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:13 am

moonwatcher wrote:
A Jester wrote:
moonwatcher wrote:
Do the math, Trilo.
If the person paid $420 for the ticket, and she gets $500, minus 10% in service fees = $450. A whopping $30 in "profit". Hardly scalping, in my humble opinion.


I'd say that charging $40 extra is absolutely scalping. $40 is hardly worth breaking a principle, but that's a different story.


If someone told you: buy me dinner and I'll sell you my ticket for what I paid for it. Is that scalping?

(I edited the quote from my post since I edited the original post, for clarity. In the case mentioned, the profit is actually $30 - the cost of dinner at a decent restaurant.)


Clearly it's scalping. If someone takes $30 from your wallet, it's stealing. If someone takes $30 of prepared food from your home, it's stealing. Is it stupid to steal $30 of prepared food from someone's house? Yes. Is it a silly small amount to break a principle over? Yes. Could they have likely at least taken a few of your CDs and maybe a bottle of wine if they wanted to *really* profit off of you? Yes.

None of those yeses make it not stealing. No matter how small the mark up, it's still scalping. It's odd that this is hard for you to understand.
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The difference between buying a ticket from a scalper and prostituting yourself for one is, if you suck dick for a ticket and brag about it, burners will still respect you.
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Re: Ethical tickets: what is a fair markup for re-sale ticke

Postby A Jester » Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:19 am

lemur wrote:if someone pocketed $1000+ on the sale of a ticket... and then you found out that they raffled it and over 200 people paid $5 each for a chance at a ticket..

is that scalping ?

is it ethical?


No, that's not scalping. It may or may not be ethical, it doesn't directly violate any of the ten principles. For the record, they didn't sell the ticket for $1000. They sold two hundred chances at the ticket for $5. That distinction is important.
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Re: Ethical tickets: what is a fair markup for re-sale ticke

Postby BBadger » Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:33 am

There is no distinction, just a loophole.
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Ten principals

Postby nocturnal_steve » Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:40 am

I am not sure how you are interpreting the principals. Besides who says the principals are the end all be all ? While the Borg may tacitly OK raffling , they have had to obviously had to bend break interpret there own rules as reality sets in, situations arise. Directed tickets vs. Radical Inclusion is a perfect example.

The Communist Manifesto is another example of a document with good intent whose principals were subjugated.
Don't get me wrong, I do not believe the BORG are corrupt ... they are imperfect, good intentioned people in an imperfect world.
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Re: Ethical tickets: what is a fair markup for re-sale ticke

Postby graidawg » Sun Aug 05, 2012 12:50 pm

IF ONE PERSON MENTIONS TICKET SCALPING, OR ANY OF THE TICKET RELATED SUBJECTS WHEN ACTUALLY ON THE PLAYA I AM PERSONALLY GOING TO TIE THEM TO THE MAN ON BURN NIGHT
FREE THE SHERPAS
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Re: Ethical tickets: what is a fair markup for re-sale ticke

Postby Trishntek » Sun Aug 05, 2012 6:24 pm

The average growth per year since the event has been on the playa is 13%. Given that last year it sold out at 52,500, the demand would be 13% higher this year. That puts the demand at about 60,000 for this year.

It does not really matter whether the demand is multiple times more than what is available or 1% more than what is available. When EVERYBODY is forced to make their decisions SIX MONTHS earlier than usual just to get their name in the hat, it creates an unprecedented surge of demand.

Granted, the problem is BMorg's own creation. But it is THEIR CREATION TO BEGIN WITH! It is their event, their tickets and their way of doing things! All this "what if" and "yeah but" bullshit has nothing to do with the fertility of an event gone global. Participate by the rules, or get the fuck outa my face! Go make your own event with your own rules and deal with idiots who always believe they have a better idea.
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Re: Ethical tickets: what is a fair markup for re-sale ticke

Postby trilobyte » Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:01 pm

I believe that the strong surge in demand had a lot to do with the timing of the release of that viral video. We'd have seen growth to be sure, and an increase over the average due to both the incredibly good weather we had last year and the event sellout last year. Once the event sells out for the first time, there's generally a spike in demand in the year that follows (unless some other factor causes a sharp drop).
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Re: Ethical tickets: what is a fair markup for re-sale ticke

Postby Galaxo Magic » Mon Aug 06, 2012 8:28 am

remi wrote:Face value or fuck off. The seller should eat the charge for being "that guy" who purchased a ticket they don't need, helping cause the the "ticket fiasco."

Just my opinion.

You said it Remi. If you can't use the ticket for the event, make some other Burners day. Don't try to profit on it, don't hassle the charges. You spent the money 7 months ago, now to get back what you spent is great but again, be a true Burner and help your fellow Burners out. Don't try and gouge them. They have been suffering for months worrying about getting a ticket. Make their day!
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Re: Ethical tickets: what is a fair markup for re-sale ticke

Postby Galaxo Magic » Mon Aug 06, 2012 8:35 am

Our camp ended up with 4 extra tickets due to work and family matters that prevented members from attending. All 4 tickets were sold at face value. We did not even charge them the shipping fees. Hey, the money was long gone, it wasn't about the money. It was a bummer to lose 4 core people this year but we know we made 4 Burners super happy! That was an early gift. :)

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Re: Ethical tickets: what is a fair markup for re-sale ticke

Postby suburbanite » Mon Aug 06, 2012 2:05 pm

Tanzremix wrote:
trilobyte wrote:There's no system in the world that could guarantee 120K tickets to hopeful customers when the available supply was 40K.


Transparency is our friend. If demand was really 2.5x the amount of tickets available aftermarket prices would be 2.5x face, which they are not.


That...that is just not how economics works....
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