Only one ticket allowed from step?

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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby moonrise » Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:22 am

Colonel Monk wrote:
robrob wrote:
Theme camps who cheated got all of their tickets in the "Christmas" pre-sale and make excuses for it


???

The holiday presale was "cheating" how?


It wasn't really cheating, but radical inclusion it is not. (again, not that I can support that 100% given current circumstances)

To offer 3000 tickets in advance for the highest priced ticket yet, is nothing more than cashing in. $1,260,000

So the first tickets that were bought were sold to people whom $420 isn't alot of money, and guaranteed they wouldn't be screwed in the lottery where the rules change as we go.

And I'll say again, if you bought a $390 ticket you had a better chance to win than a $240 ticket. Again, rewarding those that have more disposable income.

And they say they wanted it to be fair.......bullshit.



BS! The pre sale was also a lottery. And how do you know if $420 isn't a lot of money to those that entered at the HIGH price? It's a lot of money. Even if it is gifted money, it's a lot of $.

Pre sale rules did clearly state if one lost that round, then off into the main sale ya' go....no one knew they wouldn't be screwed in the lottery, including pre sale entrants.

Let's hope the hoarders start "un-hoarding" their tix asap.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby Raymaker » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:02 am

I can't even post anything remotely diplomatic about this situation now, so I won't.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby Simon of the Playa » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:04 am

Shut up hippy.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby Raymaker » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:19 am

Simon of the Playa wrote:Shut up hippy.

I kind of did. :(
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby Simon of the Playa » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:23 am

Hmmmmm, dammit man, you threw my stride off.


Ok, im flexible...and contrarian


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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby Simon of the Playa » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:25 am

All of a sudden i feel like maria kelly on JPR during harvest season and i dont know why.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby tamarakay » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:48 am

Colonel Monk wrote:
robrob wrote:
Theme camps who cheated got all of their tickets in the "Christmas" pre-sale and make excuses for it


???

The holiday presale was "cheating" how?


It wasn't really cheating, but radical inclusion it is not. (again, not that I can support that 100% given current circumstances)

To offer 3000 tickets in advance for the highest priced ticket yet, is nothing more than cashing in. $1,260,000

So the first tickets that were bought were sold to people whom $420 isn't alot of money, and guaranteed they wouldn't be screwed in the lottery where the rules change as we go.

And I'll say again, if you bought a $390 ticket you had a better chance to win than a $240 ticket. Again, rewarding those that have more disposable income.

And they say they wanted it to be fair.......bullshit.


I bought tickets in the pre-sale. We bought them pre-sale last year too. And if they are offered next year, I will try for them then too. I know me, and I know that if I am going to work towards going to burning man each year, I need to know I have a ticket. We don't have a lot of disposable income. We have three kids still in college, a daughter with a kid living with us right now, a mortgage and bills. We eat a lot of peanut butter instead of lunch meat, talapia instead of halibut, never get to have steak, volunteer for extra shifts and on-call etc. to be able to afford to go.

The pre-sale satisfies a lot of different needs for a lot of different people. If the bmORG gets an influx of cash from it, who cares? I think it would be classified as a smart business decision AND it allows some money to be earmarked for the low income tickets. A win win.

Cheating? How about sacrifice and planning?
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby MyDearFriend » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:59 am

tamarakay wrote:
Cheating? How about sacrifice and planning?


Same here. It can be done.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby ZaphodBurner » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:00 am

tamarakay wrote:I bought tickets in the pre-sale. We bought them pre-sale last year too.

The pre-sale satisfies a lot of different needs for a lot of different people. If the bmORG gets an influx of cash from it, who cares? I think it would be classified as a smart business decision AND it allows some money to be earmarked for the low income tickets. A win win.

Cheating? How about sacrifice and planning?


That's not cheating. You and your spouse bought bought tickets for yourselves. You didn't have representatives from your camp buy as many as they could get their hands on, four at a time, to make sure everybody gets tickets. You have no need to defend yourself.

Next year, though, expect 170,000+ orders on the presale.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby vikb » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:59 am

I haven't posted on eplaya while I waited for BMorg to sort things out. I would have preferred that the 10K open ticket sales were sold to anyone who applied for them as was advertised since honest burners made their ticket plans based on what they were told by BMorg. Having said that some consideration for theme camps and art projects is certainly a reasonable proposition.

However, giving all 10K open sale tickets to theme camps and punishing the burners who played by the rules and only entered once per 2 people is not a reasonable solution. Besides all the couples who have been screwed now what this means is that anyone who might have played by the rules in 2013 will do whatever they can to game the system next year. Let's be honest it's the only rationale thing to do given the rewards for working with BMorg through the system they setup.

Had BMorg given 5K tickets to camps and put 5K tickets into STEP [allowing 2 tickets per lottery entry] they would have given every group some much needed hope that they'll get tickets as well as showing that they respected the plight of all the different parts of the Burning Man community.

To BMorg I jus say this - what were you thinking? Letting couples access 2 tickets through STEP would have been a reasonable and fair solution. The reality is there won't be many STEP tickets so it was only a show of respect to the part of the community that played fair, but a very important one nevertheless. You are clearly out of your depth in handling an event of this size when a crisis occurs. I hope you take some steps to improve the capacity of the event leadership before we go through more pain in 2013.

So as far was my GF and I go we entered once and got no tickets. We are eligible to get 1 ticket through STEP. Most of our friends didn't get tickets and our camp doesn't seem to qualify for the 10K ticket program. We are officially turning off our Burning Man plans for this year.

To Burners that got tickets or will get tickets through STEP/theme camp allocation and the secondary market I say have a great burn. The upside of all the carnage and negativity of the 2012 ticket situation is that it will be a brave new world on the playa. I look forward to reports from you all and hope you have a wonderful time.

To Burners that didn't get tickets - especially couples that are left out of STEP - I feel your pain **hugs**. If you are going to keep on fighting to get tickets I salute your efforts. If you are giving up for 2012 I certainly empathize. I hope you have an awesome time whatever you get up to. I know we will... :D
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby peacefulhuman » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:26 am

ZaphodBurner wrote:Just remember:

The difference between buying a ticket from a scalper and prostituting yourself for one is, if you suck dick for a ticket and brag about it, burners will still respect you.


Promise?
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby vikb » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:45 am

[quote] And PS - I would not have a SHRED of guilt about buying a scalped ticket at this point.[/quote]

I don't blame you.

If people want to be outraged and shame other burners I would start with anyone that gamed the lottery so they could get an advantage over their fellow burners.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby litlaur » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:50 am

Well, that settles it. Guess I won't be going this year since my husband registered for the both of us. I've tried to stay positive about this, but this is extremely upsetting. I don't understand why people who registered for 2 tickets in the lottery can't get 2 tickets through STEP (if available of course) with the same restrictions (will call, non-transferable). It hurts that I won't be able to come back this year, but short of buying scalped tickets, I don't know what to do.

See you in 2013, I guess.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby pfftx » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:56 am

My husband and I are screwed as well--I don't get it; what can we do but go to a scalper? I hate the thought, but what are our options again?

Like so many others, we played by the rules, stayed calm, entered once, didn't grouse about the lottery and had some faith. But yeah, this really fucks us royally (and now I'm finally a little insulted--I've been pretty calm).

I get that they are in damage control mode--the rest of it is fine. But punishing couple who played by the rules is unreasonable and forces patient honest people to consider scalpers because there's genuinely no other option.

I'm not saying I'll buy a scalped ticket, I really don't want to. But it looks pretty black and white at this point: it's buy from a scalper or stay home, even if we manage to dig up a ticket for one of us through STEP. Maybe don't go, I guess--that's a real bummer, man.

Fuck, I'd be happy to fax in a copy of my marriage license if they needed to confirm that we really were actually a legit couple and not hoarding; not that that doesn't screw all the other honest pairs who aren't legally married. The STEP tickets are named anyway, so why is it so important that people only get one?

Anyway, grouse grouse grouse. My point in chiming in is to add my voice. The lottery blew, they tried honestly to fix it and IMO did a decent job with the muddle they'd made. I'm hoping that they'll hear the community here too--please please please fix this. Let people who registered for two tickets in the lottery buy two STEP tickets. Thanks.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby tinydancr » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:04 am

I too am disappointed to find out that I only have access to one ticket through STEP. I need two, and only registered for 2. I didn't game the system and have my bf sign us up too. Hell my brain doesn't even work that way - which is why I also suck at poker, lol. :? I have a feeling like others, there won't be many tix in STEP anyway. I imagine many of the extras will go to close burner friends. As a burgin watching all the drama this year, I'm really reconsidering spending my hard earned money on a trip to Europe instead of stepping foot into a community where so much separation has taken place. I don't know though, I had my heart set on the playa and have finally taken the steps to get there this year, only to get shut out.

I hope 2013 is a better year for all Burners and the BMORG. I hope they resolve this.

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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby Trishntek » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:05 am

Cheating? Gaming? Selfish? The ticket lottery was what it was and people did what they could to assure themselves AND THEIR CAMPMATES tickets. The only reason all this bitterness is flying around is due to your own naive approach to what was openly called a "LOTTERY". The more applications, the better the odds, DUH!

All this bitterness and anger is understandable. But it's because most of you whiners did not get a ticket and not necessarily because of everyone else that succeeded. It is a blatant exercise of ignorance to keep blaming those that succeeded for your own lack of success.

How say instead of whining, either move forward with a plan to pursue a ticket or find something else to do in August? All this angst accomplishes nothing but destruction and hard feelings.

The solution to the problem is not going to please everybody. Demand outweighs supply for tickets. When a movie at the theater sells out, do you stand there and throw a tantrum? How do you act when your favorite nightclub makes you wait in line outside? Grow up!
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby trilobyte » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:20 am

For those who may have missed it, last night's blog saw a couple updates, I think the latest one was at 9:15pm PST.

Marian Goodell wrote:[ADDED 2/15/12: 9:18 PM PST: We recognize the one-per person will dramatically effect the plans and intentions of those who originally ordered 2 tickets and didn't scam the system with a back-up order and were then rejected. We WILL look at whether there is any breathing room to this policy before we engage the final implementation. However, this decision was reached with a significant number of dependent variables and won't be easy to change.]


I've talked with the ticket team this morning on the subject, and it's something they're working on. As you can imagine, everyone involved (at pretty much every level) has been getting tons of feedback, which has been getting funneled back to the board (though I'm sure they're also hearing it directly too). I sincerely hope they find some breathing room - personally I think it's better to have a working solution for a smaller number of participants than a non-workable solution for a larger group.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby tinydancr » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:29 am

Trishntek wrote:Cheating? Gaming? Selfish? The ticket lottery was what it was and people did what they could to assure themselves AND THEIR CAMPMATES tickets. The only reason all this bitterness is flying around is due to your own naive approach to what was openly called a "LOTTERY". The more applications, the better the odds, DUH!

All this bitterness and anger is understandable. But it's because most of you whiners did not get a ticket and not necessarily because of everyone else that succeeded. It is a blatant exercise of ignorance to keep blaming those that succeeded for your own lack of success.

How say instead of whining, either move forward with a plan to pursue a ticket or find something else to do in August? All this angst accomplishes nothing but destruction and hard feelings.

The solution to the problem is not going to please everybody. Demand outweighs supply for tickets. When a movie at the theater sells out, do you stand there and throw a tantrum? How do you act when your favorite nightclub makes you wait in line outside? Grow up!


Kind of rude, dude. This is a venue for people to express their feelings on an obviously sensitive subject. Personally, I don't care either way. I will do SOMETHING epic in August. And yes, I think people who had 10 other people sign them up for the lottery is selfish. Its not the national lottery, where yes, by all means by 1000 tickets to increase your odds. This is a chance at entry into a COMMUNITY so many people love, and by upping your own odds, you push others out. Is that how you got your ticket? And yes I know demand outweighs supply, so please don't go on about that. Just sayin.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby forty_eight » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:40 am

Haha, that does totally suck! I basically can't register for that. A single in ticket in STEP doesn't work for me AT ALL. Oh well.

Hindsight is mutha, I guess. I sorta kicked myself as I registered for the Lottery and put in a $20 donation each for Black Rock Arts and Black Rock Solar with a $390 maximum. I could've been in the Pre-Sale for similar money.

As much as I try to do the mental gymnastics to support the concept of decommodification, the ticket situation has rendered that principle null and void.

The advent of scarcity is a game changer. Any idea which Principles will actually survive as Burning Man continues to evolve? I think we are down to 8 or so.

Decommodifcation
Radical Inclusion

At this point, going through scalpers would be Radical Self Reliance. Everyone is just going to have to deal with that FACT!

I'm pretty much over it, though. The event in the desert is attractive, very attractive, but I am resigned to not attend (at least this year).

I do think this community has something interesting going on overall, so I will look into regional events and 2013 at BRC.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby ZaphodBurner » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:18 pm

Trishntek wrote:Cheating? Gaming? Selfish? The ticket lottery was what it was and people did what they could to assure themselves AND THEIR CAMPMATES tickets.


And all guys like Andrew Jackson and George Custer did by chasing off the natives and cheating on the treaties is do what they could to assure themselves and their people access to land and gold. You just justified scalping and exploiting the system at the expense of your fellow burner. That shows me that if you can't get yours, you'll cheat to get mine.

What kinda Dick Cheney shit is that?

The only reason all this bitterness is flying around is due to your own naive approach to what was openly called a "LOTTERY". The more applications, the better the odds, DUH!

All this bitterness and anger is understandable. But it's because most of you whiners


You're belittling people because they honored the BORG's intent, respected others as they wished to be respected, and chose not to cheat? Anybody who speaks out for them is a whiner?

What the fuck, man?
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby Trishntek » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:46 pm

Everyone writes as though the tickets they did not acquire are going,,,, somewhere over the rainbow and never seen again. Guess what? The ticket you did not acquire is going to someone else IN THE COMMUNITY! I fully realize everyone thinks it is bullshit they did not personally get a ticket. I'm just saying calling those who succeeded cheats and dishonest is over the top. The tickets are going to the hard-working, proven burner community, just because it is not YOUR COMMUNITY does not make it any less true.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby vargaso » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:54 pm

Trishntek wrote:Everyone writes as though the tickets they did not acquire are going,,,, somewhere over the rainbow and never seen again. Guess what? The ticket you did not acquire is going to someone else IN THE COMMUNITY! I fully realize everyone thinks it is bullshit they did not personally get a ticket. I'm just saying calling those who succeeded cheats and dishonest is over the top. The tickets are going to the hard-working, proven burner community, just because it is not YOUR COMMUNITY does not make it any less true.


Agreed. Only reason I didn't order 2 is because I couldn't afford it. Some people I know did order 2, and every one of those "extra" tickets is going to members of their camp and/or burner friends. Social engineering only goes so far. If we really want to limit people to one ticket, then limit people to one ticket during purchase. Do you think this year's situation is going to make people who ordered 2 reconsider their decision? Hell no, it's going to make people who ordered 1 reconsider THAT decision.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby curiousgnate » Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:54 pm

perfectly put Vargaso!
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby ZaphodBurner » Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:33 pm

Trishntek wrote: I'm just saying calling those who succeeded cheats and dishonest is over the top. The tickets are going to the hard-working, proven burner community, just because it is not YOUR COMMUNITY does not make it any less true.


How does anybody, at this point, know the tickets aren't going to "their community?" Right now, nobody knows anything unless they won the lottery.

Black Rock City IS our community. And we're a returning LNT-listed theme camp. I don't expect that we're going to get tickets but if we do, we're going to bend over backwards to serve the community and make damned sure BRC doesn't regret that we got them.

If there are groups who have worked harder and better than us, and who are willing to work harder, they deserve those tickets. I view that as fair.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby Mosquitopilate » Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:27 pm

1 ticket is fine
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby Mosquitopilate » Thu Feb 16, 2012 8:28 pm

Does anybody know when emails for STEP start for registers?
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby zer0mass » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:48 pm

I can’t say that I’m not worried about STEP and whether or not my girlfriend and I will be able to go this year. It will be my second year and her first if we go. I know how life changing Burning Man can be and that is a big part of the reason why I want to go there with her. The truth is that I scared that we won’t be able to go, but this is what backup plans are for right?
I do want to say that so far the one big complaint that I have is that STEP is one ticket each. Like many I registered for the 2 that we need to go and only registered once. This means that like many we might get one through STEP leaving us looking for one more. I can tell you right now that I will not go if she can’t. Given the number of couples that want to go together I STRONGLY urge Bmorg to let people request two tickets via STEP and not just one. I have a feeling that there are going to be a lot of couples that just won’t go because they can’t both go and that is going to have an impact as well.
On the up side the more people that pull out now the better my odds of getting both tickets are.
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby forty_eight » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:06 pm

The one ticket thing makes STEP totally useless for anyone who made a single request for two tickets. If my wife and I entered twice, we'd conceivably have two chances in STEP. There are big dilemmas and decisions of consequence to be made, more power to those at the helm ... but these feedback loops are hard to undo. Just sayin'
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby Mosquitopilate » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:28 pm

Can we get a forum for people who think 1 ticket with STEP is fine
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Re: Only one ticket allowed from step?

Postby BarShirley » Thu Feb 16, 2012 11:48 pm

STEP - This is unfair for the couples who only put 1 registration in for 2 tickets. No Playa Wedding for us this year :(
Now to break the news to my partner.
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