Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby ZaphodBurner » Sat Feb 11, 2012 9:43 pm

hotmess wrote:The idea of now canceling the open sale and rewarding tickets to camps that "make the event" or "deserve tickets" is a bad idea. If this happens Burning Man, in my mind, will become just another festival that has to rely on having guaranteed entertainment for people to enjoy.


It already has to rely on guaranteed entertainment. People are automatically assuming the city is going to be awesome, that there's going to be a Man and a center camp, a power grid, toilets. Most people expect the ice camp, the BRCPO, etc. People expect the Esplanade to be awesome, and the art to be amazing.

One can pretend it's not true, but, tens of thousands of virgin burners and veterans are coming to see the spectacle.

We take it for granted that the city will be there for us. What a great experiment it would be if, when everybody showed up, there was just an 8-mile perimeter fence and the Man. I wonder if people would form streets. (Emergency services won't allow it so we'll never know.)

Your opinion, however, is as valuable as mine. Take care.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby domitron » Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:16 pm

ZaphodBurner wrote:
hotmess wrote:The idea of now canceling the open sale and rewarding tickets to camps that "make the event" or "deserve tickets" is a bad idea. If this happens Burning Man, in my mind, will become just another festival that has to rely on having guaranteed entertainment for people to enjoy.


It already has to rely on guaranteed entertainment. People are automatically assuming the city is going to be awesome, that there's going to be a Man and a center camp, a power grid, toilets. Most people expect the ice camp, the BRCPO, etc. People expect the Esplanade to be awesome, and the art to be amazing.

One can pretend it's not true, but, tens of thousands of virgin burners and veterans are coming to see the spectacle.

We take it for granted that the city will be there for us. What a great experiment it would be if, when everybody showed up, there was just an 8-mile perimeter fence and the Man. I wonder if people would form streets. (Emergency services won't allow it so we'll never know.)

Your opinion, however, is as valuable as mine. Take care.


I totally agree. In years past Burning Man was awesome and entertaining. To say that it is just another festival that has to rely on having guaranteed entertainment seems to imply the entertainment is typical. People do attend with the expectation of being entertained, but that entertainment is anything but typical because most of it comes from the community as a whole. And I attend the event for that entertainment as well as to be allowed to contribute to it myself (which is its own reward). If I wanted to just go camping with some friends to relax, I don't know about you but I would not choose the desert in the summer for my camp site. I'd rather camp in Yellowstone or somewhere like that in a forest of green, rather than on the playa where I have to spread suntan lotion an eighth inch thick or else I'll get sun cancer and blisters, where I am gulping down gypsum dust all day, and where I feel generally in a daze the first two or three days.

The problem this year is that all the heavily contributing camps have been broken up. You can try to spin it as some good thing, but I don't think you can be serious if you think it through. Burning Man will be cool this year I am sure, but it's going to be thrown back 15 years or more of progress in making it a cool event. I don't expect much IF I even attend whereas normally I'm excited as hell and am thinking about what projects I'm going to be involved in around this time of year.

I have moved on from angry about the lottery, to hopeful that it can be fixed, to hopeless that it will. I really doubt Burning Man will be worth attending for me this year. There are a lot of things you can do for a grand per person for a week of entertainment, you know. Hell, I'm on the west coast and have friends in Hawaii. I might just fly out there and kick it.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby lemur » Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:41 pm

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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby Dizaster » Sun Feb 12, 2012 9:16 pm

I'm not a lawyer, but I'm guessing the BM corporation could get itself into some serious legal trouble if they distributed the remaining tickets to the theme camps and art installations. The problem is that BM as well as the participants are bound to the agreement that we "signed" when we signed up for tickets. I don't think a radical change in ticketing policy (from lottery to preferred distribution) would be legal, and I could see someone filing a class action law suit as a matter of principle.

Wishing all the best of luck in the ticket forage!
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby lemur » Sun Feb 12, 2012 9:22 pm

the LLC has plenty of people who are lawyers.. theyll know what to do and what not to do.


i wouldnt worry about lawsuits.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby Mosquitopilate » Sun Feb 12, 2012 9:33 pm

I just want to be registered for STEP Now ! I can not wait anymore :D
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby hotmess » Sun Feb 12, 2012 9:42 pm

DITTO.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby Dizaster » Sun Feb 12, 2012 9:45 pm

lemur wrote:the LLC has plenty of people who are lawyers.. theyll know what to do and what not to do.


i wouldnt worry about lawsuits.

Probably very true. I suppose the corporation wouldn't have lasted this long if it didn't have a very strong legal team.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby Herring » Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:07 am

Dizaster wrote:I'm not a lawyer, but I'm guessing the BM corporation could get itself into some serious legal trouble if they distributed the remaining tickets to the theme camps and art installations. The problem is that BM as well as the participants are bound to the agreement that we "signed" when we signed up for tickets. I don't think a radical change in ticketing policy (from lottery to preferred distribution) would be legal, and I could see someone filing a class action law suit as a matter of principle.

Wishing all the best of luck in the ticket forage!


There is no change from lottery to preferred distribution. We aren't talking about lottery tickets in this thread, we're talking about the rest of the tickets.

Remaining tickets are NOT part of the lottery. There were 40,000 tickets in the lottery, those tickets have been sold already. There are 10,000 additional tickets REMAINING that were to be sold in a first come first served Open Sale. Now some or all of THOSE tickets might be put aside for past contributors to purchase.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby hotmess » Mon Feb 13, 2012 7:20 am

Herring wrote:
Dizaster wrote:Remaining tickets are NOT part of the lottery. There were 40,000 tickets in the lottery, those tickets have been sold already. There are 10,000 additional tickets REMAINING that were to be sold in a first come first served Open Sale. Now some or all of THOSE tickets might be put aside for past contributors to purchase.


I agree. These tickets are not part of the lottery and are now in this grey area of "Open Sale". I guess the hard part is how we define who qualifies as a "past contributor". Is this someone who builds a theme camp on the Esplenade? Or is this someone who camps in suburbs providing an alternative experience from the Esplenade? Is this someone who is a performer? Or is this someone who builds an art car? Is it someone who has been to 3 burns? Or is someone who has been to 6 or more? I guess my point is that this definition is hard to pin down and is what will make the open sale a complicated matter.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby zorro sings » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:30 am

trilobyte wrote:I'm not buying it either. A significant amount of what that guy has written has turned out to be either wild speculation or complete bullshit, and he's even gotten published stats on previous years' events wrong on occasion (which is one thing when it's in a forum post, but unacceptable if you're writing an article for publication). That and all his posts tend to work in at least one or two plugs for his book, I wish the Guardian could find another contributor to cover playa-related news.



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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby Drawingablank » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:49 am

Wow, considering the early posts in this thread - an awful lot of what was dismissed as "just some guys blog" seems to have hit the nail squarely on the head.

Not that I'm a fan of his, but perhaps there was more to it than guesswork - not that you had to be Kreskin to see this coming anyway.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby MyDearFriend » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:09 am

Drawingablank wrote:Wow, considering the early posts in this thread - an awful lot of what was dismissed as "just some guys blog" seems to have hit the nail squarely on the head.

Not that I'm a fan of his, but perhaps there was more to it than guesswork - not that you had to be Kreskin to see this coming anyway.


Bwahahahahahahahaha, when I saw Marian's comment about "widely read blogs" I knew the fucking score: she's been talking to that jerk! Oh well :P strategic leakage is very popular in my town (running shit up the flagpole to see who salutes).

Personally I think directed distribution of the last 10K tix might really help.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby AntiM » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:11 am

Without my reading glasses, I saw "widely spread legs" at first....
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby remi » Thu Feb 16, 2012 7:27 am

I'm just worried about the people that counted on the open sale because the presale/main sale were during the Christmas season.. so I'm assuming some people couldn't budget the money to register, meaning they won't be in step, and now they have no chance with the main sale. I know there must be a few thousand more then 10,000 tickets available (because the CC's that didn't go through, and all the tickets they've pulled since the lotto due to scalpers, duplicates.) Why couldn't they just allocate 5000 to the main sale, and the remaining 6000-7000 to theme camps and artist?
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby Drawingablank » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:15 am

MyDearFriend wrote:.Bwahahahahahahahaha, when I saw Marian's comment about "widely read blogs" I knew the fucking score: she's been talking to that jerk! Oh well :P strategic leakage is very popular in my town (running shit up the flagpole to see who salutes).

Personally I think directed distribution of the last 10K tix might really help.


Well it is certainly helping to drive a wedge into the burner community. Admittedly there may be some need of this for essential services, but to be picking and choosing among camps, MVs, etc... is wrong on so many levels. The moment someone starts judging whether or not someone is worthy to attend - part of what it means to be a burner becomes meaningless. And lets not kid ourselves here with semantics - no matter how flowery it is phrased, burners are essentially being judged as either worthy or unworthy of those 10,000 tickets.

What's gonna happen next year - Mega theme camps? I can see it now - everyone wanting to be part of the chosen elite to increase their chance for a ticket each year and small, unregistered, yet fun side block camps going the way of the Dodo. Give each of the "approved" camps a half hour radial from Esplanade out to H and let the dregs have the outskirts?

I guess it would be a perfect reflection of the way business has gone in this country with a dozen or so huge store chains putting out Mom and Pop operations all over the place.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby vargaso » Thu Feb 16, 2012 9:57 am

Drawingablank wrote:Wow, considering the early posts in this thread - an awful lot of what was dismissed as "just some guys blog" seems to have hit the nail squarely on the head.

Not that I'm a fan of his, but perhaps there was more to it than guesswork - not that you had to be Kreskin to see this coming anyway.


If it's dismissed here on the boards, that means it absolutely will come to fruition. Count on it.
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby Herring » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:37 am

vargaso wrote:If it's dismissed here on the boards, that means it absolutely will come to fruition. Count on it.


Hmmmm... I want a pony and a boat and a ticket to burning man and a job with benefits and an industrial sewing machine and a puppy and a playa wedding and a banjo and mew speakers... Hey come on we need to discuss this so all my wishes come true!

Oh dang it I thought you said if it was discussed on the boards it would come true, quick, somebody dismiss my wish list!
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby ZaphodBurner » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:23 pm

MyDearFriend wrote:


I found this piece almost credible until I figured out who wrote it; the book plug woke me up. Not buying this, sorry.


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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby Elderberry » Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:38 pm

Redemption....ahhhhh.... :wink:
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Re: Interesting read--open sale may be cancelled.

Postby tamarakay » Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:46 pm

Herring wrote:
vargaso wrote:If it's dismissed here on the boards, that means it absolutely will come to fruition. Count on it.


Hmmmm... I want a pony and a boat and a ticket to burning man and a job with benefits and an industrial sewing machine and a puppy and a playa wedding and a banjo and mew speakers... Hey come on we need to discuss this so all my wishes come true!

Oh dang it I thought you said if it was discussed on the boards it would come true, quick, somebody dismiss my wish list!


What a ridiculous wish and a waste of a perfectly good post. All you needed to make it truly unreal is your book plug. WHERE IS YOUR DAMN BOOK PLUG. You are dismissed.
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