## cooling your tent or van

Swamp Coolers, Cooler Management, Dry Ice, Misting Systems, and just plain how to beat the heat.

### Re: cooling your tent or van

I think the cooler is great as long as there's room to transport it!

Those containers are made out of a wierd plastic that is almost impossible to get paint to stick to. (MOOP)

Shade it or put it on the north side of the space being cooled and it will be in the shade most of the day anyway..
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FIGJAM

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Location: apache junction az.

### Re: cooling your tent or van

Hi figjam et all-

My camp is hopefully going to make some more bucket coolers for some new yurts this year.

I came across this below, for 200+ cfm fans-
http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l3/g36/c43 ... Page1.html

Obviously, the bucket cooler is limited in the amount of intake holes you can make, but a higher cfm fan wouldn't hurt. Would you recommend any of these?

kstlfido

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Camp Name: Bioluminati / Pimp Yr Bike

### Re: Yurt square footage

ConnieH wrote:
kman wrote:Side topic, I know, but what size yurt is it that you determined to be 885 cu ft? I'm making the 6' high version (extra 2' sections on the bottom) and haven't gotten around to figuring out the internal area yet.

*shudders at the thought of dusting off those rusty math skills*

Mine is the "regular" hexayurt with 4 foot high sides...I hope I did the calculation right for cubic feet (my math skills are very rusty!)...floor area is 166 sqft x 4 ft = 664 for the bottom 4 feet; 1/3 x 166 (floor of "top cone") x 4 ft = 221.33; 664 + 221.33 = 885.33 cubic feet.

If my formula is correct, your top cone would be the same, and adding the additional 2 feet would increase the bottom 6 feet to 996 cf - right?

Hi ConnnieH or anyone else-

Thanks for the formula. We use 6' stratch hexayurts in camp- http://www.appropedia.org/File:All_hexa ... nsions.png

So- 70 sq feet x 4 = 280 cu feet for the 'wall' part. 70/3= 23.3.... x 4 = ~93.2 cu feet (roof part). 280 + 93.2 = 373.2 cu for the 6' stretch yurt. Does that sound right?

Thanks- Kent

kstlfido

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Camp Name: Bioluminati / Pimp Yr Bike

### Re: cooling your tent or van

Ok, the fan is in, and the goop is spread! With the help I've had, it's coming along nicely! Wheee
Sometimes I'm confused by what I think is really obvious. But what I think is really obvious obviously isn't obvious.

maryanimal

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

kstlfido wrote:Hi figjam et all-

My camp is hopefully going to make some more bucket coolers for some new yurts this year.

I came across this below, for 200+ cfm fans-
http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l3/g36/c43 ... Page1.html

Obviously, the bucket cooler is limited in the amount of intake holes you can make, but a higher cfm fan wouldn't hurt. Would you recommend any of these?

The invesment in power (1.75amps more) for about 60 more cfm does'nt make sence to me.

The fan I use puts out 190cfm for 1.25amps.

The one you link to put out 250 for 3amps. (click on them and check the specs.)
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

Fuck Im Good Just Ask Me

FIGJAM

Posts: 6963
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Location: apache junction az.

### Re: cooling your tent or van

Figjam is right. There is a point of diminishing returns with respect to CFM's power consumption. The 190 CFM that Figjam mentions is about the best choice if you want your battery to last all week without having to recharge it. If you have an easy way to recharge your big marine battery, then you can afford more bigger fans.

Another thing to consider is how loud that 200+ CFM fan is. 66.5 dB. Thats pretty loud and depending on where you camp, it might be an issue.
The Figjam fan is 52 dB and is fairly loud in itself. I will be bringing some quieter fans in case I need to tone it down for the neighbors. Of course, quieter fans mean lower CFM's so it's a tradeoff.
Life's a bitch, then you go to Burning Man - Unjonharley

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TT120

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

Looking for a comparison, I'd say it's less than half as loud as my room air conditioner.
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

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FIGJAM

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Location: apache junction az.

### Re: cooling your tent or van

is there some kinda 12v timer , I would like the cooler to shut off after 4 hrs so the water doesnt run dry and mess up the pump. Thought of using some kinda floating thingy that as it got lower
would pull out the connection and stop the pump.
winners never quit , quitters never win

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tatonka

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

tatonka wrote:is there some kinda 12v timer , I would like the cooler to shut off after 4 hrs so the water doesnt run dry and mess up the pump. Thought of using some kinda floating thingy that as it got lower
would pull out the connection and stop the pump.

The mechanical "sun-lamp" timers for bathrooms. Give it a twist, and its spring will wind it down to off. They're rated for 120 VAC, but should work fine for the recommended pumps & fans (low current). I've not seen one that will run ON for more than an hour. There may be some mechanical ones made for bathroom fans, but the ones I've seen are modern, electronic and are setup for household VAC.

Electrical Float-Swtich

As long as the water level is above the minimum, the switch is ON and powers the pump & fan. Water level drops low enough, the lowered float position shuts the switch off.

Depending on the size & footprint of your swamp-cooler's water reservoir, and the water volume in your hose, you could get a very interesting side effect:
1. water level drops enough,
2. the switch turns OFF,
3. the pump & fan turn off,
4. water runs down the hose and off of the filter(s) into the water reservoir,
5. raised water level in reservoir turns the switch to ON and powers the pump & fan,
6. water pumped up the hose lowers the water level, returning us to #1.

While this cycling of the pump & fan will waste some power, the noise of them cycling on & off will let you know you need to add water.

Make sure the float-switch you use can handle the current of your pump and your fan, and with the cycling should your setup do that. If the switch is only for a low-current control voltage that exceeds your load, you can have the switch drive a relay that powers the pump & fan, but remember the relay will consume some power too, so don't oversize it.

With or without a relay, it's easy to wire up. BUT, you're adding more points for failure, so watch your physical layout and access to the wiring, so in the event the relay or switch give you grief on-playa, you are prepared to easily delete them to get the simple functioning back.
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Canoe

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

There's room in the unicooler or the box cooler for a float switch, but I don't see a way to do it with the bucket.
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

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FIGJAM

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Location: apache junction az.

### Re: cooling your tent or van

The trash can is 50 gallons but I have the fan and vents lower so it will line up with the dome. I'm getting 25 useable gallons which seems fine. I ran the same basic design last year and it cooled my 18 dia 5/8 3v dome very well. I also originally worried the black plastic may cause slight issues but it worked good here in Reno at 107 degrees. The Costco battery runs the pump and cool breeze fan all week on high approx 4 hours a day.

BAK3R

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Camp Name: 6:30 & Desderata (AEZ)

### Re: cooling your tent or van

Perfection and grace put a smile on my face!
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

Fuck Im Good Just Ask Me

FIGJAM

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Location: apache junction az.

### Re: cooling your tent or van

@ kstlfido The pad is 2 inches over each vent not sure much if any air is creeping past but not a bad idea to be extra safe. Also yes I will be installing door weatherseal foam around the CB fan and the lid.

BAK3R

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Camp Name: 6:30 & Desderata (AEZ)

### Re: cooling your tent or van

Canoe wrote:
tatonka wrote:is there some kinda 12v timer , I would like the cooler to shut off after 4 hrs so the water doesnt run dry and mess up the pump. Thought of using some kinda floating thingy that as it got lower
would pull out the connection and stop the pump.

The mechanical "sun-lamp" timers for bathrooms. Give it a twist, and its spring will wind it down to off. They're rated for 120 VAC, but should work fine for the recommended pumps & fans (low current). I've not seen one that will run ON for more than an hour. There may be some mechanical ones made for bathroom fans, but the ones I've seen are modern, electronic and are setup for household VAC.

Electrical Float-Swtich

As long as the water level is above the minimum, the switch is ON and powers the pump & fan. Water level drops low enough, the lowered float position shuts the switch off.
<snip>
While this cycling of the pump & fan will waste some power, the noise of them cycling on & off will let you know you need to add water.

Make sure the float-switch you use can handle the current of your pump and your fan, and with the cycling should your setup do that. If the switch is only for a low-current control voltage that exceeds your load, you can have the switch drive a relay that powers the pump & fan, but remember the relay will consume some power too, so don't oversize it.

With or without a relay, it's easy to wire up. BUT, you're adding more points for failure, so watch your physical layout and access to the wiring, so in the event the relay or switch give you grief on-playa, you are prepared to easily delete them to get the simple functioning back.

You can certainly add a float switch. I added them to all 3 coolers I assembled last year; two bucket and on box cooler. The switch used is a typical 'marine' bilge pump switch-
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000NU69XO/ref ... 1_ST1_dp_1

You can see it installed in my post on Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:03 pm.

Float switch is designed not to 'oscillate'- it takes ~1" higher level of water to turn it back 'on'. So not an issue with these smaller water amounts.

There are a few caveats with the switch-
It turns 'off' at appx 1" depth of water. In my box cooler, that was ~1 gallon left. I got 'creative' and mounted the switch to a piece of angled steel (float-end downward). This positioned the float to turn off later, down to ~ 1/2" of standing water. The angled steel also acted as a weight for the switch (they are indeed buoyant). I did not glue the switch to the bottom of the cooler.

For the bucket coolers- I glued the switches directly to the bottom with silicone (no angle). As I was using the mini-pumps, there was plenty of space.

If you want to get fancy, you could put a little 'fence' around the float switch, so nothing will inhibit the switch action. I had no problems. I used mine as a beer cooler and just made sure I didn't pile cans of beer on top of/around the switch.

I rigged up a light too; to give me visual indication when the water was out.

A little more fiddle to add 2 more connections. But easy to bypass in case of float switch problems.
Last edited by kstlfido on Mon Jul 08, 2013 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

kstlfido

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Camp Name: Bioluminati / Pimp Yr Bike

### Re: cooling your tent or van

BAK3R wrote:@ kstlfido The pad is 2 inches over each vent not sure much if any air is creeping past but not a bad idea to be extra safe. Also yes I will be installing door weatherseal foam around the CB fan and the lid.

BAK3R- cool. I would recommend using silicone around the fan, just to make a good air-tight seal around all the nooks and crannies. But if you can squish hi-density foam stripping to accomplish that, then give it a try!

kstlfido

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Joined: Thu Aug 20, 2009 12:12 am
Burning Since: 2000
Camp Name: Bioluminati / Pimp Yr Bike

### Re: cooling your tent or van

kstlfido wrote:You can certainly add a float switch. I added them to all 3 coolers I assembled last year; two bucket and on box cooler. The switch used is a typical 'marine' bilge pump switch...

Nice!
I'd never seen that type for bottom installation, only the doughnut on the vertical rod.
And no relay required.

Any issues with washed down playa dust interfering with movement?

Would you recommend checking its movement if there's a big dust storm?
*** http://www.burningman.com/preparation/ ***
... but don't harm the red dragon that frequents the area from time to time. He and I have an agreement.
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Canoe

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

No issues at all. You can always check if you're worried; I never did.

These were designed to be in bilges of boats, which I bet can get pretty yucky. Switch components are sealed.

kstlfido

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Burning Since: 2000
Camp Name: Bioluminati / Pimp Yr Bike

### Re: cooling your tent or van

FIGJAM wrote:There's room in the unicooler or the box cooler for a float switch, but I don't see a way to do it with the bucket.

I used this one in my bucket cooler
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005FDPDDG/ref=wms_ohs_product?ie=UTF8&psc=1

worked like a charm! I used an Arduino with it, and a photoresistor. It would turn on the cooler when the sun came up and off when it went down.
This year I am adding a temp sensor inside the yurt and a little lcd with data
I'll take pictures when I pull it out to test my camp controller V2
ShreddinPB

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

RE: Float switch in a bucket cooler:
I used a horizontal switch, this one: http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Liquid-Wate ... 0919814015

To mount it, I cut chicken wire cloth into a circle about 5 inches diameter, this disk of wire mesh fits inside the blue duracool cylinder, an inch or 2 up from the bottom of the bucket. It's held in place by the pointy ends of the chicken wire poking into the duracool pad. Then I used wire ties to fasten the float switch to the chicken wire disk. I can adjust the height by moving the chicken wire disk up or down inside the duracool cylinder. The pump fits underneath the disk and the pump tube runs up through one of the holes in the chicken wire. So it also keeps the pump held down in place (i'm using a much smaller pump that Fig's). This will let me fine-tune the height on playa if needed, and keeps all the wiring close to the pump.

( I also considered using 2 chopsticks to poke thru the Duracool pad to form support structures for the float switch. But I had chicken wire handy and the Chinese place was closed!).

asr9754

Posts: 89
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2012 2:58 pm

### Re: cooling your tent or van

RE: Float switch in a bucket cooler:
I used a horizontal switch, this one: http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Liquid-Wate ... 0919814015

To mount it, I cut chicken wire cloth into a circle about 5 inches diameter, this disk of wire mesh fits inside the blue duracool cylinder, an inch or 2 up from the bottom of the bucket. It's held in place by the pointy ends of the chicken wire poking into the duracool pad. Then I used wire ties to fasten the float switch to the chicken wire disk. I can adjust the height by moving the chicken wire disk up or down inside the duracool cylinder. The pump fits underneath the disk and the pump tube runs up through one of the holes in the chicken wire. So it also keeps the pump held down in place (i'm using a much smaller pump that Fig's). This will let me fine-tune the height on playa if needed, and keeps all the wiring close to the pump.

( I also considered using 2 chopsticks to poke thru the Duracool pad to form support structures for the float switch. But I had chicken wire handy and the Chinese place was closed!).

asr9754

Posts: 89
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2012 2:58 pm

### Re: cooling your tent or van

ok, rereading the thread a bit. I'm thinking I spliced the wires incorrectly.
Sometimes I'm confused by what I think is really obvious. But what I think is really obvious obviously isn't obvious.

maryanimal

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

FIGJAM wrote:It's better if they don't leak at all.

You should be able to trim the vents to size without too much trouble.

Thanks for suggesting that. Trimmed an inch off the vents (1/2" off ea side) with a dremel and should fit ok now. Was easy enough. Gonna coat the exposed metal edge with some rustoleum to prevent rust.
Jyman

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

FIGJAM wrote:
Tatonka, It works fine in the shade.

Mine is actually inside the playapod with the cooler pushed against a hatch for the intake.

My box caught a little LA sun while working on it today, and the plastic got sooo hot! I hope having this side-draft design outside won't mess with the cooling. It seems like the box would absorb so much heat that the water wouldn't be able to stay cool as efficiently. Maybe this particular plastic absorbs more heat. http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/TOUGH- ... vc=IDPRRZ1

Figjam do you prefer your "inside" box design for this reason?
Jyman

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

No, I just did'nt want my cooler hanging on the outside of the playapod.

They mount them on the roofs of houses here and it does'nt make to much difference in how well they cool.
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FIGJAM

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Location: apache junction az.

### Re: cooling your tent or van

You ROCK! Thanks so much for the creative post. I am totally getting the pieces to build this!
JuicyMagic

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

I finally finished my bucket cooler and it works perfectly! Taking a few naps in a cool tent will be great!
Sometimes I'm confused by what I think is really obvious. But what I think is really obvious obviously isn't obvious.

maryanimal

Posts: 3839
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 9:41 am
Burning Since: 2011

### Re: cooling your tent or van

I bought a pump and then misplaced it somewhere.....it had a red wire and a black wire (when I find it I will bring it as a backup)
Ordered another pump but this one had a dc converter(I cut it off) but the pump says its 12v....there are 2 wires inside, blue and brown!
I cant remember if somewhere here there was a mention of which wire is pos/neg, if they were blue/brown?
So the theme this year is like a giant camp out in the desert? With people bringing lots of shit from all over? uh.. -Marscrumbs

Martiansky

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

It's in here somewhere.

I think brown is + and blue is - , but you can't hurt it.

It will run in either position, but the right way will pump 3 times as much water.
"Don't buy ur Burn...........Build ur Burn!"

Fuck Im Good Just Ask Me

FIGJAM

Posts: 6963
Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:39 am
Location: apache junction az.

### Re: cooling your tent or van

Thanks Figjam!

I have a fan but couldnt find the pump!
Now I can finish it!
So the theme this year is like a giant camp out in the desert? With people bringing lots of shit from all over? uh.. -Marscrumbs

Martiansky

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### Re: cooling your tent or van

1st time doing silicone here, this the right stuff?

http://www.homedepot.com/p/DAP-Alex-Plu ... d7j7hnXo7A
Jyman

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Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2012 5:41 pm
Burning Since: 2011

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