HexaYurts

Ideas, advice, tips, and tricks regarding shelter, shade, tents, and camping. Yes, this includes RV's too.

Re: Folding Yurt and Tape

Postby Elderberry » Wed Jun 17, 2009 3:58 pm

Etrit wrote:SilverOrange - I do plan on taping all the seems on exterior as well as all of the interior. I'm hoping to do all the taping on both the roof cone and the side walls except for one seem in advance at home and then taping those 2 seems and the seam between the cone and the side walls at the burn.

Connie - Check out my flicker page for my idea on folding. The catch is that you have to leave a larger gap between each piece to allow it to fold... so it might decrease the strength a bit but.. I doubt its that big of a deal..
IF - You use the 6" tape!
3" tape wouldn't cut it, you have to put each piece flush w/o a gap if you use 3". But maybe you could make like 5" tape by using 2 pieces of tape running down each seem w/ a 1" overlap on the tape? I'm guessing the tape sticks to itself very well and won't come apart...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/13487253@N07/3575697430/in/set-72157618950550162/

jkisha - I'm thinking that it would even work with the 1" boards if you leave enough of a gap between them. The best way to do this is by laying out the pieces how you want to fold them first.. then tape 1 side, flip and tape the other, then unfold and tape the rest of the seems.. You will probably end up with a 1/4" gap between each board piece but that still gives you 5.75" of tape sticking to the boards.

I really really want to do it this way because it will be easier to transport, easier to put up, easier to take down AND easier to put back up next time I use it! I'm going to be part of a big theme camp this year and the less complicated stuff we have to set up the better!

Sadly I probably wont be able to buy any supplies until the beginning of August! :( So I'm gonna have a very short trial period!


All I can say is that the real panels work a lot different than the cardboard model--I know, we built a model too. Just make sure you do a dry run with the real panels at home first, and good luck.

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Re: can't find 1" thick boards in dfw area

Postby ConnieH » Thu Jun 18, 2009 7:56 am

sambojones wrote:has anyone here been able to get away with using 3/4" boards? I've read through the thread and I've seen the 1/2" get shot down and after seeing/feeling it at home depot the 1/2" does seem pretty flimsy, but the 3/4" feels much much more rigid and sturdy. I know that the 1" is ideal but I can't seem to get any around the dfw area. I checked with lowes and home depot and they both told me the producer of the boards DOW industrial won't ship the 1" or thicker boards to our area for whatever reason:o. Any opinions or insights would be greatly appreciated. :D


The panels I have are R-Max and according to their website there is a manufacturing plant in Dallas, so you should be able to get some there...call a "real" lumberyard, one that supplies builders not DIYers, that's how I got mine because Home Depot and Lowes don't carry the good ones here :)

I'll be putting up my yurt for the second time this weekend, it will be interesting to see how long it takes to put up. When I took it down a couple weeks ago, I left the walls in 3 pieces and the roof in six pieces, like jkisha recommends. I was in a hurry and taking it down by myself, and it only took me 20 minutes - piece of cake! This may not work on the playa if it's real windy, but I cut the roof from the inside (leaving the tape holding the roof to the walls attached) and folded out the roof pieces like peeling an orange, then cut around the perimeter of the top of the walls, cut three side walls, folded it all up, done. With 2 people it probably could have been done in 10 minutes.
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A couple questions and somethings I found that might help

Postby Clown Shoes » Thu Jun 18, 2009 6:12 pm

My search for polyisocyanurate panels (R-Max, Tuff-R, etc)has been a bust so far except for special order from Lowe's that comes with a two month lead time. Which at this point is way to close for comfort. I live in NC and this stuff isn't used in building construction around here. So, I looked into going the Hexacomb route. I put in a quote request on the Pregis/Hexacomb site and heard back form the local rep (to my surprise). He explained that they only do very large orders but was interested in the whole yurt idea. He called the local plant and found out that they where running an order for 3/4" x 48" sheets(they'll cut it to any length you want). He then told me they could tack on some extra for me when they ran the build. Each piece would cost about $6, so I ordered. I doubled my order so that I could cement two pieces together to form 1 1/2" thick 4x8 sheets. I just picked up my order today and this stuff is awesome. It's way tougher then I thought it'd be. I tried crushing it in my vise between two pieces of wood. Believe me it's tough.
We've been planning on painting our yurt regardless of material. Which it'll probably be necessary to protect the cardboard from the chance of rain anyway, so it works out. I've also ordered some radiant barrier (fiber reinforced aluminum foil) for heat blockage. Based on the link from JK and this one that I found http://www.radiantguard.com/radiant-barrier-101.aspx we're going to use the barrier on the inside of the yurt. Haven't decided yet whether to cement it to the boards before construction or tape to the inside of the yurt after construction.
One thing I haven't been sure on is the use of tape to seam the panel edges. Are you suppose to use the 6" expensive stuff or can a cheaper packing style tape do? My understanding is that seaming the edges is only to stop MOOP and keep the edges from getting messed up during construction and transport.
Also, I'd like to know what you all think about which paints or sealers to use on the outside, any ideas on keeping it on the cheap but maintaining proper protection of the cardboard? In theory, if done right, you could turn one of these panels into a type of lightly glassed setup, like the way a surfboard is constructed but with a hexacomb core instead of foam.
Thanks for the help.
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Postby SilverOrange » Thu Jun 18, 2009 7:52 pm

Hey Clown Shoes. Sounds like you were being radically self reliant and are going to get a sweet yurt out of the deal! The only thing I would say is that if you are not going to use the radiant barrier on the outside of the panels skip it. Radiant barrier only works if it can reflect the radiant heat back the way it came with an air space to do it. If you put it inside your just reflecting the heat from the wall back into the wall. You're really taking away all of it's usefulness by putting it inside. If you adhere it on the outside, it would not only protect the exterior surface of the hexayurt from moisture, but reflect the radiant heat from the sun back out into the void. (In '98, last time there was El Nino, it actually rained hard one night on the playa.)
As far as tape goes, just remember that the wind can rip out there, and that tape is all that's standing between you and a dusty ass walk across the playa trying to recover all of the pieces of your yurt.
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Postby diane o'thirst » Fri Jun 19, 2009 9:40 am

I'd recommend Gorilla Tape to tape it together. That stuff is ferocious tough, makes duct tape look like wax paper.
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Taping the edges in

Postby Clown Shoes » Tue Jun 23, 2009 6:36 pm

Well, I decided not to take any chances and seamed my board edges with the 6" filament tape. It kinda worked out, it really toughens up the boards and it ended up to be a great clamp to help keep the two boards together while the glue dried between them.
We're giving up on trying to waterproof with a sealer or paint. We found out you can purchase this tape:
http://www.findtape.com/product430/JVCC-BOOK-20CC-Crystal-Clear-Book-Repair-Tape.aspx?idx=1&tid=2&info=BOOK-20CC+Crystal+Clear+Book+Repair+Tape
in 48" wide rolls for a pretty cheap price. It's just your basic packing tape. It'll be our finish coat on the panels to protect against any rain showers.
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practice assembly question

Postby stack » Tue Jun 23, 2009 6:59 pm

I also was able to get my panels cut and taped (except for the door and filter holes), and am hoping to do a practice run on Friday. I've got enough 6" tape to do a full tape job, but I don't think I'll use all my extra tape, and just do a minimal taping for the practice run. I'm curious how others have done their practice assemblies.

Starting to get exciting!
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Re: A couple questions and somethings I found that might hel

Postby Elderberry » Tue Jun 23, 2009 9:03 pm

Clown Shoes wrote:My search for polyisocyanurate panels (R-Max, Tuff-R, etc)has been a bust so far except for special order from Lowe's that comes with a two month lead time. Which at this point is way to close for comfort. I live in NC and this stuff isn't used in building construction around here. So, I looked into going the Hexacomb route. I put in a quote request on the Pregis/Hexacomb site and heard back form the local rep (to my surprise). He explained that they only do very large orders but was interested in the whole yurt idea. He called the local plant and found out that they where running an order for 3/4" x 48" sheets(they'll cut it to any length you want). He then told me they could tack on some extra for me when they ran the build. Each piece would cost about $6, so I ordered. I doubled my order so that I could cement two pieces together to form 1 1/2" thick 4x8 sheets. I just picked up my order today and this stuff is awesome. It's way tougher then I thought it'd be. I tried crushing it in my vise between two pieces of wood. Believe me it's tough.
We've been planning on painting our yurt regardless of material. Which it'll probably be necessary to protect the cardboard from the chance of rain anyway, so it works out. I've also ordered some radiant barrier (fiber reinforced aluminum foil) for heat blockage. Based on the link from JK and this one that I found http://www.radiantguard.com/radiant-barrier-101.aspx we're going to use the barrier on the inside of the yurt. Haven't decided yet whether to cement it to the boards before construction or tape to the inside of the yurt after construction.
One thing I haven't been sure on is the use of tape to seam the panel edges. Are you suppose to use the 6" expensive stuff or can a cheaper packing style tape do? My understanding is that seaming the edges is only to stop MOOP and keep the edges from getting messed up during construction and transport.
Also, I'd like to know what you all think about which paints or sealers to use on the outside, any ideas on keeping it on the cheap but maintaining proper protection of the cardboard? In theory, if done right, you could turn one of these panels into a type of lightly glassed setup, like the way a surfboard is constructed but with a hexacomb core instead of foam.
Thanks for the help.


Interesting. I'll be curious to see your yurt on the playa. I think you were wise doubling the sheets. You are correct in that using a cheaper tape on the ends is OK.

I'm no expert on paint, but don't they make heat reflective paint and insulating paint? http://www.sydneycityroofing.com.au/heat-reflective-paint.html

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securing the constructed yurt +1

Postby ShaggyP » Mon Jun 29, 2009 10:41 am

During conversation about the construction of yurts last night we came to 2 thoughts that I have not seen discussed in this forum that I was hoping others might have some thoughts on.

First, could a hand saw be used in trade for the razor method in cutting the angled boards? You can get fairly thin bladed saws and they seem like they would be more effective than all the wasted razors. Has anyone gone this route?

Second, when tying down the constructed yurt, what is the best anchor angle to tie at? My thought was that it should be anchored almost straight down to provide the best tension on the entire structure but, a strong arguement was made towards tying out at an angle similar to the roof's downslope... Thoughts?
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Postby Oldguy » Mon Jun 29, 2009 3:50 pm

A fine-toothed miter saw is better than a jagged rip saw for angled cuts. Use a miter box for more accurate cuts. If economy minded, a hacksaw with a wood blade can be used. Power tools like a small circular saw or jigsaw with wood cutting blades can save time and muscle. Practice a bit with scrap wood first. Anchoring through bottom edge supports should suffice, additionally a large birdnet or spider rope can be pegged down for safety.
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Postby ShaggyP » Mon Jun 29, 2009 6:23 pm

[quote="Oldguy"]A fine-toothed miter saw is better than a jagged rip saw for angled cuts. Use a miter box for more accurate cuts. If economy minded, a hacksaw with a wood blade can be used. Power tools like a small circular saw or jigsaw with wood cutting blades can save time and muscle. Practice a bit with scrap wood first. Anchoring through bottom edge supports should suffice, additionally a large birdnet or spider rope can be pegged down for safety.[/quote]

That would be one hell of a miter box, we are talking about an almost 9 foot long cut. Not to step on your toes Oldguy but I think you have an entirely different project in mind here...
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Postby Oldguy » Wed Jul 01, 2009 12:02 am

http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yurt

oops. Ger! I was thinking of Mongolian yurts. Ger!

You don't need wood frame members! :twisted:
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Postby theCryptofishist » Wed Jul 01, 2009 7:46 am

Oldguy wrote:You don't need wood frame members! :twisted:
Not if you use good old fashioned flesh ones. Or the modern silicone variety.
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Re: securing the constructed yurt +1

Postby Elderberry » Wed Jul 01, 2009 9:32 am

ShaggyP wrote:During conversation about the construction of yurts last night we came to 2 thoughts that I have not seen discussed in this forum that I was hoping others might have some thoughts on.

First, could a hand saw be used in trade for the razor method in cutting the angled boards? You can get fairly thin bladed saws and they seem like they would be more effective than all the wasted razors. Has anyone gone this route?

Second, when tying down the constructed yurt, what is the best anchor angle to tie at? My thought was that it should be anchored almost straight down to provide the best tension on the entire structure but, a strong arguement was made towards tying out at an angle similar to the roof's downslope... Thoughts?


Those razor knives work GREAT...the ones that are the "break-off" kind... you can extend them to the length you need, they don't break off when you use them. (A worry I had before I tried.) Also, they sell them at Home Depot for $6 or so, but you can get the EXACT same brand at the 99 cent store for -- 99 cents! So the cost is certainly not prohibitive. Oh, and the blades will give you several cuts--many more than the instructions say...you'll know when it's time to change them out.

And regarding the anchors, we tied them straight down at the sides of the yurt (at each point). We used that pre-bent rebar...about 1' or 1.5' don't remember exactly.

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to circulate or not circulate.

Postby stack » Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:54 pm

Need some advice from previous yurt dwellers: are exhaust fans necessary? I've got 5 computer fans that move 92cfm running off 12v. I was thinking 3 to circulate air inside the yurt and 2 on the roof for exhaust. Is this a good idea or will it mess with the insulating properties of the yurt too much?

My original plan was a small swamp cooler, but now realize that's really not going to make that much difference, so I'm wondering if the fans will be of benefit on their own inside.

Thanks for all the help.
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Postby Oldguy » Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:29 pm

delete this post please. Edit/delete button has no delete function.
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practice build

Postby stack » Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:37 am

So we set up the yurt in the park yesterday, and everything went great. Surprisingly, not many people came to ask us about it. "Welcome to Earth" was a pretty funny comment though.



Nobody wants to comment on my prior post about vents? may be some pics will solicite some responses.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/40011485@N ... 133547828/
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Postby Elderberry » Wed Jul 08, 2009 10:53 am

Those pictures bring back memories. I remember when our your was just as clean and shiny. When we did our park trial run, we had quite a few people asking what the hell we were building.

I would put in a couple of windows...cut them out and hinge them like you did the door. You can also buy some clear plastic to put on a couple of them. You can even buy some furnace filters to tape on some of the windows too, just make sure you can close everything up.

It was nice to have some windows to see out during the dust storms. It was also nice to have some windows with the filters to let in some air during the dust storms.

Fans in the vents? I don't know. I thought about it but my partner nixed the idea. A fan to circulate air in the yurt is a good idea for sure.

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Postby diane o'thirst » Wed Jul 08, 2009 2:17 pm

I thought about building a hexayurt myself.

But me, the architecture buff, I couldn't just <i>do it</i>. I had to do an arched doorway framed in birch twigs and faux keystone, octagonal windows, cupola with weathervane, trompe l'oeil paint job, footer boards…You get the idea.

It got a little too involved for one person to design, make and build.
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Postby SilverOrange » Wed Jul 08, 2009 2:20 pm

diane o'thirst wrote:I thought about building a hexayurt myself.

But me, the architecture buff, I couldn't just <i>do it</i>. I had to do an arched doorway framed in birch twigs and faux keystone, octagonal windows, cupola with weathervane, trompe l'oeil paint job, footer boards…You get the idea.

It got a little too involved for one person to design, make and build.


I think you could do it, and I think it would be marvelous.
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Postby Elderberry » Wed Jul 08, 2009 2:43 pm

SilverOrange wrote:
diane o'thirst wrote:I thought about building a hexayurt myself.

But me, the architecture buff, I couldn't just <i>do it</i>. I had to do an arched doorway framed in birch twigs and faux keystone, octagonal windows, cupola with weathervane, trompe l'oeil paint job, footer boards…You get the idea.

It got a little too involved for one person to design, make and build.


I think you could do it, and I think it would be marvelous.


It might be marvelous, it just wouldn't be a hexayurt. I think even architecture can often benefit from simplicity.

As a thought, you might just do the basic hexayurt and then decorate it. You won't compromise the strength and integrity and stability of structure, in which it's true beauty lies.

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Postby SilverOrange » Wed Jul 08, 2009 2:59 pm

What wouldn't make it a hexayurt? Octagonal windows? An arched door? It sounds like the rest would all be dressing. It would be nice to see something a little different IMO.
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Postby Elderberry » Wed Jul 08, 2009 4:02 pm

SilverOrange wrote:What wouldn't make it a hexayurt? Octagonal windows? An arched door? It sounds like the rest would all be dressing. It would be nice to see something a little different IMO.


Rather than argue this point I'll simply quote this as the reason you shouldn't concern yourself with trying to fancy it up.

It got a little too involved for one person to design, make and build.


The main purpose of the hexayurt is SHELTER, cool, dust free, shelter. So if 'fancying it up' is going to prevent you from enjoying the benefits...well I'll just leave it at that.

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Postby diane o'thirst » Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:48 pm

It wouldn't <i>not</i> be a hexayurt but all those architectural features would mean a lot more work. And I don't have access to a workshop or tools anymore (had to sell mine off and the workshop's owner moved away).

I know there's an art/workshop space for Burners up in Portland but that's a 220-mile round-trip and I don't have the money for that much gas, either. If we had something like that in Eugene — slam dunk, I'd be there right now.
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Postby Elderberry » Wed Jul 08, 2009 10:50 pm

You totally missed my point. Keep it simple and you can live in comfort. Worry about all that miscellaneous bull shit and keep complaining about not having this and that, and you'll spend your week in a fucking hot tent.

HELLO!? Is there anybody in there??????

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Postby SilverOrange » Wed Jul 08, 2009 11:17 pm

Back slowly away from the computer. Don't make any sudden movements and avoid making any eye contact. If he charges, curl up in the fetal position with your arms protecting your face and neck. (I think the viagra is finally wearing off.)
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Postby Elderberry » Wed Jul 08, 2009 11:25 pm

SilverOrange wrote:Back slowly away from the computer. Don't make any sudden movements and avoid making any eye contact. If he charges, curl up in the fetal position with your arms protecting your face and neck. (I think the viagra is finally wearing off.)


LOL Hey, my partner has been out of town for almost a week now, and I've had a glass or two of wine and well, I just don't have much tollerence for people that make all sorts of stupid excuses anyway.

I mean REALLY--and he/she's supposed to be an architect????????????????? And a burner????????????? Whatever happened to radical self reliance?????? and KISS Keep It Simple Stupid. OK, I'm done for now.

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experience with yurt on a roof rack

Postby sambojones » Sat Jul 11, 2009 7:37 pm

anybody have experience driving with the yurt strapped to the top of a car? I'm thinking of getting a yakima brand q tower roof rack so that I can put the yurt on top of my car just not sure how well it'll hold up driving on the highway especially since I got a long way to go coming from dallas. It just seems like there will be a lot of force from the wind getting put on the rack system and I'm not sure how well it'll hold up.

also how much of a mpg decrease did yall notice by driving with the yurt on the car?

The roof rack is definitely more affordable than buying or renting a trailer because I would have to buy a hitch system as well which costs even more $$ =/
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Almost there....

Postby Sync » Sat Jul 11, 2009 7:59 pm

Yeah! I got my order of Bi-directional 6" tape in from Findtape. com, and a bunch of Gorilla tape for the edges. Problem finding Tuff-R insulation though. Home Depot carries a 1" insulation board called Thermashield, foil on both sides with some kind of yellow-gray foam in the middle. Would this stuff work as well?

I'm also considering adding cheap A/C. There are some 5-6 amp 5000 btu units around that my Honda 1000 would probably be able to run. The Hexayurt will be one of the 6' stretch models. Anyone have experience trying this with a low power A/C unit?
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Re: Almost there....

Postby Elderberry » Sat Jul 11, 2009 8:14 pm

Sync wrote:Yeah! I got my order of Bi-directional 6" tape in from Findtape. com, and a bunch of Gorilla tape for the edges. Problem finding Tuff-R insulation though. Home Depot carries a 1" insulation board called Thermashield, foil on both sides with some kind of yellow-gray foam in the middle. Would this stuff work as well?

I'm also considering adding cheap A/C. There are some 5-6 amp 5000 btu units around that my Honda 1000 would probably be able to run. The Hexayurt will be one of the 6' stretch models. Anyone have experience trying this with a low power A/C unit?


Yes, the Tuff-R stuff works great, I think that's what we used. I'd check but the yurt is all warpped up; but we got it from HD.

Also, I can tell you from experience that your Honda 1000 won't power your A/C.

We bought a small A/C and a tester to measure Watts/Amps, etc. The A/C tested at 400 WATTS. We had a 1000 watt generator and tested it at home with the A/C for about 15 minutes and everything worked fine.

We got to the playa and after about 10 minutes the generator crapped out. I think the reason is that the generator didn't work is that the altitude wasn't figured in, plus the heat. This year we're bringing a 4000 Watt unit.

JK
JK
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http://www.mudskippercafe.com
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle.
Then I realised that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole one and asked Him to forgive me.
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Elderberry
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Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2007 10:00 pm
Location: Los Angeles
Burning Since: 2007
Camp Name: Mudskipper Cafe

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