What makes BM better than a Regional?

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What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby mshaman » Sun Feb 05, 2012 9:22 am

I'm posting this question here, without first indicating my own opinion, so see what others think. The question came up in our lively debate in the ticket forum.

So I'm asking YOU, what draws you to Burning Man, rather than just going to your regional event?
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby lemur » Sun Feb 05, 2012 9:28 am

the black rock desert.
no fuckin bugs.
no grass.
being way fuckin away from shopping malls and bullshit
being forced to have all your shit with you because shopping malls and bullshit are far away
idiots whining about no cell reception
its fuckin big
dust storms kick ass
its really hot and makes you actually have to 'work' to not die
big ass fuel splosions
its bigger than even the biggest regional could hope to be
i dont want to go to michigan (nearest big regional for midwest folks)
its far enough away so that i felt like i went somewhere
regionals tend to have crappier art
regionals have less of a bar for accepting 'mutant vehicles'
big stuff is bigger at burning man
burning man spends as much money on art grants as it probably takes to run multiple regionals..

and some other stuff
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby shykat » Sun Feb 05, 2012 9:45 am

We live outside of LA,Calif. The regionals around here are,ummmm , not so good....


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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby lemur » Sun Feb 05, 2012 9:49 am

it seems that regional events have to grow past the 'ITS A RAVE, DOOD!!' stage.. before they become awesome
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby mshaman » Sun Feb 05, 2012 10:42 am

lemur wrote:it seems that regional events have to grow past the 'ITS A RAVE, DOOD!!' stage.. before they become awesome

Heh. Agreed.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby 5280MeV » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:03 am

I will answer this in November when I have been to two burning men (2011 and 2012) and after I have "tried out" two regional burns in Georgia, one about 350 people and very new, the other around 3500 and well established (Alchemy).

One aspect of Burning Man that is important to me is the adventure of the environment itself. I did a huge amount of camping growing up, and it is pretty easy at this point. Camping, or getting anything to work, on the playa is a whole different matter. Just getting out there is an adventure.

So the adventure is lessened just by the friendly local climate. There is really nothing even resembling the playa here in the East.

The sheer scale of things is quite amazing, but in some regards it is discouraging, especially since I live so far away from Nevada, and really cannot take enough time off to drive all the way there and back. Any contribution that I make, aside from volunteering, is going to be small scale.

The small scale stuff juxtaposed against, inside, or along with the medium and large scale stuff is what makes BM better than a sculpture garden or 'professional' event of artists/musicians/etc... I feel like the frothing cacophony simmering around the giant sculptures is not getting quite the appreciation it deserves. When I went to climb up in the man on my first night, the dancing robot with built in speakers underneath the man changed the whole atmosphere.

If things go really well at the regional, I am planning to not go in 2013 and just go to BM every two to three years. I can spend a lot more effort building stuff and playing with ideas if I don't have to invest up to $1500 in tickets, ground transport, and air transport.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby oneeyeddick » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:07 am

Burning Man is our regional.

Living here has it's advantages.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby tamarakay » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:27 am

I think it was Eric who said "a regional is to Burning man what a kiddie pool is to the ocean." My apologies if it wasn't Eric and feel free to correct me if i'm wrong (hahahahahahaha).
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Elorrum » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:33 am

scale.

looks the future will have to involve better kiddie pools, and shift back away from the rave customers, towards participants and creators.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby wh..sh » Sun Feb 05, 2012 11:35 am

oneeyeddick wrote:Burning Man is our regional.

Living here has it's advantages.


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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Herring » Sun Feb 05, 2012 12:28 pm

Small scale event means small scale art, small scale music.

Still really fun, but it's like tailgating without actually going to the big game.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Elorrum » Sun Feb 05, 2012 1:26 pm

Here's something I'm going to try. When someone says, "I've always wanted to go to Burning Man." I say, "It's sold out. Why don't you go to the regional in June, I think you'd really like it." Then I put a staple in my ear, or nose, and tug on it whenever I want to make ANY comparison (outloud) between the playa and the regional. I make something to take with me and set up there, something fun, something that fits in my car because I don't have to take all the other desert things I have to take to the playa.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Thorormr » Sun Feb 05, 2012 5:07 pm

5280MeV wrote:There is really nothing even resembling the playa here in the East.


No, there isn't much in the east that would qualify. However, there is one interesting feature not far from the coast.

Image

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That's not snow . . .meet sugar sand.

I grew up in the Pine Barrens and did some hiking through there. Certain areas are lush with flowing water, others are arid, dry and nothing lives except for some scrub and pitch pines. Sand so soft you sink in it just standing there and a mythology surrounding it that has an unsettling tendency for immediacy. The ecosystem is fragile and it sits right on top of one of the east coast's largest aquifers. It used to be Lebanon State Forest, but now I see it's called Byrne, has campsites and group picnic areas. It's not an impossible prospect, though I recon less private than some would hope for.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Token » Sun Feb 05, 2012 5:38 pm

Tits

Dicks

Whatever Dustdevil decides to blow up with 8000 pounds of expired JP8 jet-fuel:

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Thunderdome

Jiffy Lube or remnants thereof

ToA on the even years

DPW angst

The fucking Scouch and Robochrist

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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby CornMan » Sun Feb 05, 2012 5:47 pm

At BRC, I like it when they burn the wooden man. That alone is better than anything you'll find at a regional.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby BoyScoutGirl » Sun Feb 05, 2012 6:34 pm

Thorormr wrote: ...Pine Barrens...


They may be remote, but:

The wetter/boggy pine barrens tend to be extremely fragile habitats, home to endangered and threatened species of both plants and animals (bog turtles, various pitcher plants, etc.). Also, a very large percentage of pine barrens have been completely wiped out for development. According to Wikipedia, some pine savannahs have less than 1% original area unaltered. I cannot imagine any reasonable land management organization, public or private, authorizing a gathering of more than a few hundred people for a week, leave no trace or not.

Especially when fire is involved. Pine barrens are tinderboxes; in fact, several species (mostly trees) cannot reproduce without a brushfire sweeping through the ecosystem every few years and as such actually produce flammable resins to encourage fire. I've camped in the Barrens in NJ and in the pine savannahs of NC and nearly every time there has been a fire ban in place. (And the chiggers and ticks were out en masse.)

I'm not trying to be discouraging, just pointing out that it's harder to find a place like the playa than many people think, which is why it's so important we continue to meet and exceed the BLM's stipulations.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Thorormr » Sun Feb 05, 2012 8:03 pm

ensimismada wrote:
Thorormr wrote: ...Pine Barrens...


They may be remote, but:

The wetter/boggy pine barrens tend to be extremely fragile habitats, home to endangered and threatened species of both plants and animals (bog turtles, various pitcher plants, etc.). Also, a very large percentage of pine barrens have been completely wiped out for development. According to Wikipedia, some pine savannahs have less than 1% original area unaltered. I cannot imagine any reasonable land management organization, public or private, authorizing a gathering of more than a few hundred people for a week, leave no trace or not.

Especially when fire is involved. Pine barrens are tinderboxes; in fact, several species (mostly trees) cannot reproduce without a brushfire sweeping through the ecosystem every few years and as such actually produce flammable resins to encourage fire. I've camped in the Barrens in NJ and in the pine savannahs of NC and nearly every time there has been a fire ban in place. (And the chiggers and ticks were out en masse.)

I'm not trying to be discouraging, just pointing out that it's harder to find a place like the playa than many people think, which is why it's so important we continue to meet and exceed the BLM's stipulations.


You are absolutely correct.

This is why I suggested an already existing area designated for recreational use, if the Pines were to be used. Certainly such an area (State managed site) would be outgrown very quickly and at most you would only be able to host a hundred or so. With a burn ban in place, artists can brainstorm other ways to generate the catharsis of catastrophe, replacing fire.

I also wholeheartedly agree you always want to leave your local BLM (or land owner, agent or otherwise) with a positive experience. Coming from the SCA as I do and having authored an event going on it's sixteenth (I think . . .I left that group after the third) consecutive year, the owners of the private campground always had smiles when it came time to negotiate the next one. That is until it outgrew the site and moved to the fairgrounds. I haven't seen them in years, but I know largish events still happen out there, and I think they still have the ultralight landing strip, the driveway is still shared by a volunteer fire company (that loves any excuse to play with the trucks) and an elementary school (inspire the next generation). Just another possibility for a local event site.

We can also grow an already existing regional event, the site Frostburn is held on will easily support 10k. Since CLCG is already accustomed to hosting 10k (SCA Pennsic) and BM type events, it should be a doable process. The further areas of the grounds are remote enough even for the naturists. I would be doing Frostburn this year, but I didn't find out it existed (and that it was held on a site I already knew :shock: ) until it was too late to get vacation days approved.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby BoyScoutGirl » Sun Feb 05, 2012 10:58 pm

You have a very good point about designated recreation areas. Sometimes I forget that there are government- and privately managed areas for 4x4s, off-roading, and other intense use, so why not also large, camping-based event spaces?

I'd completely forgotten about events like Pennsic, probably because I always associated SCA events with the fairgrounds, like you mention. Then there are events like Electric Forest, etc., that support similar infrastructures. Where there's a will, there's a way, I suppose. The very existence of the regionals is proof enough.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Token » Mon Feb 06, 2012 6:12 am

Sturgis Ralley breaks half million regularly. Makes our pidly little fiesta blush.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Ugly Dougly » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:15 am

You can tell your geek friends you've been to Burning Man, and because it's been all over Rolling Stone, Penthouse and the freaking evening news, they'll know what you're talking about, be suitably impressed, and you will acquire status in your pimply-faced clique.

Better still, to organize an event that can't even be classified as a "festival", come back and tell your friends that it's something they've never heard of and probably wouldn't understand.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby gyre » Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:47 pm

Most regionals are short, aren't they?

Too many non-burners.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Ugly Dougly » Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:52 pm

= :mrgreen:
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby CornMan » Mon Feb 06, 2012 1:57 pm

gyre wrote:Most regionals are short, aren't they?


That's my biggest beef with regionals. We're all packing up when we should finally get to relax.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Ugly Dougly » Mon Feb 06, 2012 2:45 pm

So stick around. Burning Man started as a weekend event.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby lucky420 » Mon Feb 06, 2012 3:45 pm

oneeyeddick wrote:
Burning Man is our regional.

Living here has it's advantages.


+ a zillion
Oh my god, it's HUGE!
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby stinkyfoot » Tue Feb 07, 2012 6:01 pm

Definitely agree that it's the extreme conditions of the playa that make Burning Man awesome. It really feels like you're on another planet out there.

That said, who isn't there a regional in Death Valley? Maybe the scary name? It's not too bad the first half of the year. And the place looks amazing, especially in the colder months when there are storm clouds over the mountains. I always want to stop and chill there whenever I drive through it.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby theCryptofishist » Wed Feb 08, 2012 12:25 pm

Maybe NPS land is harder to make the sort of arrangements that we've made with the BLM.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Ugly Dougly » Wed Feb 08, 2012 12:28 pm

Keep jiggling around Stinky. We're all jiggling around looking for alternative sites. :)
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby trilobyte » Wed Feb 08, 2012 12:35 pm

I think Burning Man and regionals both have a lot of merit. One of these years if the finances ever work out, my girlfriend and I would love to go forth and participate in other regional groups' events around the world.
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Re: What makes BM better than a Regional?

Postby Ugly Dougly » Thu Feb 09, 2012 10:22 am

If an event is international, is it a "regional" anymore? :D

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