SFNathan wrote:hmm... this is starting to sound interesting.
Maybe I can talk my village into having an interactive fire sculpture where people can place their flags on the burning sculpture with a message of what they want America to let go of (it could be sort of like the Temple burn). Like a flag tied with the message of why as a gay man I can't marry my partner, and this is something I personally dream of America changing (like creating REAL freedom and equality for all of us who don't have the same rights in America as the majority), or any other wish you have for America tied to an American flag, and burn it up.
It could be solemn, respectful (as the temple is), and controversial at the same time because it looks at the taboo of flag burning and challenges it with our dreams as Americans.
Toolmaker wrote:... Indeed.. also be wary of other burners. The event is a rather broad cross section of people all over the country...
Valkyrie wrote:...It's illegal to put stuff on it (merchandise?!)...
spectabillis wrote:Toolmaker wrote:... Indeed.. also be wary of other burners. The event is a rather broad cross section of people all over the country...
of course, because being able to walk away or just ignore it is far less important than pushing an opinion on others.
although I have several criticisms of that flag, though. Mostly in the distribution of logos... (Divestiture? what's divestiture - you'd best combine that AT&T and Bell logo now!)
SFNathan wrote: I think you are incorrect that burning a flag cannot be an artistic statement - depending on how the flag is burned.
Valkyrie wrote:Yeah. Sometimes I think that a lot of folks who are bitter about the political state of affairs right now have lost influence over because they have lost the ability to dream. I hear so much talk about the "American" part of the theme, but almost no discussion on the second part. Y'know, the American Dream.
however, if the dream part is supposed to be the important part, why attach the word 'american' to it? i believe they're trying to get us to focus on a specific kind of dream.
Simon of the Playa wrote:oh sure, piss off the creationistas AND the PetaPeople all at the same time...
Valkyrie wrote:Oh, it's grammatically OK. ...
SFNathan wrote:Itâ€™s curious that you profess to have great respect for the principles of the Constitution, but are willing to completely disregard those principles by saying someone deserves to have their face beaten in for exercising speech.
The court rejected "the view that an apparently limitless variety of conduct can be labeled 'speech' whenever the person engaging in the conduct intends thereby to express an idea", but acknowledged that conduct may be "sufficiently imbued with elements of communication to fall within the scope of the First and Fourteenth Amendments". In deciding whether particular conduct possesses sufficient communicative elements to bring the First Amendment into play, the court asked whether "an intent to convey a particularized message was present, and [whether] the likelihood was great that the message would be understood by those who viewed it."
The court found that, "Under the circumstances, Johnson's burning of the flag constituted expressive conduct, permitting him to invoke the First Amendment... Occurring as it did at the end of a demonstration coinciding with the Republican National Convention, the expressive, overtly political nature of the conduct was both intentional and overwhelmingly apparent." The court concluded that, while "the government generally has a freer hand in restricting expressive conduct than it has in restricting the written or spoken word," it may not "proscribe particular conduct because it has expressive elements."
CapSmashy wrote:A pop in the jaw is simple assault/disorderly conduct. Ticket and a minor fine in 90% of the cases. Unless you're drunk. Then they can tag on public intox and take you in for the night.
To kick it up to felony level, you'd have to introduce a level of physical savagery consisting of multiple, purposeful blows or introduce a weapon into the mix.
And speaking for myself going on Teo's words, a pop in the jaw is every bit as communicative as burning a flag. Neither will do anything to advance a message in a positive manner.
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