[Nickel]

http://mag1.olivesoftware.com/ActiveMagazine/welcome/BSN/BSN-2007-07d3 e4r5.asp

Check out Page 17 for the ad:

Ad Text: "Here's the value proposition: 40,000 of the smartest most socially networked content-generationg people on the planet, whose tolerance for B.S. is negative point-five, all checking out your product."

Also, read the article on Page 66.

What are everyone thoughts on this? Is it ruining the event? Is it a good thing? Is this the end of BM, or a new beginning?

* I edited out my thoughts to make this a more productive discussion.
_________________
"This is not about love, because I am not in love"

The Booby Bar 2009, a part of Terminal City:
http://www.apokiliptika.com/terminal_city_2009_index.htm

[Fat SAM]

This is one of the most disheartening things I've ever read about Burning Man. I'm actually having second thoughts....I think everyone should take a look at this article. If ever there was a year to choose to go wild at a theme camp, this is it. Talk about going into the temple and turning over the tables of the money changers...What could happen to me? Lawsuits? I don't have anything they could take from me. The article says that Burning Man is going to kill itself to save the world. Cute. That's real cute. I don't like it.

What the hell is the pavilion that the article keeps mentioning? It's not going to be a trade show, but it's there is going to be a pavilion where unbranded products are going to be shown by unbranded reps. Bullshit. The whispers will be heard from across the playa.

Wow. What a sinking feeling I have.
_________________
Thanks to Addis, I had more free time.

[Fat SAM]

I just went back and saw the ad...I didn't even notice it and just went straight to the article. We all just got sold...
_________________
Thanks to Addis, I had more free time.

[Nickel]

[Fat SAM]

Consider it signed. I don't know what kind of a difference it's going to make though. The article and everyone involved already acknowledges how burners ("that's what Burning Man participants call themselves") feel about commercialism.

If I go...and if this persists...this is my last year. Time to start my own party.
_________________
Thanks to Addis, I had more free time.

[bmix]

From the article:
"That's a very interesting potential for companies that see a value in Burning Man culture."

From Marian Goodell:
"The business model can totally function without Larry Harvey."

Finally, from The Hat himself:
"Make your customers feel like owners."


Whether this is good or bad can and will be debated. All I know is that after reading the entire article, I feel very similar to how I felt when someone told me one of my friends had throat cancer.

[bmix]

Oh, yeah... petitions, protests, civil disobedience? Sign me up, all of the above. Somebody made a cannon that fires pants, for crying out loud. I think we can pretty much pull off anything we want.

[Nickel]

[Bay Bridge Sue]

Except... not go. If you were that pissed about it you'd blow off BRC and start your OWN event. NOT buy a ticket, NOT be on this board, NOT feed the behemoth, and NOT be a sheep.

Because... if enough people don't like it, and don't go, then it will cease to be such a potential lucrative property. People vote with their feet, and the corporation and the advertisers both see it that way. Start your own gig. Why the fuck not? If they can do it, you can. Or can you? Got guts?

I would bet, however, that the population will continue to increase. People want to be there, they want to go be a "burner". Be in the flock of sheep that stand out, like all the other sheep. Naw... this thing'll never die. Would you, could you say "fuck it", and never go again? Thought not...

As to the org? It's their event, their corporation, their gig, they own it. It's NOT yours. If they want to sell it (and you) down the river, it's their right. Right? Right. And just wait until the regionals kick in - why only have one burning man to sell when you can have hundreds, all sporting your logo, all paying you royalties, all sucking the $$$ from the sheep and the advertisers and sponsors. I can see in a decade *everyone* will be (or want to be) a "burner"... then what? It's a sound business move by the llc.

My only regret - my ONLY regret - is I didn't get in on the ground floor all those years ago. No shit. I woulda jumped at the chance. Still would. And ya know what? I'd be backing what they're doing right now, as it benefits the business, and my bottom line. I hope to god someday they go public - I wanna get on the ground floor of that one. You betcha!

So... shaddup and buy yer fucking ticket and quit yer bitchin... and we'll see ya out there!

bb

[Nickel]

[Dork]

I'll still go this year, but my initial reaction to reading the article is to just bag it all and go find a new hobby. I didn't like the "Current TV" stuff, or them pushing reverend Billy down our throats, or that reality show, or any of the other similar tie-ins. Now I get the impression those were just test runs - they've built up a lot of brand loyalty and now they're preparing to spend it.

10,000 of us could revolt and stop going, it wouldn't affect them. In a way it would make things easier - those left behind would be the ones most willing to put up with a little advertising here and there.

Anyone up for organizing some picketing of the pavilion? I'm not up for that end of things, but can provide materials and time. It would be great to submit some protests to the who/what/where and see what happens.

[Das Bus]

The original explanation of the 'pavillion' on the BM site, was horrendous. I had posted the link to it, with a response like "WTF???", or something. But then the Project reworded the page, and it sounded much easier to swallow.

This 2.0 article has some things that sound good; like the company that will be donating all those solar panels to Gerlach. Other things, not so good.

What I have always objected to, is people thinking that this whole thing is done out of the 'goodness' of the Org's heart. It's been about profit for many years, and it has to be. It's not like Bill Gates is throwing us 10 million dollars to have a party. There ARE people who are working 24/7 to pull this thing off, for profit. However, without all the volunteers, the Burning Man we know and love, couldn't happen.

I'm very curious to see how this will all be set up. I hope to see some really cool art from this <ahem> "Green" technology. Although, if the ultimate goal is to 'market' their products to ME, well, their S.O.L.. It's not like I can afford any of their crap. I'm still trying to scrape up the funds for tickets. : P
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Medicated and Motivated!

[gyre]

So, Nickel, how did you see this article?
Don't tell us you engage in commerce off the playa?!

[jaycerochester]

My first thought was to boycott any company that spoke its name.

But then I thought that's not enough. I'd like to know what companies will be there and become "representatives" of them. I'm sure [insert big corporation here] would love to have a photograph of one of their "representatives" passing the bowl.

If they bring their logos and brands, well, let's have fun with them!

...

After having read the article, I'm not as concerned. People may come, but in Black Rock City, a corporation is not a person. In a legal sense -- given the "corporate personhood" shit we have in this country, Google didn't buy a ticket so Google can't come. People who work for Google can, though.

The idea of a pavilion seems really dumb. I "showcased" a Savonius rotor windmill -- and I could say it was for the benefit of my company [self-employed] -- but it was simply part of an art project. If corporations would like to get involved with artists and supply the products that make the event run, fine. Don't just sit there behind a table with no name on it in a tent somewhere and expect anybody to give a shit.
_________________
Fuck you, I love you,
---Jason

[Fat SAM]

I don't have a ticket yet. I've been throwing my own tiny events for years. I'm not one of the beautiful people at Burning Man. I'm not an artist, I don't own a gallery, don't know how to weld, don't own a successful internet startup. Hell, I didn't even know I was supposed to be out there 'networking.' Wish I had. I'd probably be less broke.

There's a lot about Burning Man I really like. I love the ineracting with the people I meet out there. I'm definitely not part of the leet, though. Most of the people I meet there wouldn't recognize me in the city and probably wouldn't piss me two squirts if I was on fire. It's kind of the Breakfast Club phenomenon, you know? We're cool in the library, but don't be offended if I don't talk to you when we get back to school. It's not true of everybody, for sure. I've met some truly open people who are cool on and off the playa. More and more, though, I'm finding that if you don't have the right look or the money to go to all the right places, you don't get accepted in the 'arts community'.

So do I have the guts to quit going? You bet. Shit. If the goal is to network out there, I don't even have a reason for going. Or maybe I do...maybe I'll go this year and just network. Pass out samples of my photography, wear a suit and tie all week, and sell my product. There's quite a receptive market there, from what I understand. I can use what Burning Man has to offer and then never go again. I've got schoolwork to do and authenticity to seek.

I'm a world class disruptor, too. Even in a place like BRC. If I do go, you'll probably find me at the pavillion. I'll be the guy with the bullhorn passing out copies of that lovely ad on page 17.
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Thanks to Addis, I had more free time.

[MikeVDS]

I don't see the big deal with the article. I've thought the same thing myself. It really is a good test run for new ideas. I love the doom and gloom mentality that if anyone brings something new and innovative to the playa it'd be horrible if they ever tried to make a living and feed their families with that idea. If people bring junk, there will be some heckling and annoyance thrown toward someones ideas. If the ideas are cool, then people are bringing more to the community. I personally love that the playa mentality spills over into the default world. It is we who are spreading, not they who are invading.

[meatball]

Money talks and as for the the make you own show thats a cop out jmo
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i push teh button

aka Muppet

[Archantael]

[Bay Bridge Sue]

Actually... I'd love to do a Black Rock Cycle and Mutant Vehicle Repair out there. I couldn't do it on the freebie at the extent I'd like to, but yeah... I could really get into a commercial aspect of this. Hire some mechanics, take everyone out there, set up a full LNT-worthy environmentally friendly professional workshop. Hell, contract out to the llc to work on all those fucked up carts, do the annual service on their fucked up vehicles, take some pressure off of DPW. Have a tow rig (I'm actually thinking of building this out anyway) to drag the dead mutants to the shop or back to their camp.

Then... I could take the money I made on this, invest it, and do something *really* kewl like run a subsidy investment account to finance something like a hotwheelz camp auxiliary. Like Espresso does but more to help people. Need a controller for your adapted art car? Blam - it's covered, brand new out of the box. Bad battery? Bam, replaced. THAT would be the best part of commodification out there.

Oh yeah... we'd also get paid to be there. Just like the big boys.
_________________
All is fine... for ought-nine.

We Condemn... You Confess!
ТЭЯМІИДL CITУ

Vote OUR Mitt in '08

[Miss Coolette]

Hello

I'm from the Antenna Group and this will be my 3rd burn. My boss, Melody Haller, is a wonderful woman. I think you all should save your judgments for August and the playa.

Burning man has always been controversial and always will be. Maybe this is a good way to shake people up a bit.

AND don't be mistaken - BM would never ever allow corporate branding on the playa. That is NOT what is going to happen.

Instead, think of it as environmental technology education. We're a PR firm dedicated to eco tech and Burning Man. We are simply bringing some fascinating and wonderful technology to the playa for education purposes. We're facilitating a conversation between companies trying to make a difference and thousands of people who are really good at participating.

There are a lot of things that go on out there, dirty evil things and I've seen them. There is also a TON of love and positivity as well. I think we should wait and see how the companies choose to represent their technologies before we say this is wrong and how dare you. Burning Man has always thrived on controversy and being radical. Think of this as the next step in that direction. And do some research to find out the real story.

My 2 cents.

Miss Coolette
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:::burn baby, burn:::

[MikeVDS]

[Bay Bridge Sue]

It's beyond controversy, it's commodification. THAT's the problem.
_________________
All is fine... for ought-nine.

We Condemn... You Confess!
ТЭЯМІИДL CITУ

Vote OUR Mitt in '08

[AntiM]

I'm going, I'm going to have a good time as usual, and I can ignore the pavilion if I care to. Heck, it might even be as benign as proposed. Don't know until I hit the dust.

Does a magazine article rankle or amuse? I went with rankle, then realized amused is a far stronger weapon.

They cannot sell us what we will not buy, no matter how hard they try. We're burners damn it, we can do anything. Or refuse to do anything, as the case may be.

Therefore, in the interest of my health and sanity, I ain't sweatin' it. Naive? Perhaps. But the event is ever changing, you have to take it for what it is or move on and DIY. I have got to find my copy of The Peter Principle.

It was better next year.

[Dork]

[bmix]

[Bay Bridge Sue]

Damn...

Iknow what'll make me feel better...

I think I'll build a figure out of some old lumber I have lying around, tie it to the top of my truck, haul it out to Baker beach and burn it! A little late for the equinox, but no biggie.

Good way to blow off some steam. Wanna come along?

bb
_________________
All is fine... for ought-nine.

We Condemn... You Confess!
ТЭЯМІИДL CITУ

Vote OUR Mitt in '08

[EB]

I think this new relationship between the BORG and Corporate America is a result of a schism in the heart of the LLC itself. From all accounts, the event was started as a piece of art being burnt on Baker Beach. The act touched a lot of people in ways that simple, public acts of defiance (Burning the 'man') always touch people: It made them realize they were not alone.

Larry and the LLC capitalized on this notion, that, within our ever-so commodifying culture there was those of us who wanted a place - a sanctuary - to call our own. Brigham Young did the same thing a hundred years earlier. Earlier still, Moses. He staked out a place to "call our own" and put out a shingle and people came.

But somewhere along the line, Burning Man became less about a "dusty, well-lighted place" for like-minded folks to hang out for a week (and shoot guns, at least at first) and became more about being a "beacon" for the rest of society. The LLC took a look around and saw its volunteer army creating something that HAD VALUE in the corporate world. It's "non-commodifying" ethos, has, in a sense, become it's biggest commodity. My buddy who worked at the LA uber-ad agency Chiat Day remembers the creatives spitballing a Nissan commercial, saying it needed to be more "Burning Man."

And thus, the LLC has turned itself into the thing it sought to take us away from.

To them, it makes perfect sense. If you want to eventually be the "beacon" you're going to have to, at some point, appeal to the big money. Even hearing the theme announced this year, I had a pit in my stomach - The Green Man. Uh, oh. What happened to the apolitical Under The Sea? Or the Seven Ages of Man? Or the one that nobody understood about religion? Suddenly, this year's BM theme plugs right in to what's "cool" in corporate america. The upside of being associated with the "coolest" counter-culture event on the planet was too much.

I wonder if the event's theme was "Donkey Fucking" there would be as many corporations lining up to showcase their wares. (Tijuana Chamber of Commerce the lone exception.)

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for doing the right thing and making the world a better place and for solar power and whales. I've bought my ticket and will take the ride. But saving the world takes trade-offs and the BORG has just tipped the first (?) domino...
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Irony. You're soaking in it.

[Ron]

Many thanks for the link to the article. I had a vague idea of what was going on this year but the details are good. For myself I'll keep an open mind until I get on playa and make an opinion then. Right now I'm luke warm at best. One of the things I've most appreciated about the burn is the absence of corporate messages and knowing that just about everyone who shows up and works is doing so because they want to, rather than because they're being paid to. I'll reserve my final opinion until I see how it all works out but I do have some significant reservations.

Ron

[MikeVDS]

[Bay Bridge Sue]