Senseless roping off of unused acres of prime camp spots...

[Driver_SD]

So with all the ticket mayhem going on, a bigger concern of mine seems to be going completely un addressed. Last year, I showed up at 4:30 am on Tuesday morning. We timed things well so we only spent about 15 minutes in line.
However, the major drawback turned out to be a matter of finding camping space. It wasn't that it was already full. It was more a matter of acres and acres of playa roped off and blocked off, but with nobody camped in there. We ended up having to camp all the way back on 8th and I. We were 1 vehicle and 1 tent and we had to go that far back and we still had to squat on someones roped off area. This is another one of those self regulated things that needs to be addressed.
I would like to hear ideas on how we can discourage this sort of thing. The part that really bothered me was that a lot of that space never got filled with cars, campers, tents or even common area items. They were simply just roped off and empty. Aside from the obvious early entry pass or getting to the gate as early as possible, what are possible solutions to this problem?

[ygmir]

So with all the ticket mayhem going on, a bigger concern of mine seems to be going completely un addressed. Last year, I showed up at 4:30 am on Tuesday morning. We timed things well so we only spent about 15 minutes in line.
However, the major drawback turned out to be a matter of finding camping space. It wasn't that it was already full. It was more a matter of acres and acres of playa roped off and blocked off, but with nobody camped in there. We ended up having to camp all the way back on 8th and I. We were 1 vehicle and 1 tent and we had to go that far back and we still had to squat on someones roped off area. This is another one of those self regulated things that needs to be addressed.
I would like to hear ideas on how we can discourage this sort of thing. The part that really bothered me was that a lot of that space never got filled with cars, campers, tents or even common area items. They were simply just roped off and empty. Aside from the obvious early entry pass or getting to the gate as early as possible, what are possible solutions to this problem?

you may have encountered a few issues:
Place camps, and their areas, are delineated by flags, usually. But, often when the first residents arrive, the rope the area off, for better visibility to folks looking for a spot.

Also, some folks "land grab" and, do it that way.
You can often tell if that is the case, by looking for flags at the corners of said lot. Small plastic ones on wire sticks.
If they are not there, you can ask, them, or find a "placement person" and ask.
Although, sometimes it makes for harsh neighbors, if you disrupt their "land grab".

Also, I might wonder how thorough your search was?
I know, near us, there were open spots and folks showing up as late as Wed. or so. We were in "the middle" around C and D. Don't forget to cruise the side streets.

and, some areas are/were cordoned off, for a placed camp, and sometimes, said camp does not materialize.

your quickest and most official answer source, is to find "placement" personnel and ask.
But, understand they are usually quite busy, running around, so be brief, and to the point. Polite really helps, too.

[Dr Helix]

So with all the ticket mayhem going on, a bigger concern of mine seems to be going completely un addressed. Last year, I showed up at 4:30 am on Tuesday morning. We timed things well so we only spent about 15 minutes in line.
However, the major drawback turned out to be a matter of finding camping space. It wasn't that it was already full. It was more a matter of acres and acres of playa roped off and blocked off, but with nobody camped in there. We ended up having to camp all the way back on 8th and I. We were 1 vehicle and 1 tent and we had to go that far back and we still had to squat on someones roped off area. This is another one of those self regulated things that needs to be addressed.
I would like to hear ideas on how we can discourage this sort of thing. The part that really bothered me was that a lot of that space never got filled with cars, campers, tents or even common area items. They were simply just roped off and empty. Aside from the obvious early entry pass or getting to the gate as early as possible, what are possible solutions to this problem?

Take it down. You are not allowed to "save" space. If no one is there you have every right to take it. I know it's tough sometimes, as you might catch some hell over that but if it gets feisty, go get some rangers to help you mediate. The only space that can be saved is in authorized theme camps and they are staked out well in advance by the placers. Open camping is what it says. Good luck

[lemur]

REGISTERED THEME CAMP RESERVED CAMPING
Once the event begins at midnight between Sunday night and Monday morning, there are no spaces reserved on the playa.

(edit: this policy includes the theme camp areas... and is specifically referring to these theme camp areas)

for reals. this is the truth straight from the good book.

(good luck trying to convince some idiot about this,...)


discuss it with people.. thats the only way, tell em the way it is 'there is no reserved space once the gates open' then if they dont have a real good reason to hog up so much space, and if its real important to you.. find a ranger/placement person to mediate the situation if you want that spot bad enough and things is getting freaky......... or, camp out in the boonies..

[Ugly Dougly]

Welcome to the Big City.

[Savannah]

Ranger stations are usually at 9:00 and C, 3:00 & C across the street from the Medical stations, and @ Center Camp. They also rove . . . look for khaki clad folks with radios & boonie hats (and often kilts). Rangers are skilled at mediating and usually know that space is not supposed to be reserved once Gates open. I say "usually" because a camp tried to uproot my campmate & I in 2008, several hours past Gates opening, and the Ranger did not actually tell them outright that they couldn't make us pull up stakes and leave. But he urged them to be tolerant, and eventually they relented.

(We were far enough away from the Camp to have made an honest mistake on the unmarked land--but their "hold" had expired anyway.)

[stinkyfoot]

Because if you provide a free space, some people will always assume that that means that they are free to take from others. If there's nothing stopping you from wearing a tutu and prancing around singing show tunes, there's also nothing stopping anyone else from blocking off common spaces for 'private' events, or campsites that might materialize or anything else they feel entitled to.

Ironically, the highly trafficked spaces are always filled with antisocial dickwads. They like to surround themselves with other people so that they don't have to confront the fact that they're not fit to be around people.

[knowmad]

Think this is bad you aught to have seen the land grabs in the Dakotas back in '62 (1862).

[Bob]

[hotmess]

I find it best to get out and speak to your neighbors. Especially if you don't have tons of gear and need tons of space. If they cop an attitude right of the bat that is a good sign that you don't want them to be your neighbors.

[Herring]

Ironically, the highly trafficked spaces are always filled with antisocial dickwads. They like to surround themselves with other people so that they don't have to confront the fact that they're not fit to be around people.

It's like when you go see a band you love, arrive early to get up near the stage so you can dance and mosh and sing along and then there's a tall dude right in front of you just standing there with his arms crossed, not even bobbing his head to the music. Seriously, why fight your way to the front if you aren't even enjoying yourself?

[lemur]

Seriously, why fight your way to the front if you aren't even enjoying yourself?

YEAH!!!

cuz the only way to enjoy yourself is by moshing, dancing and/or bobbing your head!!

[Bob]

Camping is like doing the Temple burn & such... arms & tents akimbo, or you get some hippie sucking on your hydration appliance.

[ygmir]

Ironically, the highly trafficked spaces are always filled with antisocial dickwads. They like to surround themselves with other people so that they don't have to confront the fact that they're not fit to be around people.

It's like when you go see a band you love, arrive early to get up near the stage so you can dance and mosh and sing along and then there's a tall dude right in front of you just standing there with his arms crossed, not even bobbing his head to the music. Seriously, why fight your way to the front if you aren't even enjoying yourself?

how can you judge if "he" is enjoying himself, merely based on bobing his head, dancing or singing......some people are stoic (me) and don't do any of that, but still love the heck out of it.

[lemur]

Ironically, the highly trafficked spaces are always filled with antisocial dickwads. They like to surround themselves with other people so that they don't have to confront the fact that they're not fit to be around people.

It's like when you go see a band you love, arrive early to get up near the stage so you can dance and mosh and sing along and then there's a tall dude right in front of you just standing there with his arms crossed, not even bobbing his head to the music. Seriously, why fight your way to the front if you aren't even enjoying yourself?

how can you judge if "he" is enjoying himself, merely based on bobing his head, dancing or singing......some people are stoic (me) and don't do any of that, but still love the heck out of it.

STOP HOGGING UP ALL THE SPACE FOR THOSE WHO WANT TO ENJOY THEMSELVES YGMIR!!!

[BBadger]

Are you also the kind of person who allows people to reserve entire rows in prime sections of movie theaters for themselves? Move that shit off, and if they complain, they can go to hell. I remember some dumbshits at a movie theater tried to reserve whole rows, and some people moved their stuff because the theater was nearly full, they got pissed and tried to push the latter out. Guess what happened? Those fools (the reservers) got kicked out. OWNED BITCH.

Anyway, if people are going to reserve space they need to learn that they need to do a better job of preventing "squatters" from filling in the gaps. That means placing cars, tents, etc. in specific locations of the reserved area, not just putting up some rebar and flags. The latter shit doesn't cut it. Worse, some people who reserve spaces put up rebar poles, and the flags/ropes fall off leaving a huge safety hazard.

In the end, our camp reserved quite a bit of space for people who would be arriving later in the week; however, this was out in the Indignation ring, so people really didn't care. Some people still managed to camp pretty close to the "reserved" area, but we over-reserved so it didn't matter. Hell, if you're a late-arriving camp mate you're going to be stuck with whatever dregs are left; we did our part.

[ygmir]

It's like when you go see a band you love, arrive early to get up near the stage so you can dance and mosh and sing along and then there's a tall dude right in front of you just standing there with his arms crossed, not even bobbing his head to the music. Seriously, why fight your way to the front if you aren't even enjoying yourself?

how can you judge if "he" is enjoying himself, merely based on bobing his head, dancing or singing......some people are stoic (me) and don't do any of that, but still love the heck out of it.

STOP HOGGING UP ALL THE SPACE FOR THOSE WHO WANT TO ENJOY THEMSELVES YGMIR!!!

luckily, I'm a demure man, and don't take up much space.

[theCryptofishist]

Not much floor space... There is that low celing thing to consider, depending on venue.

[laffingblonde]

Just smile and be nice. We got yelled at a half dozen times our first trip until we finally told someone we drove from New York and we were staying there. He relented. Lots of people reserve ridiculous amounts of space for packs of rvs that don't show up until Thursday and proceed to be loud, obnoxious and inconsiderate. F the haters. Just look for some cool people and talk it out. We're all there to have a good time. You probably would rather be a ways back than next to people who don't get it anyhow.