OCCUPYWALLSTREET REINFORCEMENTS!

[ygmir]

I agree the gov. has culpability in this........."they" (was it Clinton?) did do something, to make home loans easier........by way of some sort of easing of loan restrictions or some such......I can't remember the details, but, it amounted (IIRC) to directing loan agents to accept people for home loans, who could barely, if at all, afford to re-pay.

[Simon of the Playa]

as long as their location services are on they should be easy to find then.

[Simon of the Playa]

YGMIR, I LOVE YOU, BUT YOUR ARGUMENT IS FULL OF HORSE CRAP.





LISTEN!

[ygmir]

awe dang........I hate being full of crap........*finding senna tea*.
I am, as always, open to information, and, changing mind related to acceptance of same.

[Roberto Dobbisano]

Revelation 18

1And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory.

2And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.

3For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.

4And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

5For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.

6Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double.

7How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow.

8Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.

9And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,

10Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come.

11And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more:

12The merchandise of gold, and silver, and precious stones, and of pearls, and fine linen, and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyine wood, and all manner vessels of ivory, and all manner vessels of most precious wood, and of brass, and iron, and marble,

13And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men.

14And the fruits that thy soul lusted after are departed from thee, and all things which were dainty and goodly are departed from thee, and thou shalt find them no more at all.

15The merchants of these things, which were made rich by her, shall stand afar off for the fear of her torment, weeping and wailing,

16And saying, Alas, alas that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls!

17For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off,

18And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What city is like unto this great city!

19And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate.

20Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her.

21And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.

22And the voice of harpers, and musicians, and of pipers, and trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no craftsman, of whatsoever craft he be, shall be found any more in thee; and the sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee;

23And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.

24And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

[ygmir]

very interesting Vid, Simon.
I wonder, how, to identify "bankers"? Parameters? Groups?

[Simon of the Playa]

oh, they're easy to smell...

[ygmir]

but father, why do they want our blood?

because, son, they have our possessions, and feel they own us.

Why did they take our possessions, father?

because we had no more money.

Did they take our money?

yes, we gave it to them, for our possessions.

What is money, father?

It's the expression, of our might, and main, used so we might enjoy the fruits of our labors, and those of others.

Why, father, don't we just trade stuff, and help others, so they might help us?

Because, son, the "Bankerment" does not like that.

Why?

They can not exact their tribute, son, if we don't use money.

How is that?

because, with money, there is, or can be, a record. With that, they can demand tribute, for the privilege of trading things amongst ourselves.

Why, do they want tribute?

They say, to help "us", to provide what we need.

Is it so? Do they do that?

no, it seems not, or at least, not to the extend promised.

I'm still hungry, father, we are all still hungry.

Tell your mother.

Mother?

quiet dear, chew on this straw.........

[World Power Foundation]

We demand an end to regulations. Look at how many jobs were created by the wall street bailouts and the BP oil spill.

We demand higher taxes for the jobless and those welfare queens. It will encourage them to stop smoking crack and start looking for jobs.

We will continue to hold out until we can craft some more demands.

[World Power Foundation]

Yes! We want to buy votes as well. The USA is a capitalist government, and the reason it isn't working is that there isn't a truly efficient system for buying influence among lawmakers.

[Simon of the Playa]

Of this you can be sure: the New York Police Department (NYPD), Mayor Bloomberg (who made his fortune on Wall Street), the FBI, the Department of Homeland Security and the White House are doing everything possible to keep the occupation of Wall Street from reaching an "Arab Spring" tipping point.

Populist uprisings are lauded overseas, but they are perceived as a threat to elite corporate governance in the US.

You can be sure that the governmental and law enforcement forces at the highest levels in the US are consulting with Mayor Bloomberg and the NYPD on how to keep the Wall Street protest from bursting into a national movement.

If history is any guide, contingencies include infiltrators into the protest movement who will try to entrap supporters of Occupy Wall Street. This is such a common police and FBI tactic that it would take too long to list examples, but you might start with the compelling documentary, "Better This World." It details how an FBI "informant" entrapped two young idealists from Texas into becoming prosecution targets, thus helping to portray all protesters at the 2008 Republican Convention in Minneapolis as being "radicals."

The corporate mass media that has virtually ignored the protests in lower Manhattan - although the same media will give endless coverage to a couple of Tea Party advocates with misspelled signs blathering on a street corner - will blare sensational headlines if the protesters are perceived as committing even one act of violence, such as throwing a brick through a window.

But imagine if an NYPD or FBI informant, acting as an infiltrator, bombs a Bank of America branch office at night. The entire movement to expose corporate America as legal thieves would be discredited.

Right now, the NYPD - and the FBI - are engaged in low intensity corralling of the protesters. They are playing a waiting game, hoping that the protest will exhaust itself.

But if the participants grow - as appears to be the case with the increasing support of unions and the enhanced credibility of the movement - watch for a law enforcement "false flag" operation.

You'll know about it instantly, because it will probably be the first time you'll see any serious interest in the Wall Street protests on TV. The revolution won't be televised; but the government takedown of democracy and peaceful assembly will be.

[Ugly Dougly]

I agree the gov. has culpability in this........."they" (was it Clinton?) did do something, to make home loans easier........by way of some sort of easing of loan restrictions or some such......I can't remember the details, but, it amounted (IIRC) to directing loan agents to accept people for home loans, who could barely, if at all, afford to re-pay.

Why do you assume it was Clinton?

[H.G.Crosby]

because she is a convenient diversion and lightning rod instead of pursuing the issue at hand and dealing with it in a logical manner.


go have some more tea, party-ers...

[Eric]

When the majority of posts on a thread are socks, it's starting to look like a highjacking of the topic. Passion is one thing, sock puppet theater is another...

[ygmir]

I agree the gov. has culpability in this........."they" (was it Clinton?) did do something, to make home loans easier........by way of some sort of easing of loan restrictions or some such......I can't remember the details, but, it amounted (IIRC) to directing loan agents to accept people for home loans, who could barely, if at all, afford to re-pay.

Why do you assume it was Clinton?

I was going off the below:

Thank you Hillary Clinton!! for forcing the United States to make it possible for people with minimal to zero income and no downpayment to be able to walk into a bank and get a home loan. Guess what. No money to pay the loan = fuck the bank. The bank is in financial trouble because they have a shit pot of these loans to eat. Over speculative home builders build too many houses they can't sell. Banks with no money = no money to support businesses. Businesses stop buying capital equipment. Manufacturers with no sales lay off employees. Unemployment skyrockets. No jobs = no money to put into banks means no investor confidence and the economy goes down the toilet.

Don't bitch about Wall Street. Thank your Government.

and, do sort of remember something like that.

I agree, looking back to place blame is futile.
and, dealing with what is at hand, paramount.

just an observation.

[Ugly Dougly]

Heck, we're all socks here.

Ygmir, I thought yoiu were talking about President Clinton.
Maybe it was Bush. Okay, which Bush?
Or does it really matter which side we blame?

[davink]

I think the Guy Fawkes masks are silly. He was only one of 13 conspirators, today the individual most associated with the failed Gunpowder Plot of 1605.

I started stirring the pot on the Occupy FB pages yesterday and people are flaming me as being the enemy, because I refuse to call myself one of the 99% and refuse to be a sheep. 100k people being led by Adbusters, a Vancouver based anti-consumerist magazine famous for their spoof ads. Someone asked if I'm not the 99% and the 1% doesn't want me, then what am I? To which I replied, "an individual"

Maybe I'll protest the protestors and encourage them to go back to work, school, to enrich and empower their lives and each other. Our own success, happiness and future is in our own hands, and standing on street corners yelling "rambleramble" isn't going to get us very far. All the mixed directions of the 'revolt' seem jumbled. Now 38k NY transit workers are going to join, so they say. University students are walking out of classes, too. Really? Shouldn't we go to work, educate ourselves, and try to be a contributing member to society? I've never worked for a poor person, and I probably never will. I think it pissed off alot of them when I called all the protestors hipsters and junkies. But what they didn't understand is that I am part both.

I think we can create a more positive movement other than making the cops look bad. They're out there just doing their jobs. I think it was brilliant how they corralled everyone onto the bridge then arrest them. I'd be pissed if I couldn't get to work because the hippies shut down the bridge.

http://www.occupyoccupy.com

Think John Stewart might back me? lol.. I just like pushing buttons. So sue me

Maybe I'll even make these shirts or signs and go join them when they occupy my city.

[Zulegoona]

The Mother of All Deregulation

THE CLINTON administration’s free-market program culminated in two momentous deregulatory acts. Near the end of his eight years in office, Clinton signed into law the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Financial Services Modernization Act of 1999, one of the most far-reaching banking reforms since the Great Depression. It swept aside parts of the Glass-Steagall Act of 1933 that had provided significant regulatory firewalls between commercial banks, insurance companies, securities firms, and investment banks.


IT MAY be helpful to consider what has become of the old Federal Reserve Regulations W and X, the old margin requirements on consumer and housing loans. Since the gutting of Glass-Steagall, the new Regulation W deals with transactions between commercial banks and their securities affiliates. Federal regulatory resources, which in the past were directed to the safety and soundness of mortgage and consumer loans, are now redirected to the opaque transactions between affiliates within financial conglomerates. The former regulatory effort was prudential and preventive in nature, the latter more akin to monitoring the problem only after the horse had left the barn.

Wall Street had been lobbying for years for an end to Glass-Steagall, but it had not received much support before Clinton. Among those with a personal interest in the demise of Glass-Steagall was Robert Rubin, who had months earlier stepped down as treasury secretary to become chair of Citigroup, a financial-services conglomerate that was facing the possibility of having to sell off its insurance underwriting subsidiary. Although Rubin openly boasted of his lobbying efforts to abolish Glass-Steagall, the Clinton administration never brought charges against him for his obvious violations of the Ethics in Government Act.




It's all one party the money party and it doesn't matter which one is in office

[ygmir]

Heck, we're all socks here.

Ygmir, I thought yoiu were talking about President Clinton.
Maybe it was Bush. Okay, which Bush?
Or does it really matter which side we blame?

I'd think there is plenty of "blame" to go around, for sure.
I did think I remembered, some sort of big deal, under Clinton, that opened the door for many more home buyers.......but, thinking at the time about how much good will it do, if they can't afford to pay it back?
Sure, "qualify" them, but, if the bottom line is they can't pay....well. I was using Clinton as a time line.
No matter who was there, seems a bad idea, to give false hope, and sure failure, to folks. Yup, some can't afford to buy a house....well, that's the way it is.
But, telling them they can, letting them believe it, and then, when the cards come tumbling down, pointing fingers the other way......seems disingenuous, to me.

[Sola Gangsta]

Shouldn't we go to work, educate ourselves, and try to be a contributing member to society?

Which society would that be? The one that put us in this mess in the first place? Much has already been contributed to that society and they are fat with greed and wanting more. Time to cut them off.

I'd be pissed if I couldn't get to work because the hippies shut down the bridge.

Now there's your problem right there. You have a job and that is limiting your perspective. Quit your job, start your own business and you will begin to see how fucked up this system really is. Asking the crowd to "organize" their demands is just another way of saying "please let us (the elite) control the outcome". Chaos is probably what is needed at first because it puts the authorities off balance. So let them worry...

[Simon of the Playa]

in deference to eric, i shall just keep one foot in these waters.


ygnir, the answer to your question is another question..

who made the money on the fees and closing costs?

who gets the property when it's foreclosed on?

fuck the banks, fuck the bankers; davink, you're a sheep in wolf's clothing.

[Sola Gangsta]

Most who were truly responsible for this mess are not that visible. There are some who are more powerful than the president who basically dictate what happens through money. So follow the money to see where it came from and you will find those responsible.

[Eric]

As a moderator note- you can disagree all you want, but personal attacks will get edited.

You may now return to the discussion already in progress.

[Sola Gangsta]

As far as money is concerned... here is something to think about. When the fed prints up all those new bills and adds cash to the system, what are they worth?

Technically they are worth nothing until it successfully gets someone to jump through some hoops to get that piece of paper. That's called hegemony. When you try to do the same thing - that's called counterfeiting.

So, the banks basically having a whole bunch of free money which has 0 worth to start, get to trade it for something that has much worth such as a home if the homeowner (oh isn't that a nice word - they actually lied to you that you own your home and not the govt) fails to jump through enough hoops to keep it.

Nice trick!

LISTEN UP! There is no home ownership. You either rent from a landlord, or you rent from the federal government in the form of taxes. One is a better deal for sure, but they "lied" to you when they said you owned your home. Fail to pay the taxes and you find out who the owners really are.

[ygmir]

in deference to eric, i shall just keep one foot in these waters.


ygnir, the answer to your question is another question..

who made the money on the fees and closing costs?

who gets the property when it's foreclosed on?

fuck the banks, fuck the bankers; davink, you're a sheep in wolf's clothing.

all good questions.

funny, really, how it all seems to boil down to honest, integrity, and greed.........how the interact and overcome eachother..........

[moonrise]

Simon, perhpas leave the socks in the drawer; this is too interesting to risk a locked thread IMO.

If you're in New York, what's the word on the street? Is this growing? (I killed my TV long ago)

To the opposition in this thread; What's wrong with the sheep turning around and keeping the liars keeping them? Are YOU a 1%'r or close to the 1% enough, that it scares you?

*Property taxes are MUCH cheaper than rent, and besides, landlords pay the taxes, so, they are still a factor if money is worth less. The rents just get higher. Rent out the garage, or the back room, or live together with older/younger family members as an 'extended family', our government calls this 'The hidden homeless" Some of us have done this all of our lives, for a variety of reasons.

[Sola Gangsta]

*Property taxes are MUCH cheaper than rent, and besides, landlords pay the taxes, so, they are still a factor if money is worth less. The rents just get higher. Rent out the garage, or the back room, or live together with older/younger family members as an 'extended family', our government calls this 'The hidden homeless" Some of us have done this all of our lives, for a variety of reasons.

Given the choice between renting from a landlord and renting from the federal govt, I'd choose the latter. However, does it make you feel secure knowing that at any time the system gets unstable enough to threaten the existence of the govt, that they have the power to jack up property taxes to the same rate or higher than what happens with renters? This has happened for property taxes in some areas of the country.

Knowing this, I prefer to move about on BLM and because rent is not a tax deduction (but business travel is), I get to take a tax deduction equivalent to rent because that is where most of my money goes due to being homeless.

[moonrise]

*Property taxes are MUCH cheaper than rent, and besides, landlords pay the taxes, so, they are still a factor if money is worth less. The rents just get higher. Rent out the garage, or the back room, or live together with older/younger family members as an 'extended family', our government calls this 'The hidden homeless" Some of us have done this all of our lives, for a variety of reasons.

Given the choice between renting from a landlord and renting from the federal govt, I'd choose the latter. However, does it make you feel secure knowing that at any time the system gets unstable enough to threaten the existence of the govt, that they have the power to jack up property taxes to the same rate or higher than what happens with renters? This has happened for property taxes in some areas of the country.

Knowing this, I prefer to move about on BLM and because rent is not a tax deduction (but business travel is), I get to take a tax deduction equivalent to rent because that is where most of my money goes due to being homeless.

Sorry you're homeless, how does that work if one needs medical care, temporary or on-going? or becomes too elderly? Living as a camper 365 days isn't possible for some.
Maybe in Slab City, doubtful though.

It's perhaps good property taxes have become too high in some areas of the country, the sheep will know exactly where to look for the top 1%'rs and their close-at-hand (over-paid) employees.

If the government can 'up taxes' what's stopping them from changing the game that allows tax payers the freedom to deduct business expenses from their income taxes?

If they raise property taxes, take in more boarders, it just keeps escalating...and then, everyone snaps from being crammed into one living space.

No wonder people are out in the streets complaining, while bankers drink Champagne on gilded balconies and laugh and joke? Shame on them! Shame!

[cowboyangel]

http://truthphalanx.com

[Sola Gangsta]

Sorry you're homeless, how does that work if one needs medical care, temporary or on-going? or becomes too elderly? Living as a camper 365 days isn't possible for some. Maybe in Slab City, doubtful though.

Good place. I've been there and know builder Bill and solar Mike personally. Fortunately I'm fairly healthy and have no health insurance. The food industry is in the business of adulterating the food supply with crap that will basically make you sickly over a long period of time, but technically is not dangerous short term so stay away from processed foods. I'm too busy right now to get more into this, but more later...

If the government can 'up taxes' what's stopping them from changing the game that allows tax payers the freedom to deduct business expenses from their income taxes?

The govt is basically a bottom feeder. The last to go will be the privileges enjoyed by the few at the top, which are the various deductions for taxes, multiple LLC's to escape the 200,000 tax ceiling, etc... I just learned their tricks and used them for myself so gasoline takes the place of rent which the latter is not deductible, but the former is when travel is used for business.