whats with the hippie/raver hate

[superspatula]

so, new to the boards and noticing a lot of hippie and raver hate. but it seems like hippies and ravers or hippie-ravers comprise quite a bit portion of the BM attendees. so is it like hipsters who say they hate hipsters?

there isnt a lot of hippie or raver hate in NE because there arent a whole lot to hate!

[jkisha]

Pretty much the two groups that come to the event without a clue as to the ten principles.

[Turnip]

"Hippies" is mostly a derogative term.

When you think of hippies, you think of "Hey man can I crash on your couch?" and subsequent mooching along with copious amounts of drug use, and preaching about love and peace.

Burners work hard to come to Burning Man, and it is one of the main ideas behind the event, being self sufficient. The hippie movement is not related to Burning Man, but more along the lines of the event is so big, there is sure to be some people that consider themselves "hippies" that come. Yes, we are all having a great time at Burning Man, and cutting loose and enjoying ourselves. But like I said, we all worked hard to get there, and continue to work hard taking care of ourselves while we're there. Definitely not something definitive of a hippie lifestyle.

Not to mention every single Burner comes from their own walk of life, many from established careers, and don't want to be considered a "hippie" because they worked hard to get where they are in life.

When I think of "hippie" I think of people like the dude Tommy Chong plays on That 70s Show. You don't get many of those people there.




&As far as the ravers go,

Most the people the frequent this board are of a certain age group, maybe even plus some.
A lot of ravers give a lot of ravers a bad wrap, though. What with their drug use and MOOPy costuming.
Usually a seasoned veteran will give a good natured chuckle to a harmless roller, but when they get obnoxious about it, and interfere negatively with their own experience then yes they will have a negative story to add. But you'll notice negative comments aren't saved only for Hippies, or Rollers/Ravers but rather stupid behavior.

[oneeyeddick]

Don't forget to fling some poo on the DJs also.

[theCryptofishist]

I thought that since djs are the "love children" of hippie/raver crosses, it went without saying.

[RedHeaven]

See, us Hippies have a newer term for the Bad Hippie. we call them "w00ks" like wookies, like hairy like chewbacca. BUt its derogatory....its everything a hippie can do wrong. We needed to distinguish responsible loving sharing dead head types to gangstaish stinky moochy dead head types.

ITS ALL STEREO TYPES! And its all fun and games. Most people know that there are good and bad with every "group". Most of the asshats I dealt with this year were sad 48 year old punk rockers who bitched that they havent had an orgasm yet and then they would get angry that you were TRYING TO ARGUE WITH THEM....hahahahaaaa OMG Punky Whinerson! Yes it was an epic selfing though...

Put it this way: Dont take anything too seriously. We're all making fun of each other at some point. An asshat is an asshat no matter what.

Ravers just need to learn how to explore other parts of the city besides 2:00 and 10:00 WUBWUBWUBWUB WOMMMMMMMP hheheheeeheh

I learned how to say FUCK YOU I LIKE HIPPIE SHIT.....People are cool with that.

[trilobyte]

I think the stereotypes represent the lowest common denominator (or bottom feeders) of those groups. The snarkiness and knocking on hippies and ravers is mostly knocking on the ignorant behavior. Many of us come from those backgrounds (or at least have a few things in common with it), and I like to think that we've evolved from there.

[Bob]

Here you go, works on both.

[BBadger]

The fact that many (most?) in the community don't like "hippies" (in the freeloading, clueless, peacenik sense) is one of the things that has impressed me most about BM and this forum. BM is an altered reality, not an out-of-touch-with-reality event.

[moonrise]

See, us Hippies have a newer term for the Bad Hippie. we call them "w00ks" like wookies, like hairy like chewbacca. BUt its derogatory....its everything a hippie can do wrong. We needed to distinguish responsible loving sharing dead head types to gangstaish stinky moochy dead head types.

ITS ALL STEREO TYPES! And its all fun and games. Most people know that there are good and bad with every "group". Most of the asshats I dealt with this year were sad 48 year old punk rockers who bitched that they havent had an orgasm yet and then they would get angry that you were TRYING TO ARGUE WITH THEM....hahahahaaaa OMG Punky Whinerson! Yes it was an epic selfing though...

Put it this way: Dont take anything too seriously. We're all making fun of each other at some point. An asshat is an asshat no matter what.

Ravers just need to learn how to explore other parts of the city besides 2:00 and 10:00 WUBWUBWUBWUB WOMMMMMMMP hheheheeeheh

I learned how to say FUCK YOU I LIKE HIPPIE SHIT.....People are cool with that.

You're fantastic RedHeaven, I hope you stick around eplaya...heh heh.

[MOOP_Nazi]

Ravers drop glow glow sticks when you whack them like pinatas and love feather boas.

If they can evolve past that - can we call them Post-Ravers?

[shykat]

Hippies,Ravers,Burners.All labels.

I bet the first person too bash a Burner gets a rash of shit on this board.


I'm a fatherhusbandhippyraverburnerlifestyler..............

[phil]

> so, new to the boards and noticing a lot of hippie and raver hate.

And you took it seriously? Oh. Yeah. You're 'new to the boards.' Yeah, 'the boards.' What are you? An AOLer?

[Ugly Dougly]

Damn you forgot Frat Boys.
All terms for people who go to Burning Man without getting it.

And don't take it serious neither.

[jkisha]

LOL oh Phil, you're dating yourself.

> so, new to the boards and noticing a lot of hippie and raver hate.

And you took it seriously? Oh. Yeah. You're 'new to the boards.' Yeah, 'the boards.' What are you? An AOLer?

[phil]

Obligatory link: http://www.flickr.com/photos/civex/6132771309/

[BBadger]

Hippies,Ravers,Burners.All labels.

I bet the first person too bash a Burner gets a rash of shit on this board.

Nah, because the only thing that makes you a "burner" is that you have actually gone to BM, and that's not really a high bar to pass. Everyone is fair game. There's no "seniority" due to number of burns (quite often the people that believe that about themselves are complete assholes), post count, project participation, DJ notoriety, ranger status, camp membership, Larry Harvey, etc. The fact of the matter is: if you're being a dumbass at the moment, you're going to get called out on it--and should.

[ibdave]

See, us Hippies have a newer term for the Bad Hippie. we call them "w00ks" like wookies, like hairy like chewbacca. BUt its derogatory....its everything a hippie can do wrong. We needed to distinguish responsible loving sharing dead head types to gangstaish stinky moochy dead head types.

ITS ALL STEREO TYPES! And its all fun and games. Most people know that there are good and bad with every "group". Most of the asshats I dealt with this year were sad 48 year old punk rockers who bitched that they havent had an orgasm yet and then they would get angry that you were TRYING TO ARGUE WITH THEM....hahahahaaaa OMG Punky Whinerson! Yes it was an epic selfing though...

Put it this way: Dont take anything too seriously. We're all making fun of each other at some point. An asshat is an asshat no matter what.

Ravers just need to learn how to explore other parts of the city besides 2:00 and 10:00 WUBWUBWUBWUB WOMMMMMMMP hheheheeeheh

I learned how to say FUCK YOU I LIKE HIPPIE SHIT.....People are cool with that.

You're fantastic RedHeaven, I hope you stick around eplaya...heh heh.

What he said......

[AntiM]

But I know the artist!

[MOOP_Nazi]

Hippies,Ravers,Burners.All labels.

I bet the first person too bash a Burner gets a rash of shit on this board.


I'm a fatherhusbandhippyraverburnerlifestyler..............

They all taste like Chicken!!!

[moonrise]

Enough! hahaha...btw BBadger, Fishy says some burners don't need to have 'attended" the event...I trust her judgement. Now let's have some fun for fucks sake! decomp decomp decomp decomp....

[Zhust]

so, new to the boards and noticing a lot of hippie and raver hate. but it seems like hippies and ravers or hippie-ravers comprise quite a bit portion of the BM attendees. so is it like hipsters who say they hate hipsters?

From what I've heard, pretty much every time someone gives a name to the group of people they hate, it is "the group of people they hate". Usually it's based on a loose set of criteria that kind-of matches some group of others. I mean, it would make perfect sense to say, "I hate it when people MOOP all over the Playa — fuck the burners" because without burners, there would be no MOOP, but people need to enforce the "it's not me!" part, so they pick some group they personally do not identify with.

For instance, in my 2nd, 3rd, and 4th years, I was a big hater of "tourists", and especially "weekend tourists" who only show up on Friday and Saturday. You know: those people who just come and look around and ooh- and aah- about all the cool stuff, and they're not in costume, and they haven't made anything and ... wait ... you know ... just like I was the first year. Oh but I was different: I was a maker and clever and, gosh darn it, I really tried to bring things that I thought would be ideal. Alas, exactly the same as those tourists.

In year 5, I had a glorious "hippie meltdown" — somewhat of a spiritual, emotional experience where your world view is completely shattered for a time (and that presumably changes you forever). So a few hours after the temple burned, I was reconciling a misinterpreted case of witty banter (where I may have really insulted a nice girl who got me a drink at their bar; she was probably really quite exhausted just like the rest of us and didn't need more heckling). So I decided to go in and apologize and started to break down about it all. She was consoling and I gave her some sweet schwag (the best thing I got all burn) and went outside.

And I go outside and look around and all of a sudden bam: I fully internalized the idea, "everything everyone made is for me."

When I'm making some project, I am always thinking how it will be received — finishing it and showing it to others is my whole point. So when I make something, it is for the people who see it — all the individual people. So I realized that I was in the place of the receiver. I was the audience. I was the one the makers made this for. Everything I see, they had made with ME in mind. I went around like a crying, raving lunatic trying to explain to everyone I saw. It was fantastic.

So I kind of got over tourists. I grumble and lament that they don't understand that I personally programmed the microcontroller, and I personally designed and etched the circuit board, and I personally soldered every joint, and I personally cut every pipe and made every weld. But, you know, I made it for them to look at. (And, presumably, to be so damn impressed that I get laid for it, but that's a whole 'nuther ball of physiology.)

[Simon of the Playa]

IM A HIPPY/RAVER, BABY!


go ahead, call me clueless, i dare you.

[Simon of the Playa]

this ones for you kishska.

[RedHeaven]

Nice^^^^heh

Hey thanks a lot guys! This place has been a post burn savior!!

Hippies get hated on is because there is SUCH a huge "Hippy Mafia" in America these days, there are a bunch of large festivals and a lot to do out there, plus the Gathering, and Burning Man can be a bit like those events but really it wants to be separated because it's its own unique experience. For example, you can usually buy drugs at the large festivals Anywhere, but not at BMan, in fact its not cool to ask because there are a lot of narcs. It sucks we have narcs like that but in a way it IS self reliance to come to BMan with all you need. I would hate to have a BMan "Shakedown street". Same goes for my fav music festival High SIerra (which is oddly close to BRC) People bring their own to that place and share, no personal vending allowed, and it USED to have a cop problem (has been fixed since 07 so there is no Hippy Shakedown, no general street to score, nobody is there selling their crap. IT REALLY FEELS LIKE PEOPLE ARE ON VACATION, not trying to get to the next show. Grateful Dead lots were great for the time but they really created the ghetto hippies. BUrning Man is much more a place where people dont just land, but prep for, work for, have a regular life for (holds down jobs to pay the rent, not just jumps from scene to scene) and treat like a special week out of the year, not just another rager, brah

And for the ravers, BMan hosts some really top notch acts (in the one tribal dubstep genre that seems to be overly trendy right now) so its easy to just want to go to BMan JUST to dance at the sound camps. Their loss.....BUT you know by the end of the week they are starting to open their eyes at all the other stuff to do. Its safe to say that Burning Man can really change you in these ways. "I went for the whomp but met a folk singer at the Lotus and ended up being her stage manager"

Therefore I can see where the hippy raver gets picked on out of all the People Genres. The punks would get picked on more if they would come out of their Black Rock suburbian shell and continued to not spank their monkeys so they could get all uptight and get aggro with people. hahahaaa

The Reg world that doesnt get Burning Man or is annoyed at BMan has really turned the term BURNER into a douchey sounding word. SIGH "I dont need Burning Man to have life epiphanies, I get them without being some Burner"
Your loss dude, and thanks for adding to the slow city growth cause.


The Frat Boy is the worst of em all though. Poor sods, there really is no excuse. hahahaa Hopefully they have a Temple epiphany and return home a Class A Burner Hippie Raver

Tourists are hard to pick out. This year I found me some playa love and he had been an early arrival and worked his ass off and finally took some time off for the weekend so I took him around the art. He wore a straw hat, t shirt and shorts and hiking boots. I guess his one distinct non touristy look was the several BMan swag necklaces and pins he acquired from bartending all week. BMan swag is TOTALLY like Brownie Badges or Boy Scout Badges.

In a land where we promote Radical Self Expression we are bound to churn the labels.....but Im pretty sure most of us do it tongue firmly planted in cheek. Burning Man: Where the Jokes feed the Soul and the Soul feeds the Jokes

[Packoderm]

Does anybody have any actual photos of such transgressing hippies on the playa, or is this hippie thing more of a myth like the hippie babysitter who trips out and puts the baby in the microwave? I don't think I've actually encountered such a hippie on the playa. I've seen plenty of frat boys who don't fit my personal description of the desirable Burning Man demographic, but I haven't seen any 60's style counterculture people who take more than the give, even if what they give is the type ambiance, amusement and entertainment that lends a more interesting experience at Burning Man than I'm likely to find at the local Starbucks, grocery store, or DMV queue here at home. Perhaps some on this board do not like the counterculture experience and desire Burning Man to be a more generic experience where all business is on the up and up, and all exchanges, material and otherwise, are either negotiated up front or at least roughly conform with our default societal norms? Maybe next year during meet and greet, somebody can point out such transgressing hippies, or are they extremely rare?

[Bob]

In my experience the canonical stereotypes are based on behavior and actions. If you judge simply based on appearance, you're a just another fucking hippie. Hippies pretty much invented fashion-based labeling.

[Packoderm]

You mean you have to be one to be able to recognize one on sight? Interesting. The same doesn't hold true for frat boys does it? I can see within seconds of a frat boy's actions that he's a frat boy. I could probably point one out within a 5 minute stroll from any meet and greet, and I could probably show you ugly behavior from a frat boy within an hour of setting out on such a search. Does a litmus exist for identifying a hippie, a bad hippie anyway, or are they just mythical creatures in the night - like Goldstein?

[Bob]

My camp was labeled Frat Boy Camp my first year, despite that all of us had worked our way through college and hadn't been part of the Greek system. Did we act like frat boys? Opinions vary.

In the context of Burning Man, ravers have succeeded in turning the entire event into a rave because you can't escape the oontz at any time of day or night, and they've managed to get two large districts of BRC ceded entirely to them complete with ranger and medical outposts, but their presence and the trash and drug casualties they generate are tolerated because they buy a lot of tickets. And while as a segment of the population they're convinced that Burning Man is all about their needs, their camp promoters, er, organizers, have somehow learned to work with the org. Enough people think they're photogenic that they and their party buses comprise the public face of the event in your typical mass media photo spread.

Your stereotypical Burning Man hippies are similar in philosophy to your typical raver, but usually avoid congregating in large groups so they can pursue their self-entitled behavior in sekrit, until they get busted for drugs, sneaking in, oil and sewage leaks from their decrepit vehicles, or staying days or weeks in the event area after the burn without working on cleanup. After they get their miracle tickets, they're less likely to act as a group or interface with others due to outstanding warrants.

YMMV, and TWIAVBP.

[phil]

The thing to remember is that 9 times out of 10, it's a joke. Please.

> I don't think I've actually encountered such a hippie on the playa.

Depending on what you mean by "such," I see hippies all the time at Burning Man. Louise and I were at the vendor gate on Exodus day, and two hippies in a VW van tried to leave. We turned them back,and their van stalled. They had to bum a jump off one of the tow trucks to get it started again.

I've seen hippies in other years at the gate during the week, asking for free tickets for admission. They have a bedroll and a backpack, with too little food and water for the week, but they know they'll get tickets, food, and water from generous Burners. Other hippies come fully prepared. shrug - whatever floats your boat.

Frat boys?