How Fuel efficient is your car?

[helitack]

How many of those single car accidents involve not wearing a seat belt?
I'll stick with my damn near three ton vehicle thank you very much.

[madmatt]

How many of those single car accidents involve not wearing a seat belt?
I'll stick with my damn near three ton vehicle thank you very much.

They're mostly rollovers. And that would actually only indicate that SUV and light truck owners are less likely than car drivers to wear seatbelts (which I find believable).

Here's an exerpt from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration’s report on its research priorities for 2005-2009.

The first priority listed was "Address Incompatibility Between Passenger Cars and Light Trucks." There's a ton of issues that have only recently been acknowledged, but have always been known by car drivers:

The height difference means that the bumpers of SUVs and trucks are much higher than the doors, hoods and bumpers than cars' and so more likely to kill people in a passenger car they hit.

Their headlights are much higher, so more likely to blind car drivers.

Their height also blocks the views of car drivers.

-------------

Reducing the hazards associated with vehicle incompatibility is one of the Agency’s top priorities. In 2002, NHTSA identified rollover and vehicle compatibility as two of its highest vehicle safety priorities.

In the last decade, for the first time, more vehicle occupants are being killed in crashes between passenger cars and light trucks than in crashes involving only passenger cars. From 1980 to 2002, fatalities in car-to-car crashes decreased from 6,488 to 3,121, while LTV-to-car crashes increased from 3,718 to 5,590.

Although total occupant fatalities in two-vehicle crashes involving a passenger car and an LTV (pickup trucks, sport utility vehicles [SUVs] and vans) decreased slightly in 2003, the ratio of passenger car occupants killed to LTV occupants killed increased slightly – from 3.97 to 4.06. An analysis of 2001 Fatality Analysis Reporting System (FARS) data indicates that passenger car drivers are three and one-half times more likely to die than LTV drivers in front-to-front crashes between the two vehicle types, and the fatality rate for drivers of passenger cars struck in the side by LTVs is approximately three and one-half times greater than the fatality rate for drivers of LTVs struck in the side by passenger cars.

The larger mass and size of LTVs, along with significant disparities in stiffness, compared to passenger automobiles, and recent analyses of crash data, have raised a number of issues of concern. In the crash avoidance area, there are problems of glare due to higher mounted headlamps on LTVs. In the crashworthiness area, there is concern that the protection of occupants in smaller vehicles is being compromised when their vehicles collide with the larger and heavier LTVs. As the trend toward greater private passenger use of light trucks continues, the Agency has continued to extend pertinent passenger car standard requirements to LTVs, and it expects to continue to apply new and revised standards to all light vehicles, not just passenger cars.

But all that has nothing to do with fuel efficiency. Sorry for thread drifting.

[helitack]

Moral of the story, dont get in the way of this:


Most drivers of SUV's don't know how to drive them properly. If you know how to drive em, safer than the lil tiny car. If you have a little car, dont cut big trucks off, dont taunt them, they will win. And you can get lots of stuff in em, and sleep in em, etc

[can't sit still]

Here's a nice aerodynamic car;
http://www.cheniere.org/misc/gray.htm

[mojo]

Jeebus - that looks like a jet mated with a '56 chevy.....

[BAS]

I want one! I don't even care if it actually works-- that looks like the kind of car science fiction promised me when I was a kid!



(this is what it looks like)



B.

[gyre]

There are similar designs you can build.
Not really practical without mass production.
You can get a cheap kit car and build for efficiency rather than power.
A Factory Five daytona with a small engine would do some of both.

Ultralight streamlined cars are part of my light highway proposal that would have reserved roads for ultralights.

The Messerschmitt car got very high mileage with a crude engine by today's standards.
http://www.messerschmitt.co.uk/
http://www.messerschmitt.co.uk/index.ph ... &Itemid=25

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messerschmitt

Much can be done with proven technology.

[BAS]

What appeals to me about the car is how it looks like a wide, flattened teardrop with jet engines attached. It looks like it is going fast even when parked.

Maybe I should take up welding and build an art car based off of it. (I'd need a lot of practice first.)



I didn't even know Messerschmitt made cars! I have seen those cars (or pictures of them) on and off again. I never knew who made them. Thanks.

I'm not certain I would trust a kit car put together on me on any kind of public road-- not at least until I get a lot of practice first.


A company called Corbin (I think) did try to come out with an electric, one passenger, three wheeled car a few years back. Unfortunately, I don't think they ever got up to full production. For what most of us use a full sized car for, a small, one or two passenger vehicle would be more than sufficient.


B.

[gyre]

I talked to the Corbin company a few times.
One of their selling points was motorcycle parking for 3 wheelers.
We have a different philosophy.
I think the great gains are to be made in highway travel, not city commuting.
Streamlining doesn't do a lot at 20 mph.

They were trying to build an efficient sports car also.
I wonder if the Lotus based Tesla is related to that?

At some point in our discussions about efficiency I said,
"I have a 500 horsepower Ford and a french bicycle.
So where do I fit into the whole earth first thing?"
He laughed.

[unjonharley]

I have a picture of the Corbin ManTrack on my wish/cork board..Guess not in this life time.

[gyre]

What was the Man Track?

[unjonharley]

What was the Man Track?

\/
It's a recumbent Harley..Has a hatch on top to enter..Great body design..Two wheels front steering, one drive wheel rear..Spoiler on the front..Hot looking..I've had the picture two years..It must have been a show design..

[gyre]

There is an enclosed BMW made in Switzerland.
There a number of four wheeled cars, not all enclosed.
Most are made for high performance.
Have you checked out the Drysdale V8 bike?
Kind of nice.

[gyre]

Here's one.

http://www.brookecars.co.uk/

http://www.westfield-sportscars.co.uk/c ... owroom.asp

http://www.pistonheads.com/doc.asp?c=47&i=6958
The Carver-You might like that.

A thread
http://www.elisetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35617

The T-Rex
Ariel Atom

There is a sort of online magazine with all kinds of general related cars on it.
http://www.gizmag.com/go/7009/picture/32635/
http://www.gizmag.com/go/6843/

[unjonharley]

BMW had a car in the 50's...The door was in the front with a folding steering wheel..It was a tycycle set up..two wheels in the front and drive wheel in the back..The ack had two wheels close together.. Called the Izetta.. not sure of he spelling

[gyre]

We used to have one down the street.
If you get to Nashville check out the Lane Motor Museum.
They have some streamliners and a car that makes the Isetta look big.
Biggest set of Tatras in the us too.
I never get tired of going there.
Check out the propellor driven car.

http://www.pbase.com/deadelvis/lanemotormuseum

http://www.lanemotormuseum.org/

www.givemenashville.com/LaneMotorMuseum.htm
The last is on microcars.

[gyre]

Here's a fairly fast polizei car.
I never got a photo up before!
How about that!

[BAS]

Now I have another one I want!







(I like the one, central tailfin!)


B.

[gyre]

BAS, I can't see your photos.
Is it my machine?

Unjon, the bmw I was talking about is a bike.
I can't remember the brand.
This is interesting though.

http://www.electric-bikes.com/betterbik ... biles.html

How to build an enclosed bike
http://www.btinternet.com/~jhpart/bkencl3.htm

http://www.leitra.dk/

http://www.electric-bikes.com/better.htm

http://www.go-t-rex.com/

This might be the one I was thinking of.
It is BMW powered.
http://eco.peraves.ch/standarde.htm

http://eco.peraves.ch/movie_e.htm
Video

[BAS]

Could be-- they are showing up fine on mine.

They're of the silver car from one of your links. The 1947 Tatra T-87 Saloon (if I am reading the sign correctly). It's got a rather odd looking rear engine.



B.

[gyre]

I still can't see them.
I think that Tatra was the first Porsche design.

[BAS]

I still can't see them.
I think that Tatra was the first Porsche design.

http://www.pbase.com/deadelvis/lanemotormuseum


Fifth row down, first three pictures.

Could be an early, post WW2, Porsche design. He like rear engined cars, and the general design looks like his work. (Back in the 1980s, I really, really wanted a Porsche 928. Needless to say, I never had the money to buy one. Still don't. Oh well.)

That propeller car ought to be a lot of fun in the rain! I have seen other pictures of propeller driven cars, including an experiment someone did back in the 1970s (although it had the prop in the rear). I don't know how efficient they would be. There probably is some advantage in not being dependent on road surface for traction.

Aw crud! Somehow its gotten to be midnight! I need to log off and get to bed.


B.

[gyre]

I think it was pre-war that he did design work for Tatra.
No one in germany would build his designs.
I think they had an eight cylinder engine.

[spirited]

Last year at hotwheelz camp we ran a Honda generator that can charge 10to14 power chars&scooters In 6.5 hr=1gl of gas. thy have a rang of 17 to 28 mils on the playa.
NOT TO BAD.

[gyre]

I think Hotwheelz Camp puts more vehicles on the playa than any other single camp.

[Bay Bridge Sue]

Tatras builot a big, air-cooled flat 8 they put in some awesome sedans - the model called the Tatraplan (either for the 5 year plan in which they were designed or because they were so aerodynamic - heard both sides of that one) that were fast, smooth, and comfy. Wanted one since I first saw one... swoopy, luxurious, with a stabilizer fin along the back (rumor is they got squirrley at really high speeds)... The later ones (the 613 as I remember) were modern sedans, high party official wheels. NICE cars. (Esp for an eastern-bloc country). They still build big trucks which are very industrial looking and also powerful. ANd air cooled, still...

I think Hotwheelz Camp puts more vehicles on the playa than any other single camp.

Mr Fixit in one of my heroes!!! He's put a lot out there and is responsible for a lot more. Including the one(s) our camp is building this year.

Here's a fairly fast polizei car. I never got a photo up before!
How about that!

What I want to know is - how do they get all 5 Carbinerei in that Lamborghini? Kind of... cozy?? Nice pix... gotta have something that'll catch up with all those hotrodder mercedes' from north of the border...

bb

[akmojo]

I drive a 2001 Chevy Silverado Ex Cab 4x4 (auto trans w/3.73 gearing) and get around 11mpg in town and 13 mpg on the highway... my commute is maybe 10 miles RT p/day....
here in Alaska it is mainly the young, granola and living in the city types that drive small trucks and small SUV's... most Alaskans drive full size trucks and SUV's due to passenger numbers, loads, trailering, conditions, terrain, etc.... (4/6/07 reg gas=$2.47 p/gal avg in Anchorage)
heck, my truck gets better mileage than my 900cc longtrack snowmachine !!
a full size ex cab 4x4 truck is the vehicle of choice here.....
then there are Hummers... the H1 is a true utility vehicle but the H2 is a joke, made for the rich but no common sense types that have the need to show that they must have small penises and large egos... a Suburban, Tahoe or Expedition is a far more comfortable, roomy and efficient vehicle... people here know H1's are tough and laugh at H2's....
I have yet to see an Escalade, Range Rover or Land Cruiser in the places I regularly go (and I am almost always towing a trailer w/toys).... to me, they are pretty much the same catagory as the typical H2 and it's owner.... meaning they are driven in the city on paved roads....

[unjonharley]

Last year at hotwheelz camp we ran a Honda generator that can charge 10to14 power chars&scooters In 6.5 hr=1gl of gas. thy have a rang of 17 to 28 mils on the playa.
NOT TO BAD.

\/
My camp mate and I will have new 36volt chairs this year..Would it be posible to charge at Hotwheelz??.. We charge off 120 to 36v inverters

[BAS]

I think it was pre-war that he did design work for Tatra.
No one in germany would build his designs.
I think they had an eight cylinder engine.

Well, the sign says its a 1947 vehicle, but the design could be from before the war. (shrugs-- I'm not any sort of expert) Is Tatra a Soviet brand? About all I know is that I think it is cool looking, and what the first line of the sign in front of it says.


B.

[gyre]

The Tatra is Czech.
They use a Tatra truck as a hauler at the Lane museum.
Parked next to the amphibious hauler with 4 huge diesel engines, it looks like a toy.
The thing is so big they shut down Nashville to get it across town.
They barely got it into the parking lot.
It would make a great art car.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tatra_(car)