What ever it once had, it no longer has...

[PetsUntilEaten]

Eric -

I love your eyes.

Would you care to dance?

- Kelly

[PetsUntilEaten]

Quit coming (and quit being a martyr about it).
Bring more of what you want to see or do (and don't act all high and mighty about it- do it because You Want To)
Find a way to get further involved (volunteer for Info, or the Rangers, or the Earth Guardians, or any of the non-BMorg groups)
But quit whining and expecting the world to revolve around your expectations. I could care less why you're not coming- I want to spend my time with people who Want To Be There. People who go looking for fun, however they define it, not Looking For Reasons To Be Miserable (yes, I like using capital letters. Deal)

oh - and if you didn't understand the invite - - -
you obsequious pontificating newbie cultish moonie freak - then let me straighten you out

we are not more going to stop bitching than give up on going to burningman - any more than we'd give up pizza, sex, red apples, or america just because we got a nasty mouthfull - so suck it up pal & open wide to boot - cuz we're emotionally raw --- we're fucking self-righteous vets - and FUCK YOU cuz i need a dance partner!

bite me, fuckwit!

now - how bout that dance?

hugs & rug burns -

pets.


ps - i'm so glad you "get it'" - i guess the rest of us can all take a fucking break now that you're here to take charge.

[nymphgonebad]

well then let's stop pointing our fingers and start shaking our asses, shall we?

the princess

[Flux]

A friend just shared this definition with me tonight, and it struck me as perfectly apropos of this conversation.

Expectation: premeditated resentment

[Rob the Wop]

Y'know what I was saying about the whole "moonie" bit? How many posts can you count where the author was spewing tons of vitrol at anyone that <b>DARES</b> profane the name of the mighty Burning Man? I went, I particpated, but the event changed and it's not for me. Apparently I'm now an asshole.

a) She already said she wasn't going. Telling her not to is like screaming at a rock.
b) She didn't call you all names.
c) Maybe she has a point of view different from yours.

Anyone can post on this board. Without skeptical viewpoints, this board would turn into a fucking Rainbow Gathering. Balance folks. Less chewing on her ass, more rational replies. If you absolutely, positively cannot ever think a bad thought about Burning Man- then you need to take yourself less seriously. The Cacophony Society (mainly the SF branch) was a large part of the beginnings of BM, and they've <b>NEVER</b> really taken themselves seriously. We've held Larry Harvey book signings at BM with a fake Larry signing "Mein Kamp". It's all in fun folks, BM is not Nirvana.

[herself]

hey ROB

Somehow am sure you'll appreciate this

Let's steal burning man from Larry!!!!!!!!!!!

Start here........


http://famouslibrarian.com/servlet/Login

ps. just kidding

[Rob the Wop]

I couldn't get to log on. Will try again later.

But let's take it over anyway. Allow guns. Remove the porta-potties and ice camp. Force people to recycle their own feces and urine. Free tabs of E at the gate. Plastic Burning Man membership cards. If you don't pass a battery of "hipness" tests, you don't get to come in. Make a secret handshake and a "Klingon-esque" type language. BMORG developes a panel of experts to judge any art brought through the gates- if it's not "art", then it's out. All Ravers must cover themselves in BBQ sauce at all times during the event, in case the DPW gets hungry and don't want to reach for their backpacks. All people must tell a minimum of one unique dead baby joke to pass the greeters.

<i>OK, maybe none of the above is practical. Except the Raver/BBQ part. That's a keeper.</i>

[blyslv]

> Think I should cut the nipples out of that one, too?

It's hard to envision any shirt that would not be improved by that particular modification.

[Rob the Wop]

> Think I should cut the nipples out of that one, too?

It's hard to envision any shirt that would not be improved by that particular modification.

Any shirt I'm wearing.

[blyslv]

[quote="Rob the Wop"] Less chewing on her ass, quote]


But I thought that was what was wanted.

mmmmm, ass chewing....

[Zane5100]

well then let's stop pointing our fingers and start shaking our asses, shall we?

the princess

I'm with you...

"she's a superfreak, superfreak..."

[tbone]

Y'know what I was saying about the whole "moonie" bit? How many posts can you count where the author was spewing tons of vitrol at anyone that <b>DARES</b> profane the name of the mighty Burning Man? I went, I particpated, but the event changed and it's not for me. Apparently I'm now an asshole.

Depends on how you inform people of your opinions.
When she states that people brinking booze who aren't wearing costumes are rapist, fratboy spectators (I know, not her real words) then there's the chance of offending the folks who aren't rapist fratboy spectators who aren't wearing costumes and are drinking.

Maybe she has a point of view different from yours.

Then she should learn some basic social/writing skills and tell us that viewpoint without calling us all assholes. If she doesn't like it, doesn't want to come back and explain why, more power to her. Perhaps we can learn from her.

But her attitude of "it sucks, you suck, it should be cancelled" is just flame bait.

[shitmouse]

i agree in heart with a lot of comments above. it doesn't have what it used to. and yes it is an evolution.

this year we said would be our last after 7 consecutive years. because of this and that. but then, part of me wants to fight back against what i want to run from, so my next project will be a serious cacophony sound making device!!! instead of bowing out, i'm going to make some impressions at my next burn and a machine that will stoke people the fuck out!

we will be taking next year off just to go to a slacker tropical vacation, but the year after you will all hear the noise from my evil sound machine!!
joy.
-b

[theshaman]

"Christ is like cheese; a whole mountain range of cheese!" - Salvador Dali

I believe that says it all. Thanks for the theme camp notes tbone. It wasn't a disaster or dramatic, we just took on too much. Good playa lesson with minimal drama.

[dj big E]

mister wop hit it wright on the head this is not a rainbow gathering .make of it what you wan't .someday i will detail my whole 1st year experience and many of you will wonder wy in the fuck does he want to come back lmao.becvause i luv it all the art the music the people the controlled anarchy the fires the rawness i love it all.on friday when some fratboy bumped into i just bumped back harder lmao.well i understand dragontears position,but the best thing about the burn is it's never the same never lmao.dj big "E"

[Sondra]

I'm new... this is my first burn so maybe my perspective will be brushed away. But what I like about BM is that it ISN'T all one thing. No - I don't like rape or screwed up slimeballs or people who don't "get it", not individually. But I DO like (cherish and sit in amazement of) the fact that every single thing existed in that desert. I can control and create my reality and have it controlled and created anywhere else in the world. Everywhere else I have been, people are slicing off parts of reality to feel safer and more comfortable. And of course it should be that way in day to day life, but what I enjoyed so much about this (and only this) experience was that I was NOT always comfortable. My boundaries were questioned, things happened I would never have encountered elsewhere. I felt not safe... I felt alive. But I found the good and the bad in coexistence. Personally, I loved it.

[precipitate]

> this is my first burn so maybe my perspective will be brushed away

Your perspective will only be brushed away on the eplaya if you comport
yourself like a complete nincompoop and give people reason to think
you're vapid or full of shit or just plain dumb. Which you haven't.

[PetsUntilEaten]

> this is my first burn so maybe my perspective will be brushed away

Your perspective will only be brushed away on the eplaya if you comport
yourself like a complete nincompoop and give people reason to think
you're vapid or full of shit or just plain dumb. Which you haven't.

AND . . . if you're funny then it doesn't even matter if you're all those things.

[Booker]

what I enjoyed so much about this (and only this) experience was that I was NOT always comfortable. My boundaries were questioned, things happened I would never have encountered elsewhere. I felt not safe... I felt alive. But I found the good and the bad in coexistence. Personally, I loved it.

Hey, thanks Sondra. Made my day.

Dunno if I'd echo the "only this" limitation though. Sometimes I get pretty good results mixing that attitude into default life. Edited to add: Ain't gonna be no prisoner of my own lazy-ass comfort.

[nymphgonebad]

And of course it should be that way in day to day life, but what I enjoyed so much about this (and only this) experience was that I was NOT always comfortable. My boundaries were questioned, things happened I would never have encountered elsewhere. I felt not safe... I felt alive. But I found the good and the bad in coexistence. Personally, I loved it.

for me, bm is all about testing your level of comfort and pushing beyond. in fact, i try to do in irl as well. i did, however, always feel safe. whcih i don't always irl. horny, too.

[jaywalker]

Everywhere else I have been, people are slicing off parts of reality to feel safer and more comfortable. And of course it should be that way in day to day life, but what I enjoyed so much about this (and only this) experience was that I was NOT always comfortable. My boundaries were questioned, things happened I would never have encountered elsewhere. I felt not safe... I felt alive. But I found the good and the bad in coexistence. Personally, I loved it.

I like you!!!!! So no smart-ass comment right now. Thanks for not being pompous. Great realization!

[playa_buddha]

I've said it in another post, and I'll say it here in a different way. On the playa, it seems most people is having too good of a time to worry about the little things that bug them about the event - oglers, spectators, cops, the commerce of coffee and ice at a no-commerce event, getting too big, unapproachable theme camps - the list goes on. Only in retrospect does the inner critic come out for most of us, however. Once you get home and wash the dust out of everything, then you start thinking about the failings of the event. I'm just glad that the negativity I see abundant on the e-playa seems to be minimal at the event itself. As for me - I work seven days a week, ten plus hours a day at a store I opened last February. Burning Man was my only vacation and I prefer to dwell on the good - and it was mostly all good.
Buddha

[Marmot]

Black Rock City is after all a city. Like all cities, people do good and people do bad. I was ready to hang it up after last year, but I changed my mind at T-1 month. Because I hadn't spent the year building up expectations, I had a more open mind and fresher perspective. If I didn't feel like wearing a costume, I didn't. I didn't spend my evenings chasing after the perfect party. I slowed down. I didn't get wasted. I fantasized about spending an evening on an art car, and La Contessa made my fantasy come true. I bonded with friends and made new ones. Magic happened.

Try committing to not going and see how your perspective changes. I believe if you are meant to go to the playa, the playa calls to you. Perhaps something else is trying to get your attention...

BTW is this the Dragonfly that DJ'd at Illuminaughty? You totally made my first Burn in 2000.

- Marmot

[Eric]

oh - and if you didn't understand the invite - - -
you obsequious pontificating newbie cultish moonie freak - then let me straighten you out
we are not more going to stop bitching than give up on going to burningman - any more than we'd give up pizza, sex, red apples, or america just because we got a nasty mouthfull - so suck it up pal & open wide to boot - cuz we're emotionally raw --- we're fucking self-righteous vets - and FUCK YOU cuz i need a dance partner!

Darlin? I didn't ask anyone to stop bitching. I even bitched in my own post. I simply told all those whiny "I'm taking my ball and going home" wankers my feelings- quit trying to take the event away from those who enjoy just because you're not happy with it any more.
Dragonfly said in her original post:

I would recommend that the powers that be abandon BM next year, and move on to create something smaller, with more integrity, in some other place.

That's what I loath- the implication that because she doesn't like it, it must suck for everyone.

Telling us that she's leaving? Fine
Telling us why she thinks it sucks now? Fine, I can learn more about things to watch out for and hopefully avoid.
Telling us that the event should end in it's current incarnation because she doesn't like it any more? She can Fuck Off, in my humble opinion.

"obsequious pontificating newbie " I will accept gladly. I don't deny that- and if I did my friends would nail gun it to my ass to remind me that it's true.
"cultish moonie " is way wrong. I see tons of problems with Burning Man, and if I was a cultish moonie I'd be working for the Gazette, not Piss Clear.
"freak" is pretty much on the money.
You can even add "dirty old man" and "pervert" to the list if you'd like. Everyone else does.

I don't really see Burning Man as anything more than an amazing experience. Not "life changing", not the only thing in my life, and certainly not "home" (my boyfriend would be pissed if I abandoned him for the desert for more than a week)

Bitch your brains out, I might even join in.
But if I bitch about something, I'll do my best to improve that problem for myself the next year, not expect someone else to fix it or make it go away.

and FUCK YOU cuz i need a dance partner!

bite me, fuckwit!

now - how bout that dance?

Dance is good- I prefer slow, and under the stars. How about near whatever art piece is beyond the man on the Wednesday before the burn, midnightish. We can discuss the biting and fucking part then.

[PetsUntilEaten]

aw - if you're gonna try to be all semi-rational n shit how'm i gonna start a flame war?!

fine - real dance then. . . .

(shuffles off . . . )

[Eric]

aw - if you're gonna try to be all semi-rational n shit how'm i gonna start a flame war?!

fine - real dance then. . . .

(shuffles off . . . )

Oh, sorry.
Newbie, remember?

Fuck you fucking fucker.
I'm right, you're wrong. I'll dance with you in hell.

(hell, by the way, looks like the first art object beyond the man on the wednesday before the burn, midnightish)

I'm just a flamer, not a flame-warrior I guess....

[dragonflyannie]

First off, I'm not the same dragonfly that posted this thread... my opinions are far reaching on the opposite end of the spectrum...

I just wanted to tell Dragonfly, that it is my experience that you truly get back what you put in. This was my fourth year, and granted the amazement of Burning Man fizzled upon returning my 2nd year, but I am participating on a larger scale than I ever thought I could. This year I had my first art installation as well as compiled a 100 page book that contained burner musings and imagery from over 50 burners... I self published it and gifted it to many people on the playa this year. And what I got from Burning Man in return is ten-fold... I'm still feeling the affects.

This year was the best burn ever for me and I didn't drink or do drugs to get stupid as you so nicely put it. Nor do I wear costumes at all times. But I certainly don't go with too many expectations. Flux, thank you for your definition of Expectation... it truly is "premeditated resentment"... believe me, I learned from previous BM experiences to leave my expectations at the door. But you know, hey, Burning Man is not for everyone... but being judgemental of those who it is for is not taken lightly as you have so quickly discovered. There are so many burners who "get it"... and they are the souls who make Burning Man truly wonderous and special.

Dragonfly, I am truly saddened at your jaded views... it really is too bad that your mind did not open to the possibilities and you didn't see the true beauty that can be discovered through Burning Man. Even with all the negativity that abounds, it can be uncovered.

[dj big E]

uh sondra you have a date for the meet and great nekt year lmao dj big "E"

[Kinetic]

I almost thought I was in the "Fuck" thread there for a second.....some of the above posts were nasty!

[Chimp]

Dragonfly?


Where didja get a cool name like that you absolute fucking square?

"Hold on tight to me baby / it's such a long way down"

- Saint Low, 'Long way down'