inog wrote:If there are 50k+ tickets and 1,000 show up in the hands of scalpers, that is less than 2% of all tickets that end up with scalpers. Do you really think it is worth the added burdens and problems with non-transferable tickets and the issues with the added record keeping to avoid that 2%? Trust me, it can be a logistical nightmare.
Apply the same logic to alcohol. I would guess than more than 2% of the people who drink have had problems with alcohol at some point. Either a DUII, a missed day of work, or something. Does that warrant banning alcohol? No. We accept some of the bad with the good. Reactionary overstepping is the kind of thing that lead to crazy drug laws.
Step back and realize that this process put the vast majority of the tickets in the hands of people in the community and likely kept a lot of tickets out of the hands of scalpers.
inog wrote:If there are 50k+ tickets and 1,000 show up in the hands of scalpers, that is less than 2% of all tickets that end up with scalpers. Do you really think it is worth the added burdens and problems with non-transferable tickets and the issues with the added record keeping to avoid that 2%? Trust me, it can be a logistical nightmare.
Apply the same logic to alcohol. I would guess than more than 2% of the people who drink have had problems with alcohol at some point. Either a DUII, a missed day of work, or something. Does that warrant banning alcohol? No. We accept some of the bad with the good. Reactionary overstepping is the kind of thing that lead to crazy drug laws.
Step back and realize that this process put the vast majority of the tickets in the hands of people in the community and likely kept a lot of tickets out of the hands of scalpers.
remi wrote:inog wrote:If there are 50k+ tickets and 1,000 show up in the hands of scalpers, that is less than 2% of all tickets that end up with scalpers. Do you really think it is worth the added burdens and problems with non-transferable tickets and the issues with the added record keeping to avoid that 2%? Trust me, it can be a logistical nightmare.
Apply the same logic to alcohol. I would guess than more than 2% of the people who drink have had problems with alcohol at some point. Either a DUII, a missed day of work, or something. Does that warrant banning alcohol? No. We accept some of the bad with the good. Reactionary overstepping is the kind of thing that lead to crazy drug laws.
Step back and realize that this process put the vast majority of the tickets in the hands of people in the community and likely kept a lot of tickets out of the hands of scalpers.
Non-transferable tickets is a pretty standard practice.. and perhaps BM needs to step up to the norm.
Non-transferable tickets would make it so 0% end up in scalpers hands. Much better anti-scalper system then the current lotto. There are programs made to help with the record keeping process as well. At this point, it is the best solution by far.
brnr96 wrote:Here is how to do it:
Say we have 50,000 tickets to sell. We designate a sales period that lasts 100 days, ending one month before the event...simple math tell us that this means a maximum of 500 tickets can be sold, each day of the sales period. Tiered pricing can be implemented, such that a certain percentage of each day's allocated sales takes place at each price point.
This way, everybody who wants to purchase a ticket will have a chance of buying one from the organization, at each price point, all the way through the sales period. If you don't get your ticket the first day, it's no big deal...you literally have 99 more chances to get the ticket you want, at the price you want to pay for it...persistence is rewarded.
Saigonborg wrote:I would have liked to see what would have happened this year if they had just over hauled in ticketing's servers as opposed to the whole ticketing process. Yes burning man would still sell out but I highly doubt it would be to the point where it sells out in hours or even days. Right now we don't even know what the true number of tickets demanded would have been because so many people recruited others to enter for them multiple times. This year would have been a good one for gathering data but now we just won't ever know.
MyDearFriend wrote:I can't believe I'm taking shit from a meat-cake-with-teeth. :lol:
BBadger wrote:I like being able to buy tickets for friends who are not "on the ball" about getting their own.
Mr. Possibility wrote:brnr96 wrote:Here is how to do it:
Say we have 50,000 tickets to sell. We designate a sales period that lasts 100 days, ending one month before the event...simple math tell us that this means a maximum of 500 tickets can be sold, each day of the sales period. Tiered pricing can be implemented, such that a certain percentage of each day's allocated sales takes place at each price point.
This way, everybody who wants to purchase a ticket will have a chance of buying one from the organization, at each price point, all the way through the sales period. If you don't get your ticket the first day, it's no big deal...you literally have 99 more chances to get the ticket you want, at the price you want to pay for it...persistence is rewarded.
This is actually quite clever, if it weren't for the prospect of having to log into the computer at the same time daily for three months or more.
BBadger wrote:AW LAWRDY! We're only done with 1/3rd of the ticket sale system, the lottery component, and now we're already making plans to flip-turn upside-down the whole system after we haven't even evaluated the entire plan? Were you also the types who expected Obama to fix the economy single-handed in a year?
Let's have a little patience people. Think a little longer-term. So not everyone in your group got their ticket. Was it going to be different in any other system where demand is greater than supply? It wasn't scalpers that caused that.
And so the tickets got spread out among more people, even some who gamed the system. Did those tickets just magically disappear? No. They're still in "the system" and what more, there will be a nice STEP program to facilitate fair exchange of such tickets. Just because you rolled the dice wrong doesn't mean the system itself is flawed. The tickets are out-there, and at least they're mostly in burner hands (or confirmation emails)
Non-transferable tickets tagged to specific individuals? No thanks. I like being able to buy tickets for friends who are not "on the ball" about getting their own. Nor do I know exactly who gets my ticket at purchase time. We pool our resources together, maybe some of us were able to get tickets via other means. The ability to transfer tickets is vital for many of us.
Transferring tickets only via STEPs? Maybe, but even then people could change an extra "service charge" prior to the actual transfer. It'd be the same thing as scalping, only the actual ticket amount portion would go through STEPs. Might be good for counterfeit tickets though.Saigonborg wrote:I would have liked to see what would have happened this year if they had just over hauled in ticketing's servers as opposed to the whole ticketing process. Yes burning man would still sell out but I highly doubt it would be to the point where it sells out in hours or even days. Right now we don't even know what the true number of tickets demanded would have been because so many people recruited others to enter for them multiple times. This year would have been a good one for gathering data but now we just won't ever know.
27000 tickets sold out within about 1.5 days of last year's sale. Yes, I would expect them to sell out very quickly. What more, in such an open-purchase system it is very easy to buy tickets for scalping. It was why the lottery was conceived in the first place.
Zoo wrote:Although I must admit, I don't really understand why there's a cap, it seems as though there's plenty of space on the playa for everyone who could possibly want to go.
motskyroonmatick wrote:Work with the BLM to increase the population cap to 75K. Start the event on Saturday and burn the Man on Friday
I know there is a torrent of side effects from doing this but we went from 25K to 50K with the typical kicking and screaming. We can do 75K no problem.
Mr. Possibility wrote:motskyroonmatick wrote:Work with the BLM to increase the population cap to 75K. Start the event on Saturday and burn the Man on Friday
I know there is a torrent of side effects from doing this but we went from 25K to 50K with the typical kicking and screaming. We can do 75K no problem.
Genius! Now someone's talking some sense! BLM has got to love the revenues it receives from Burning Man and last I saw the playa clean-up map was pretty damn green so why not expand the city?
I know this may be oversimplifying things but can the agreements with the BLM and local authorities really be so tenuous? I doubt it. Roughly $8 million goes through the org each year. I can't imagine much of that is spent before they're certain they'll be an event and Burning Man has held up it's end of the bargain for 20+ years. It's time to grow the city and perhaps this is exactly the event needed to precipitate that change!
danibel wrote:Mr. Possibility wrote:motskyroonmatick wrote:Work with the BLM to increase the population cap to 75K. Start the event on Saturday and burn the Man on Friday
I know there is a torrent of side effects from doing this but we went from 25K to 50K with the typical kicking and screaming. We can do 75K no problem.
Genius! Now someone's talking some sense! BLM has got to love the revenues it receives from Burning Man and last I saw the playa clean-up map was pretty damn green so why not expand the city?
I know this may be oversimplifying things but can the agreements with the BLM and local authorities really be so tenuous? I doubt it. Roughly $8 million goes through the org each year. I can't imagine much of that is spent before they're certain they'll be an event and Burning Man has held up it's end of the bargain for 20+ years. It's time to grow the city and perhaps this is exactly the event needed to precipitate that change!
Grow the city all you want. It's not going to increase the capacity of the road!
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