NeVaDa state laws in regards to FLAG BURNING

[Simon of the Playa]

well, you obviously are not a republican then....maybe you're a closet libertarian, i hear they eat boogers.

democrats just usually eat other democrats....


yup....i'm SO glad we spent 60 million dollars impeaching Bill Clinton for a Blow-job, and 6 million to investigate 9/11, a blow-up job.

cordite.cordite.cordite.GOOSE!

[Silverwheel]

Personally, if it meant that I could have a return to the growing economy and general prosperity of the Clinton administration, and give back the tanking economy, assault on civil liberties, and worldwide disgust with the new Amerika, then I would happily check off a box on my tax return to give a dollar to the Presidential Hooker Fund - and consider it a bargain.

Sigh. One consenting adult sucked off another one. A sane country would have said, "So what?" and laughed at the puritanical Republican apparatchik that suggested that they make use of it.

One of the reasons I would vote for Hillary is the hope that she'd tag Bill for SecState, and start turning our worldwide reputation around.

[mdmf007]

Interesting idea Silver - I wasnt around when JFK made RFK attorney General but could imagint the cries of nepotism then as well. JFK was a lot more amorous in office than clinton I hear so maybe Bill would be a viable option.

all I know is that my business was doing far better under Clinton than Bush. 9/11 blows. but is so convoluted and mired in controversy - who knows

later

[lurker]

Wikipedia is not "them". Wikipedia is us. If you disagree with what "they" say (or want to illustrate your point) feel free to edit it. Go ahead and post your own pics if you want something more appropriate (of course, they have to be public domain. Got any public domain pics of what you're talking about?) Of course, you have to back up everything you say or it gets reverted, but you can do that, can't you?

I didn't say that Wikipedia was 'them'. I just pointed out that, with all the complaints about Repblican dissent suppression in the article, the only pictures they could find to illustrate their('their' as in the people who put un the info) point was the actual cage, erected at the behest of Democrats, to keep protesters from disrupting their convention.

And I have nothing to 'back up'. I'm talking about the info that Silverwheel posted to back up the contention that Bush and Republicans were setting up 'free speech zones'. The pictures shown did not back up the assertions offered--either on Wikipedia or in Silverwheels' post.

[lurker]

Sigh. One consenting adult sucked off another one. A sane country would have said, "So what?" and laughed at the puritanical Republican apparatchik that suggested that they make use of it.

Perjury, Silverwheel. Perjury is what was investigated. The perjury of an American President being sued by a private citizen for sexual harassment. And it was material to the case.

Why did the man simply not admit it?

"I'm the President. I got women throwing themselves at me all the time. They've seen what I'm married to--they feel my pain"

I would have loved that.

But he didn't. He decided to commit a crime. And that was the wrong decision.

[Silverwheel]

..."I'm the President. I got women throwing themselves at me all the time. They've seen what I'm married to--they feel my pain"

I would have loved that...

Not as much as you loved what did happen, I'd bet.

[Flon]

...and it has never been entirely clear to me what the person hoped to accomplish by the act other than childish shock value.

Well done! You admit you don't understand and yet you judge - in the same sentence!

...and I'm the one being judgmental?

OK. I thought what I was saying was pretty clear, but maybe I need to clarify a bit more for some people. I have been involved working for many causes - anti-war, environmental, reproductive rights, poverty relief and as part of that have been involved in marches and demonstrations. Occasionally, someone pulls out a flag (or sometimes a cross, or some other symbol that some people would find significance in) and burns or otherwise desecrates it. My thoughts go "Oh shit! Hours of work I and others put in down the drain. News outlets looking for something to report that doesn't involve all that hard thinking about the actual cause are going to put this front and center. The dork who did this gets the attention he is obviously seeking and thousands of the very people who are the targets of the action, fence-sitters who need to be educated and engaged, now connect this cause with an action they find repugnant. Great."


Suppose we are talking about an anti-war rally. How many people are educated about the social costs of the war and the propaganda used to promote it by the flag burning? None. How many people are encouraged to research things for themselves and are given the tools to do that? None. How many people are given an excuse not to have to do the uncomfortable thinking about what they have been supporting and just label the whole cause as just a bunch of people that hate America? More than enough.

To me the flag is little more than a rather gaudy piece of cloth and I feel that burning it imbues it with more significance than it deserves, but there are many that feel otherwise. I have never heard one of these flag wavers say "Gosh, seeing that flag burned has risen my consciousness and shown me the triviality of my nationalism". In fact it always has the opposite effect. So exactly what is the point of burning a flag?

[lurker]

Not as much as you loved what did happen, I'd bet.

What? The craptastic 'impeachment'? What a joke.

If they couldn't end it with getting him out of office, why start? It was an exercise in how to look bad.

I didn't vote for Clinton, but that wasn't his fault--it was Gores'. Tipper, to be precise. I watched the PMRC fiasco and I was appalled.

But what gets me about it the most is that Republicans are always the ones getting knocked for things like censorship and suppressing free speech.

I will grant that I see church groups and people on the right railing against all kinds of things that get their puritan granny panties in a twist--but its' Democrats and people on the left I see getting these things codified into law--they may come about it in a different direction, but the effect is the same--except that I'd rather listen to some bible thumper whining about sin than hear a cop reading me my rights.

Tangent? Anyone else want a tangent? They're seedless...

[Silverwheel]

...and I'm the one being judgmental?

Yep. To label their attempt at shock value as "childish" is judgmental and condescending as well. It just is - especially when a few words back you stated that you didn't understand their choice. It's good to admit that we don't understand something. It's less good to add value judgment and condescension to our admitted igornance.

I don't understand their choice either - but I'll reserve judgment until I do. I guess from your last post that your dislike of such gestures hinges on how much more difficult you feel that it makes your efforts at accomplishing the social change you seek. Perhaps protests would be more effective if we could just all protest the same way. Have you thought that through?

[Simon of the Playa]

what does George W. Bush think about Roe vs. Wade?



ans: he does'nt give a shit HOW the darkies got out of New Orleans.


ba dum dum.



"republicans happen."

[Rolan Headon]

A special specialty, coming in at the end of dead threads...which should annoy no one:
My life partner has a pair of red, white and blue flag panties. If she wears them all week, would it be alright if we burn them?
Seriously, you know flags will be burned, the media will jump all over it, it will play prominently on FOX (Fascist Obnoxious Xenophobes) news, the nation will hate us...hopefully it won't effect the event permits. By the way, respect for those who've given life and limb to the ideal of freedom, misguided as that can be, is only common decency, be a little careful of hardening the hearts of good people?
The hippies implied grandma couldn't know shit and fell too much for the "good versus evil" viewpoint of George Simpleton Bush.
Burning flags is ok by me (a strong image seared into my mind is a memory of a giant fireworks flag burning on the high school football field at a 4th of July celebration in my hometown in Redneck county, California), my favorite personal eplaya squib is the woman who says "If you love something, set it on fire."
Starting to think next year could be interesting

[Simon of the Playa]

how tempting would a gigunda flag, bigger than the perkins ones, be?

(editors note, perkins is an east coast corporate diner that distinguishes itself by mounting MASSIVE flags at all of their locations)

would a whole cadre of Paul Addisites seek to get to it?


and how cool would it be to GREASE the flagpole every day?


if they want it, they're gonna have to EARN it....

[erri2000]

I wonder what Jasper Johns would say?

[Simon of the Playa]

burn em' if you got em'.....

[Simon of the Playa]

forgive me, i was incorrect....the term is not Addisites, but actually according to the B.A.T.F , the BRC
Post Office, and The US State Dept., is "Addisstanistas"...

The Opposition group, known as the "Cuntras' are being funded secretly by the ghost of Ronald Reagan, who apparently according to most Republican Presidential Candidates, is alive and well and living in their groins.


i expect before this whole thing shakes out, "Bud" McFarlane will have taken another 75 valiums in a futile attempt at suicide, and Admiral Poindexter will be forced to resign, go to jail, get out, and become head of some other agency, again.

[Toolmaker]

Personally, if it meant that I could have a return to the growing economy and general prosperity of the Clinton administration, and give back the tanking economy, assault on civil liberties, and worldwide disgust with the new Amerika, then I would happily check off a box on my tax return to give a dollar to the Presidential Hooker Fund - and consider it a bargain.

Sigh. One consenting adult sucked off another one. A sane country would have said, "So what?" and laughed at the puritanical Republican apparatchik that suggested that they make use of it.

One of the reasons I would vote for Hillary is the hope that she'd tag Bill for SecState, and start turning our worldwide reputation around.

I see so many things wrong with these "facts" its not even funny.

Seriously Silver.. do you actually believe this?

I am a machinist and a toolmaker, being in manufacturing I saw firsthand what the result of CLINTON passing NAFTA and GATT. During the CLINTON administration more manufacturing work went to Mexico, Canada, China etc than any other president in my working lifetime. Granted I didn't start working until Reagan so I can't really speak on JFK et al. CLINTON ruined my ability to prosper, now I have to compete with China and Mexico. And don't give me the CLINTON mantra on globalism and the new world order, I've heard CLINTON promote the new world order enough. As far as assault on civil liberties goes.. again CLINTON did a bang up job with Waco, free speech zones, etc etc. And lets not forget 8 years or Iraq, he had 8 years to change Iraq for the better.. instead they kept them down the best they could. Oh yeah lets not forget all the other wars he kept going and the handful of new ones CLINTON started.

Funny how when anyone want to talk Clintonista they only want to talk about a blowjob and perjury. Nobody wants to talk treason. Clinton is no different than Bush. Clinton damaged the country MORE than any other president in history yet instead of reading the laws that were passed or following the money and votes everyone thinks blowjob.

Nice to know educated folks are voting for more of this kind of fascism. Mark my words.. the next president in office will make Clinton and Bush look like the best we ever had. Wait till you see what the Dems have in store for Iraq.. you'll have to catch it on youtube though. Democrats are really good at keeping the stuff off of TV.

[wedeliver]

Interesting idea Silver - I wasnt around when JFK made RFK attorney General but could imagint the cries of nepotism then as well. JFK was a lot more amorous in office than clinton I hear so maybe Bill would be a viable option.

all I know is that my business was doing far better under Clinton than Bush. 9/11 blows. but is so convoluted and mired in controversy - who knows

later

The way I remember it, JFK brought in his brother to be Attorney General to fight the mob (mafia). Organized crime was their target and I always thought that is what killed them both.

[Paul Kemp]

[quote="BAS"][quote="Toolmaker"]PS Enjoy the freedoms that flag gives you while you have em. Pretty soon most folks won't be able to voice the opinions you are permitted to voice now. Than you'll friggin wish you paid more attention to folks like Thomas Jefferson, Jello Biafra, Noam Chomsky, Michael Parenti, Howard Zinn, and dozens of others I won't bother to list since many flag burners won't know who the fuck they are.[/quote]

Jello Biafra! That's the name I couldn't recall when I was working on my list of who I probably should contact WRT to my pro-flag burning camp!

BTW, the only name which doesn't ring any bells for me is Michael Parenti. (Although, having just looked him up, I think I have heard his positions.)


FWT, most burnings of the U.S. flag take place overseas, places not much effected by U.S. laws.



B.[/quote]

I think I like you.

[Silverwheel]

Seriously Silver.. do you actually believe this?

Just tell me when that little checkbox is on my 1040.

[Bob]

Burn monks, not flags.

[Simon of the Playa]

ahhhhh....extra crispy....

[Silverwheel]

Bob, Simon - that was disgusting. If it was intended as a joke it was in extremely poor taste. Have you known any Buddhist monks? I have. They're nice people.

[thirt33n]

crispy nice is tastier than crispy mean

[Simon of the Playa]

evidently according to the chinese press, the Dalai Lama and the Monks are Jackals.


mean nasty jackal monks....yup...


The Dalai likes to bite the heads off of puppies too......yup...


damn dalai clique....jackals and all...


(ans yes silverwheel, it was in extremely poor taste, but in MY mind crossed the line from ridiculous into sublime)

[mdmf007]

I wonder what Jasper Johns would say?

He would probably say where'd Alaska and Hawaii go?

[ZEFEX]

Im not going to be burning any flag, but if i see any burner get harassed for burning a flag or wearing a flag somebody gonna go to sleep. I am not there to take away anyones freedom or stand by and see it happen to anyone else. Hurt no one and take away no ones freedom, these are words to die for.

It is better to die fighting on your feet than live like a coward on your knees. Live Free or Die.

If you aren’t part of the solution, you ARE part of the problem.

[thirt33n]

....did you make all those up yourself?

gosh, that was like a sardine tin of strength quotes.


you forgot, "don't tread on me" or "I know why the caged bird sings"

and "don't bite the dick that fucks you, honey."

[Kinetik V]

and "don't bite the dick that fucks you, honey."

CAUTION: Marginally NSFW!

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iepCR_QFNMA&feature=email[/youtube]

[ZEFEX]

[quote="thirt33n"]....did you make all those up yourself?[/quote]

Dont be stupid.

of course i did.

I also wrote the song.

[TomServo]

I'm not opposed to flag burning, but maybe it should be done in the privacy of your coleman tent...Please? I get sick when the Republicans use this fucking non-issue to sway public..but, get equally sick when left wingers and others give them the satisfaction, by making jackasses of themselves. I hate my government, but I love my country...and the flag..however gaudy represents my country just as much as it represents all the evil shit our public servants do around the world. Were running in circles with this flag burning shit. Give it a rest!